Finally, we got a chance to talk about the Red Bull Hardline controversial river gap jump. Do you think we’ll see this feature back in 2025?
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I know we’ve just yeah we skipping around a little bit people obviously online thinking that the Gap jump might have been too big what I don’t know but it definitely got people’s attention yeah I mean what is what what is it that makes Hardline different to a World Cup track in your opinion track or event track as an as an event as a track what is it that makes it makes those two things yeah events different what was cool actually so the night before the videos came out um of of well the one of Jim flying um I was with Brendan and I was with Brendan at the same time as Craig Evans and Sam hawel came into a place and it was so sick to see like all three of them straight away like have you seen the jump have you seen the jump have you seen the jump I’m going to guess that at a World Cup the athletes aren’t that hyped and they’re not as yeah I don’t know if the word nervous I’m not too sure but like just yeah excited to go like see something watch something and go ride something so Hardline is an event that comes with weight doesn’t it I guess so it’s like the course is it’s a big part of it is it yeah the course there’s a major part of it for sure you know it’s challenging you’re going to see like Riders really pushing their limits I know I know they do at World Cup but it’s in a very different way yeah does that make sense I I think it’s really interesting because at a World Cup you go such a ridiculous Pace down a track that that more that is ridable right that is like ridable to a wider audience okay especially recently they’re B parked you could go ride tomorrow and you literally can you can go to Le gang and you can ride the bike park yeah whereas Hardline that so that’s how it differs it’s like the speed is what makes a World Cup track dangerous Hardline it is the course so everything is about the course such a good point yeah course we we that I think we can all agree on as like as like fans of what makes Hardline amazing is the course yeah and it almost puts the Riders on an even bigger pedestal yeah I think so it does put same as Rampage absolutely you see like a Motorway section at the end of a World Cup and it’s like yeah it’s really cool you see seeing someone go as fast as they can over jumps that are like that you can ride in a bike park it’s really cool to see M it’s cool to see the best in the world ride something that you can also ride it’s also cool to see the best in the world be the best of the world be the best in the world yeah it is isn’t it 100% so Hardline I was Mega hyped for the new section of track yeah I was as well and I think um obviously the internet you said before like got it canceled in a way yeah so I I think the internet cancelled that jump okay you think it got 2024 I think the internet did I think and why do you think it was just a PR nightmare for Red Bull should anything happen or well it’s interesting isn’t it because um okay let’s look at Tasmania and let’s look at Wales yeah so Tasmania Dave McMillan had a really really big crash testing the last jum the last jumps yeah so obviously his crash was awful he was um rushed off to hospital um really bad feeling around it everyone was worried the jump was these are big jumps you’re pushing the limits this it happens it goes wrong it’s really hard to work out there’s no footage of this crash either yeah there’s load but it doesn’t it’s not nice to put out so it’s not like yeah it’s for Dave to put out whenever he wants I don’t know if he will it’s not crashes aren’t actually nice like no especially if you know you know the bloke’s not out all his teeth and broken his femur and all of those things yeah um but it didn’t get released Before the Race So then the testing the jump was altered and the race went ahead and I don’t think there are any complaints about the course there weren’t people saying it was irresponsible it was still the it was still pushing the boundaries of what’s possible on a mountain bike but no one was on a high horse in the comments were they no I didn’t see anything for sure I don’t know because it might be because these are the events that reach a broader audience than anything but I don’t think there’s many people in the comments saying they shouldn’t be doing this this is irresponsible yeah it’s true skip to Hardline Wales yes what happens what happens you got three studs testing a jump yeah and two out of three made it the third guy obviously got booked and and ejected um so testing that’s testing yeah testing is about information it’s about like Gathering what you need to do to make it right yeah and they worked out the radius wasn’t it was too much of a tight radius and and like yeah it did it did look at it did look it from my arm chair well exactly from a rectangle that I can barely see it looked like a from a weird angle from a weird angle it looked like it was too kicky and like everyone agrees it’s too kicky the guy who built the lip would agree it’s too kicky you know what I mean everyone who’s tried it will agree so do you feel like if the internet didn’t well you know people if if the comment sections weren’t so rif the jump would have stayed in if if Jim Monroe had have made that jump everything would have just carried on and it would have been in do you think it would have or or the conspiracy theory was it just a publicity stunt and it was never going that way anyway and it was just a case of drumming up I don’t believe that I don’t I’m just saying I’m just I don’t believe that I don’t think I think ultim what whatever happens happens they make the smartest decision on the day if it was my event I wouldn’t I wouldn’t have after the hooa surrounding that jump I wouldn’t have run it either if it was my event I wouldn’t have run it right you’d have taken that jump out yeah because how you you can’t after that many armchair Warriors know best yeah you can’t it almost give them the opportunity to be correct you have to you have to react it’s like m it’s such a strange thing it’s like open Forum isn’t it it’s like everyone can just say their opinion and what does anyone know about what does anyone know about 70 foot wooden Canyon caps not a not much N I think uh obviously that when we seen all that footage too and the Vlogs and stuff from Matt and Bernard it wasn’t as far as I know it wasn’t finished there was still going to be a safety net absolutely there probably still be a guard rail at the side do I want to do it no do I want to see the best in the world jump it probably yeah it’ be it’ be amazing spectacle yeah hey we’ll see but also like sorry I think we spoke about this before but like you you test jumps the size of the jump wasn’t the issue was it it was the P perception of the jump with the canyon and the the scaffolding and and it looked quite aggressive like that’s right yeah they’re already jumping more than 70 aren’t they and that’s that’s a lovely run in yeah ex because the jumps after are bigger yeah and faster yeah so yeah it’s really interesting isn’t it it is that’s by the way everything I’ve said is just my I could be completely wrong and it could be every Rider on that the com I know we’re a little bit behind what are we a month but it could be that every Rider on that start list said they didn’t want to do it after the um and they weren’t interested it could that could be the case I think every Rider on that start list wanted to not do the ankle breaker drop and probably would have preferred to have the modified bigger radius 70 footer I think probably that would have been um can we we talk about the stuff that Jamie said to me on that uh voice message yeah we can we’ll talk about it um so I think what’s interesting too is like as the the sports progressing so fast that you have this company Redbook putting the name to stuff that they are pushing the limits of sport in loads of other Sports not just mountain biking but my our friend Jamie Jamie scribby was on the podcast sent me a message saying that basically like x-f Fighters Red Bull pulled out of x-f Fighters because they didn’t want to put the name to something that was sport that was progressing that fast okay yeah it’s interesting to think that like they’re doing that with mountain biking now with with Hardline and Rampage and it’s like they it’s progressing fast you know to look at like the ’90s that came after that Canyon Gap two years ago they with a thing and all of a sudden we’ve moved on to that and it’s like it’s going to keep going yeah it’s interest interesting it’s like progression but also some like there has to be an element of safety right like it can’t just keep getting crazier and crazier it’s yeah I don’t know I don’t know who makes those decisions I think ultimately it’s just athlete Le and then the the thing is you’ve got a big corporation like so entwined in this sport that you can’t imagine you know Reed so it has to be bit of both doesn’t it it is interesting thing I can’t imagine that you go above 100 foot really and it’s something that’s just like repeatable every run I don’t know yeah I mean darkfest is certainly proven that you can make really big jumps really safe yeah like that course now is dialed and and it’s but yeah I I always find it funny because it of course it’s about Riders and about feeling people um when when we had that um when Brendan had his um Canyon at Rampage yeah people were like well the comments then were horrible I didn’t like it my mate was about to jump off it there was loads of really gnarly comments about how it was like irresponsible and oh really yeah yeah yeah and okay and it was about lad science and about they’ve done the numbers wrong on this and it’s like what do you think is going on when you do a jump it’s only about feeling you couldn’t look at a speedometer on a running imagine looking at a speed on the way in being like right okay the calculations are correct what they hitting like 90s at like 50 miles an hour or something like it’s bloody impressive man I’m not sure cuz we watched burnard’s Vlog together I don’t know how we haven’t ended up to talk about it but we haven’t it was so good to see how they go through and it it is thought out it’s not just the hit and hope like he’s analyzing all of it and it’s it’s best riders in the world bloody impressive so next time you write a little comment about how irresponsible it is yeah I don’t know it has an effect everything has it’s like Butterfly Effect yeah yeah for that’s just my opinion though and I could be completely wrong I just think that jump got 2020 forward I look forward next year I bet it’ll be back I bet it’ll be there yeah who knows yeah who knows okay okay hey man what an episode that was you did amazing in it and so did you you sha like a star you sha like a moon can we also put something up here that you can click on for the next episode how about we put a subscribe up there in the middle yeah we’re going to put a video we think that our lovely 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27 Comments
Unbeliveably lazy take that the jump got "canceled" from Olly.
The jump is great, but is it really a race line?
Such a good point about the difference between this and tasmania, if the footage of Jim's jump hadn't been released people wouldn't have got so butt hurt about it.
I think it just boiled down to the possible consequences not making it over the jump that made it what it was. With a safety net it is still nuts, but not life-threatening. But there was no word of a safety net when the instagram reels dropped.
As a PhD candidate in 60 Foot Wooden Canyon Jumps I can confirm most people know nothing about 70 foot wooden canyon jumps.
It should have been up to the riders to decide. Everyone else is just a spectator.
I think the issue was it looks shoddy and unfinished, it looked like the way it was built it would be tough to adjust the radius, the landing in Tasmania was at least 3 times wider so if it was the same landing and was a full dirt landing then it would have looked far safer and more appealing. There were other comments from some of the better riders I know about the lack of remorse or accountability shown on camera for how it turned out but we all know cameras don’t share the whole story.
I think it honestly comes down to the fact that if it was built to the same standard and quality as the rest of the course and things went wrong the reaction would have been completely different l, I’m sure it will make a return next year !
The dark fest riders World do it, easy! My opinion…
It was just rushed… That's it. They didn't have the net or the time to iterate the jump enough.
.
Plebs in the comment section believing they "know" what the best in the world can or can't do is fucking hilarious.
Ironically one guy almost went down that gully anyway after going over the berm! Saved it barely but for a moment… It looked hairy
Matt Jones nailed it .. the riders that knew , said it was the perspective not the distance. They all have jumped further .
This podcast is honestly just a bunch of yapping about nothing
For me, that jump seemed more dangerous than the Red bull rampage. If they came up short they were F'd into scaffold and steel! If the viewers don't want to watch riders put themselves to that sort of risk, I think you need to respect that. If you want to ride it off camera, go for it.
Please stop justifying and dwelling on the superb global MTB community – I have talked to multiple experienced riders and all agreed it was a good idea to remove it. I commented that same opinion before the internet blew up. We all want to see spectacular features but for me I wouldn't have wanted to see this one. If you're talking about the test jump being part of the process, even that test jump should've been designed way safer as even BK was close to miss the landing being blown left by the wind. For me more like 1 fail, 1 close to failing and 1 sketchy successful hit (Jones) = good call to remove it even without considering the "big nets" opinion. Peace!
I take issue with the derogatory way in which you speak about the viewers. Without a viewing audience, Hardline would be nothing, it probably wouldn't exist. So the audience has every right to an opinion and to express it if they wish.
Pro – "That jump was too kicky"
Public – "That jump looks too kicky"
"What do people know?"
Well, I think we just outlined that a good percentage know a jump looks too kicky. All they've done is point out the exact same thing experienced riders have pointed out. Where's the issue? Should it have been adjusted and tried again? 100%.
This was just a well executed PR stunt, cmon guys. It’s still working…..
I'm glad they're making something out of this jump but a net just kills the whole point of the jump. They should have never showed us this jump so qe never would have been let down when it was made worse.
I got the impression that much of the reason the entire section was removed was a lack of time. Besides the canyon gap, there was also the hip jump that led into it that BK casually mentioned he didn't even try to ride. At that point, I'm not sure there was enough manpower available to rework that jump and do the lip changes to the canyon gap jump at the same time and be finished in time for practice. I'm sure both features will be ready for the 2025 event.
go to london and build your mountain biking course out of scaffold there , Come to wales , we don't need that shyt . keep the sport closer to how everyone experiences it , Free ride .
As a viewer, please make the line softer if needed! Riders safety is no.1. concern, by far!
If they had put up a safety net instead of mats maybe it would of been alright.
It looked to me that it was never going to be part of the track, just used to drive hype and promotion for the race. There would be so many riders that either wouldn't risk it or their teams wouldn't allow them to do it that the line up would be lacking. Not to mention that a run in for it was never shown aside from dropping in just above the jump.
I'm thinking why the outcry and concern about the jump was the perceived consequences for failure were too high. It just seemed like needles danger just for spectacle. I, myself when I saw it thought, "There goes Redbull again, putting athletes at risk with an extreme spectacle just for shock and awe". We watch these events to be amazed, not to see rider's get injured or worse. As for me, my main concern was, sure 85% of the riders have no problem with the jump, but what about the 15% that aren't confident with it and don't want to do it but get peer pressured to hit it.
Sure I get it. I'm just an arm chair analyst that just can't fathom doing it because it's way beyond my abilities. But you got to understand, the concern was for the safety of the riders just for spectacle. Nothing more
i don't know about 70 foots jumps over canyons. what i do know about is dodgy AF scaffolding. that in a proper industry would never be allowed to happen. then you have no safety net or any protection to the actual scaffolding. let alone the tiny magin of error for the landing. with no run-off or other safety measurs for missed landing. yes i know it's testing, but the consequences of a crash in testing is the same as it is in a race. in F1 testing, all the medical precautions are still there because the consequences are the same. why were some dodgy mountain bike riders allowed to jump across a canyon with no safety measures?
The jump was built poorly to begin with. All transitions were too tight and violent. Sam Reynolds said it the first time he saw a photo of it, so it just amazes me that nobody else spotted it? Or maybe they did but BK being the absolute selfish tool that he is felt it was fine to risk everyone’s lives and said it was okay. Luckily Jim was fine and the jump was scrapped. Hardline is hardline but features still need to be built correctly and safely.
Why not add a net in the canyon?