PGA Tour rookie Raul Pereda joins Andrew to discuss his journey from the Latin America tour to getting one of the five coveted PGA Tour cards at Qualifying School last fall. Raul shares his experience navigating the stages of Q School and the critical shots in the final round that helped him secure his PGA Tour card for 2024. Raul talks about adapting to life and the competition of the PGA tour, from equipment changes to rounding out his skillset to compete against the best players in the world. Finally, Raul emphasizes the need to develop a love for the game and resilience, especially for junior golfers looking to follow in his footsteps.
In Angle of Attack (1:21:00), Andrew and Jim continue their discussion on the differentiating factors between shooting 78 vs. 76. In this episode, they discuss driving distance and some of the recommended tools and tactics for gaining club head speed and ball speed.
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Guest: Raul Pereda (@raulpdlh (https://www.instagram.com/raulpdlh) )
Andrew Lewis Golf: @andrewlewisgolf (https://www.instagram.com/andrewlewisgolf/) on Instagram
@drivengolfanalytics (https://www.instagram.com/drivengolfanalytics/) on Instagram; @golfdriven (https://twitter.com/golfdriven) on Twitter
Host: Jim Colton (@jcolton31 (https://www.instagram.com/jcolton31/) )
Producer: Joseph Kay (@joseph_kay (https://www.instagram.com/joseph_kay/) )
Music by: DG Beat Labs (@dgbeatlab (https://www.instagram.com/dgbeatlab) )
Special Thanks: (@golfcoachus (https://www.instagram.com/golfcoachus) )
[Music] what’s up golf friends this is Jim Colton and this is the driven golf podcast I’m here with my co-hosts and special interviewer Andrew Lewis what’s going on Andrew how right hey guys what’s up Jim we got a special episode uh this one uh episode 15 we have our first PJ tour pro as a guest Raul Pera PJ tour rookie you want to tell us a little bit about like Raul’s path to the PGA I think it’s pretty interesting yeah so I’ve been following rul for the past uh probably five years because I coached some guys that play against him and um it’s been it’s been fun to watch him he’s very very consistent player on the Latin America Tour which is now americaas and you know he’s one of those rare guys that um got to skip going to Corn fairy which we talk a little bit about on the Pod um because of his amazing run at Q school last year um getting through those three stages is very very rare and he has a really cool story of like how he how he really got through second and then um like it his back nine of the final day of round of uh stage three is just crazy so I mean you think if you think about it like he’s benefited from sort of just being being in the moment and playing you know great golf at the exact right time because if this had happened 12 months ago Q School didn’t exist right you know they they brought back the ability to get five cards um through the three stages of of Q school and he was one of the one of the five so he’s been you know playing in a handful of events so far this year just played in uh in San Antonio and Houston the previous week yeah I mean I honestly he’s has such a like a positive outlook and such like a pragmatic Outlook in terms of his golf game um his development and really just somebody who you just can’t help but root for I was just really enthralled by by your interview with him yeah now that we’ve met I mean I had not met him before but now that we’ve had the discussion he’s definitely like highlighted on my pj tour apps I was super pump he made the cut in Houston and yeah I totally agree like he knows exactly how he plays golf he definitely doesn’t play like you’d say maybe the typical way of just like bomb and gouch golf courses I mean he’s definitely more of a tactician just because he doesn’t hit it super far but he’s incredibly skilled um which I mean as we’ll talk about in the pot he chipped in twice on the back nine of of the last round of cull so he’s very very good at the things he’s good at um and I think he does have a chance of of definitely keeping his card which is going to be you know something to to see if that kind of happens for him I think one of the interesting things that I probably learned or just took for granted is just about how he’s had to like pivot his game as a PJ or to a rookie like the thing that got him there is not necessarily the thing that’s going to keep him there and I think he’s again taking just an honest pragmatic look about his game his equipment and you know the tools that the toolbox that he needs to be able to compete uh week in and week out on the PJ tour now that he’s playing you know against the world’s best yeah plus you know he’s playing all these places for the first time like that’s got to be a thing I mean I know down in Latin he played the same places so I kind of think that if he can figure that out and he gets to see these if he can get through this year that he’ll have a very very good next year because he’ll kind of know heading in we talk a little bit about just the difference going to different grass and different elevation and spin and things like that that he really hadn’t had to deal with um I mean somewhat in Latin America but nothing like the level they are on the PJ tour yeah and I think the interesting thing with some of the live departures uh he is the only PJ tour member from Mexico so he’s really representing uh a nation so maybe we have some new listeners uh to the podast right I hope so they should yeah that is really really cool yeah definitely listen to the end because there’s a little Easter egg at the end of this episode little bilingual Easter egg so little there is that’s right it is yes I remember so we also talk about for golfers uh who want to be where ra is today uh but now are maybe currently shooting in that 78 is range maybe like high school golfers last last episode we talked about some of the short game uh this episode we talk about driving distance and improving driving distance I saw this past week uh you did a little plug of for the stack uh little 118 I think I saw I mean the radar is broken but yes it did say 118 I hit the other day on track van and trackman does have the update but I think I got to 114 but maybe I was cruising because there was no ball there yeah I’ve got I’ve got some events coming up so I was like man I got to get I got to get my club head speed back up it’s definitely down I’m almost four I mean I got to be given attention to it so and I and and and I can also say like if I’m doing it and then everyone I coach isn’t then I can totally like roast them because they’re not even trying so there there’s your fair warning yeah I need to I’m I’m doing my best to try to keep up um you know I’m a decade older than you so so but anyways uh yeah with that this is episode 15 with r Pera I believe that you will be rooting for him just like we are after this episode such a such a great guy all right thanks Andrew [Music] yep R thanks for joining man welcome to the driven golf podcast thank you very much guys for inviting me it’s just uh such an honor to be here and uh we’ll keep it fun you know I’m I’m looking forward to this absolutely man so you know I know I know you I I’ve been following you for years I coach some guys that play Latin uh that was kind of your upbringing right in professional golf was to to start in Latin um so I’ve been paying attention to you you’ve beat you’ve been beating all the guys that I coach for years so if they’re listening I’m sorry let me let me hear some name well you know you know Jose Nero oh yeah you’ve known Jose forever forever you know we travel in in in nor America together for so long and every time I’m in Dallas I see him you know we text every day and when he doesn’t text me I’m like you bro what are you doing like I miss you you know you need to he’s busy he’s getting married and you know he got married he got married he got married uh he’s been canting at uh I think Dallas National or no or merido merido probid yeah merido um every time I call him he says oh I’m working now be like what type of work workouts are you doing I can see more fat rolls when you but I haven’t seen him in a while and then um I coach George ton George to nice George George had George had a good year last year he’s going to be playing um which I mean I’d love to get your thoughts on America’s tour versus Latin and Canada U yeah so he’s playing full schedule on that I think he’s fully exempt uh through the Latin swing um so yeah I know you I obviously you got a little bit of Pub um with going through Q school I mean that was I mean your chippin all of those things went viral so but um you know I I think a lot of our listeners because you’re a PJ tour rookie and they probably don’t pay attention necessarily to developmental tours like I do and like Jim probably does does um so I would love just to just to kind of you introduce us to you the golfer not necessarily from like day one but just kind of like what your golf like has looked like from like when you became like a competitive Junior um and I know you were a very very successful college player just kind of a a brief understanding of what that’s like and then secondly like when did you know that you could do this like and what was that what was that like sign that you knew that you could do this for a living well um I was just telling Fernando I I grew up playing the regional tournaments in Mexico and then the national events um then College um but to be honest I was a late bloomer um really okay I I developed a good understanding of the game um through college and my coach or my old coach I got to understand the swing and the Dynamics so much better you know I know what everything happens and know what you know what the movements do on your swing sometimes it’s just hard to fix yourself when you don’t have eyes behind you that is telling you okay it looks like this but it doesn’t look like that or it doesn’t feel like that you know you know how those things look and feel is so much different um but then I think my junior year I got so much better uh with the team junior year of of college yes um we got to Nationals first first time ever in the program I think we made it to aals we play at Rich haris Farms um you went to Jacksonville correct I did yeah Jacksonville University and then my senior year probably was one of the years that I enjoyed golf the most you know it’s not that I don’t enjoy it now of course I enjoy what I do but it was a year that I it felt like I was just walking in a field of daisies you know it’s just that I’ve never done that i’ never know it’s just such a peaceful year me and I played I don’t remember how many events I played that year but I think I hit I might have finished seven top 10 that year wow in my junior my senior year I was first alternate for H Palmer cup and you know of course I couldn’t be more or high in higher in the rankings because of sometimes the strength of our schedule wasn’t the best so right you know you can compete with Gardner web one week and next week with UF of course the where UF is in is going to give you more points than where Garner web is in you know nothing against Garner web but just saying um when did I really think that this was a a chance uh when I was 17 before going to college I I I I got invited to play a pro event of the Mexican professional tour then um in pbla just where I play my regional events and everything uh and I won I won that event first amateur ever to do so in Mexico uh um and I think well I remember vividly that I told my mom mom not going to college this is so easy I’m going to turn pro and she was like it is so easy kid you’ve got so much to learn you’re going to college don’t even try you know so I went to college and I don’t regret it that was the best four years of my life so was your like what was your recruiting process like were your was your door being knocked down by a bunch of collegers or was Jackson pretty much your own a few of them um so I did I came to golf school here in Florida in Jacksonville first time I did like three weeks in the summer the next summer I came back for like six weeks the next summer I came back for like seven or eight weeks and then I stayed six months after that that that was my full semester of my senior year of high school I got recruited by Minnesota UF UCF UNF a lot of Florida schools yeah uh I really wanted to go to UF not going to lie that was my dream school I always wanted to stay in Florida I started the process with Buddy Alexander uh but then they sort of didn’t keep up with it you know and then the coach from Jackson Le University Mike Blackburn he came and visit me to the academy where I was uh practicing and you know he did like a little interview and he liked my profile so they took me to visit campus like un non-official visit said I really like the campus then like two weeks later I went back with my brother and my sister-in-law and we loved it then again I I took a ride from a friend and then I went and visit the campus on my own I’m like it’s pretty obvious that I really like it here so yeah I committed to go there on December 2013 very very committed then I you know this happens June 2014 just before going I won that event as a professional and and I was like college is going to be great I’m going to love it I was so positive about it after my mom said that I was not turning professional um and to be honest I I really thank my mom that she made me go to college you know that’s where I think I develop everything for my game before you know just all the maturing that I did in college from not being able to wake up at 600 or 5:30 for workouts learning that everyone would get pen if someone was late so everyone would have to pay for your responsibility and then just how to manage your time through the years on how to write your essays how to go to class how to be able to work out do your practice do your homework do study hall hours everything you know how to make up for the classes that you didn’t go it’s just amazing and I would do it again you know I don’t tell this to anybody I hate this school everyone does but I would do it again just because it teaches you so much more than your classes you know you become a better person you become a better athlete you become a better human being you are that 1% better if you are determined to be that 1% better you know you will always find somewhere or a part in your life where you can be better you know it’s just from going to bed at 9: instead of going to bed at 10:30 that made a difference and you know then I was able to wake up easier at 5: so I can go to workouts and then I was able to in between classes or when I had a couple hours breaks I would I would be able to maybe work on my putting for like 30 40 minutes and those was those were the 30 or 40 minutes I was not able to put after my practice because it was getting dark early so you always find time to do something oh you would start your assignments before they even ask you and you go go ahead so whenever you have to you know submitted you didn’t have to stress over like oh the due dat is tomorrow and I have you know 15 pages to write still so I’m just gonna copy paste everything and hope that they don’t notice it they notice there was no chat GPT back then either no there was no chat GPT but for sure what I learned also not that you would have used it not that you would have done that I would have I would have done that my computer I would have done it but to be honest I got to learn that professors are not there to make you fail you know there’s some professors that don’t like athletes for sure you know because we miss so much school professors are there to help you you just got to be humble enough to go ask for their help but we’re so stubborn when we’re growing up and we’re teenagers still 19s 18s that oh we we we feel that we ruled the world and we know it all and still we feel like that way sometimes where we we are men that’s what makes gol sometimes good we were like that uh you know we’re still stubborn in things and it’s not like that sometimes it’s just sometimes it’s fun to say I don’t know or can you help me or yeah I was wrong you know and I keep I keep getting those things you know uh with my caddy we we have those conversations like I’m never gonna beat you in an argument right I’m like NOP we’ll tie but you’re never gonna beat me yeah right right right yeah you’re the boss yeah so you know when you when you said that you were a late bloomer I’d like to just talk about that for a second did you do you mean from like a size standpoint or just performance maturity I never I think more on performance and golf I was very consistent but I never won you know I was not the big winner I never won in college I won a couple of national Advance couple of you know Regional events I never won in Latin America um I’ve won tournaments as a professional I won two in the Mexican professional tour I won the Tampa open I I’ve won a handful of of them never one on Latin America I finished second I finished third I finished fourth I finished fifth I finished sixth seventh eth ninth 10th you know I think the last two years in Latin America I had so many top 10 yeah you did every week it seemed like almost every week almost every week that I made they caught I finished top 10 so I was like you know one day that I catch fire I’m GNA win and that tournament that I cut some fire on the greens that was a pro open you know going to the last round of course you’re nervous of of course you’re you know I haven’t been in that position so many times because I’ve always come from behind and I remember I start I bird the first three holes and I’m like yeah boy I got this today it’s my day and then he goes and you know birdies one and three then he Eagles six birdies seven eight nine 10 and all a sudden I’m like four back again I’m like okay I’m playing for second place you know and that’s when that’s when I started also I’m not being negative but I’m being realistic realistic for sure because he’s someone difference between those two things yeah yeah he’s someone’s got the experience he’s been out there for so many years he played on corn fairy tour he’s played PJ tour events he’s played Asian tour whatever and I knew he had it under control so unless I Eagle 16 birdie 17 and 18 I was not going to catch him and I shot I want to say I shot 18 under or 16 under he shot 22 I’m like you got to put your hands up and just say hey good job man yeah that’s what I’m saying I was a late bloomer because I never I never won I I i’ I’ve won in every tournament that I’ve won I’ve never win by one you know is when you catch some heat on the greens or you don’t miss shots and you hold out from like just off the green and you win by three or four but never never really just one online America I think that was something that I really wanted to do that was so stressful because for me I thought that was an answer to my prayers to win but I think that the Latin America Tour taught me so much more than winning you know it’s just it’s just about just enjoying all those weeks on the road you know being able to play good for days being able exactly being able to be time You’ done that right yeah so being able be more consistent in your scores and be so disciplined on where are you going to hit the ball you know try not to be a hero I was telling Fernando not to be fair not to pull out those hero shots because you’re probably going to hit two out of 10 and to be honest when that’s just something that in my opinion social media has Distortion for us a lot because everything we see in social media are the perfect are the good shots or the perfect rounds that they hit you know PJ tour and yeah you saw Rory to they have it seven deep but yeah two balls in the water too exactly yeah and you see those things in the water because he was a feature group and this and so whatever still shot Seven under but he hit some average shots out there yeah for sure but his average is oh I flirted right and I still have 16 feet or 20 feet to the Green Oh to the pin or to the hole when we flirted R and we are chipping from 30 yards you know yeah so that’s the difference when they’re when they’re the best and their both St at their best I’ve noticed that their misses are just you know they’re going still make a 25f footer pot and they make it ready what is that like though back to the Latin America Tour so you’re playing with guys that are chasing it so as you’re playing the Latin tour and you’re finishing top five top 10 is that starting to give you a sense that you are going to grab uate from this to Corn fairy the PJ tour like were you surprised as at what happened based on how you were doing or did it feel like that was kind of out of nowhere I was not surprised but it was definitely I pulled the Mexican trick and I skipped the line through corn fery yeah right so um I I do want to talk I do want to talk about Q SC in detail but yeah keep going I did see myself going through corn faery to be honest um I did see myself getting through second stage or going to finals you got to remember I don’t know if you follow enough or back in the day where I finished I think after covid that year I finished 11th I needed to finish I saw that tith tithe for six or better no tithe for fifth are better in the last event to finish top 10 and I finished tith to get to finals yeah and I finished top 10 on top 10 on the develop mod tours yeah at least it did you get it took you to finals and then the following year I needed TI for fourth or better and I finished fifth so I was like getting so desperate about things because I was so close but I missed so many cuts and the tournaments where I didn’t miss the cuts I finished high but then I was like the last year I was like if I finished 11 and I finished 25th it is exactly the same thing it’s giv me so I’m not going to too much of a I’m not going to put too much weight on my shoulders to have the high finishes Because unless I finish 10th finishing 24th or 25th is the same thing so what I did is I try to make the cut at every event because I always thought you know if I’m G to have those two or three High finishes then I need the extra points where I didn’t make the cuts yeah and I sort of did I think I’ve missed three cuts of the tournaments of the whole year and but but I made the cut at tournaments that I have never made the cut but one thing went different and then I got to play DJ tour last year and I play Lights Out you know I I was able to hold out from 250 yards I hit a I went viral yeah I shot a bogey free round on my first round on the PJ tour 66 you know I was tied for second then I was I think I got to be like tight for second with 27 holes to play then of course thought thoughts and things got in my head and I don’t regret finishing 60 I don’t at all but the fact that I was able to navigate those Waters and feel so comfortable out there then I was like then I’m ready for this or I’m prepared for when this time comes then I got to second stage and everyone listened to this everyone has asked me why do you always go to California and not play in Florida when you live in Florida I’m like s everyone goes to Florida and Florida it’s a place where you have to shoot so low because so just to reset for the listeners so you were exempt through first stage because you finished high enough on the Latin America money list and so you went to Valencia California where historically the scores are pretty high relative to some places in Florida where you got to shoot like 10,00 to make it through so you’ve gone to Valencia the last few years I actually I went to Val Valencia last year the past Valencia was was the first time in a while I went to be Creek in yeah in California which good golf course B striking golf course but that course could be a little not rewarding for B good bow strike still you know then I saw Valencia and I’m like this course has this course has never been played for Q School it’ll be a new test for everyone except for the you know local California players then like I’m signing out for for there you know I’m going to get dibs on my side because I made it through and I you know I was able to skip through first which is nice and the weather will be cold greens will be firm and you don’t have to be super low and I knew one day had to be horrible weather and it was well four days of cold weather and in the last round it blew so hard that the cut moved for 4 under to E or one under yeah so let’s go to 4 under let’s go to the last day right so walk us through your last day for those that don’t know you made it through on the number yeah and you’re talking about you know Mitchell missing a putt or somebody making a putt to knock you out you got your ultimate like repayment because what happened because Alex Alex Chella double bogey bogey bogey last few the door to get you in yeah you advance a final but what was that like sitting there you’re finished and you know that your your hopes and dreams rely on how somebody else is going to play you you know I was first of all I had a horrible summer I had a horrible summer where I put my clubs in the garage for two months and I didn’t want to touch a club I played so much Golf and I feel like I didn’t get anywhere M I was I was defeating myself so hard I was bitting myself up and it’s just a stressful man it’s just a stressful to be out there and shooting 10 under every week and I’m oh great I finished 15th now I shoot 10 under and I finished TI for 42nd you know when I make a little bit more money yeah yeah yeah right right right but um I told myself that it’s it’s always that thought of what’s going to happen if I don’t make it through what am I going to do next year is it going to be my last year where am I going to get the resources from Once I was able to be 100% convinced on if I didn’t make it it didn’t matter I was just going to try again a lot of things got better in my head yeah because that’s what it is if you don’t it’s like if I don’t make birie on hole one I’m gonna turn birie hole two if I don’t bir hold two I’m going turn four you know whole three and it’s just like a boxing fight you know you get eight 18 rounds where you’re gonna hit or you’re gonna get hit yeah right and that’s what golf is you get 18 rounds of a fight every day and you’re gonna get hit no matter what and it could be not a bogey but you could be having to make a 15 footer for par or you know hitting one in the rough and the ball is sitting down you know that’s getting hit yeah bad break and you see you think that oh I got hit cuz I made triple boy yeah well you got hit twice one hole that’s what that’s what I call that um you know I I got to California JP the guy that cting for me today he went with me and I love how much he knows about golf he played at uh aen back in the day he C it for Bobby Diaz for a while he’s C it for Abraham aner he’s C it for Camilo Vias he’s got the experience in the bag you know he didn’t really have to know the course or my game enough to just navigate me through that round and yeah I’ve made some mistakes I wasn’t making anything I didn’t make really anything I was not spinning the ball enough I was hitting the driver like crap but I was able to keep it in front of me you know I I I only struggle hitting the driver on the 18th hole and that was I heard that part five was just ridiculous yeah but that was every round because I didn’t have enough spin to cover the first bunker so the first day I flirted right second day I flirted right and the next two days I FLIR I pull it left left in in in in the rough and actually the last round the te’s were up and I’m like downwind of the ride I’m like perfect I’m going to ride the win and I’m going to send it all the way down so I can probably push for you know I needed the very last hole to feel like yeah your mine you’re thinking I got to I got to make four so I snapped cooking and I put it in the furwood bunker on number one yeah I was against the lip and I’m like perfect H but that last round I knew he told me the best players are the best players when they play when they come to play when they have to play I don’t know if if if you guys can catch yeah that makes sense yeah know they show up to play when they need to yeah and it was blowing like 25 that day cold and we knew that it the the number was not going to get lower it was just going to get higher I didn’t have to do anything EXT inary to just getting contention uh I think I was like a couple under or one under or a few holes I was playing with sang Bay he withdrew after nine ironic because he was 3 under through four and then he got a couple double bogeys that was for me the best example of like I quit trying without knowing what it could happen you know and I was one under made bogey finished even par but he was a couple under he made a double bogey he was one over through nine I’m sure that when he saw the leaderboard he thought he was end he was like what did I do I could have just made two birdies or one birdie and I would have been fine to go to finals and to be honest I knew that if I got it through finals or if I got through second stage going to finals was was just home game for me yeah know right so I was lucky enough I want to say it I was lucky enough that Alex Trella made those mistakes coming in and I got through then I was like I felt so comfortable in that situation windy wet tied courses you had to really hit it good and really hit in the Fairway at final stage at final stage yeah you know dice Valley it’s a little more straightforward suers Country Club can get dicey yeah wind impact is so much more that the valley course and I know those courses like the back of like the palm of my hand you know I played them so many times during college I played them so many times after college I felt like out of the entire field of finals I had the most rounds in those courses I want to say so so I never really stressed over those rounds um I felt anxious for sure going in the last round of uh Q school because I knew that my round was going to be determined by how and where I hit my driver on the first hole because you were so more than anxious I was just excited to go out to play because I was so I was playing so good and we had a full day off because of the weather that’s right we had to a we had a Monday finish um and I hit this mid trajectory baby draw and I’m like oh boy you boys hold tired because I’m coming home I’m coming home in the daisy field I laid up in the first hole in the par five to up maybe 10 yard fway right in the middle of it to 115 yards I’m like back pin soft greens a perfect stock 54 wedge for me and I ear the green I’m like okay you’re a little Jack right now adrenaline you’re going to learn about adrenaline now yes yeah so I made a good up and down and then I kept on going I bir three bir five and I I was 200 under through yeah you were cruising right yeah and I’m like great then I hit one in the water on six and I’m like man I hope this doesn’t become a disaster because that hole is so hard then I had to drop in the middle of the Cross bunker to like 280 yards of course you droing the bunker you’re not going to get a good plug right y so it’s pluged so I I I popped one up and I still had like 170 yards I hit about 40 feet and I’m like fighting in my head saying Raul don’t try to make it don’t try to make it don’t try to make it like it like it like it like it two get out of here yeah I did that perfect that’s great going to eight I flirt one right hit the car but go out of bounds and I’m like you got to be kidding me why back to back you know all the week I hit my perfect draw and out of these two shots so what let’s pause what are you saying because again going back to what you were saying earlier like what people what people see on TV is they think that you guys don’t hit bad shots and here you are telling me you just hit one left now you blocked one right OB your wheels are spinning and I think that people think that that just doesn’t happen right but I always of course that happens but the reason that you’re on the PJ tour is you are a able to deal with the adversity better than everybody else so like what are you like honestly what what conversation are you having in your head and with your caddy in that moment my caddy was like my C my coach caddy for me that day uh what that tournament finals he is Swedish his feelings are like nothing Z perfectly level and when I hit in the water he was just giving me the best advice word to drop and you know the best line and what to do not to compromise any more shots and just yeah beautiful suck it up on that double Bogey and then is what it is move on the next hole it was a loose swing it was bad luck that it hit the carpath and went out of bounds um yeah that’s good perspective yeah again I knew the course I knew the conditions and I knew that there were so many opportunities out there yeah for birie but the greens were so soft too that people were going to stress on not making pots know I weighed 143 lbs and I was living dents on the greens so you can imagine everyone heavier than me so yeah um you know I was you know on on seven after I hit that one out of bounds knocked it to four feet made my Bogey and that is momentum for me yeah even boy that is momentum you know then that’s when the fun begins when you’re the back nine on the this is yeah this is this is what started getting social media right so you’re you’re in a good position what you like you’re around like sixth I think I was tied for after those two buggies I was like one out yeah which for those listening getting top five you get your PJ tour card correct so nine holes to go I mean how amazing is that like the whole thing your whole year you’re at you’re sitting with n holes to go with a chance to earn your BJ tourk cart are you are you are you thinking about that at all like line of laying an egg and becoming a superhero yeah are you able to block those thoughts out or you kind of like embracing like let’s go this is what I’ve been wanting my whole life both I think I think I was able to embrace a lot of things block a lot of things but then I was able to have you know when you’re walking from tea to green or sorry from one green to the next tea you have those two minutes of like oh man you’re getting closer no you can you can feel the you can feel the taste you can taste it already and it’s just that is so amazing to feel but it’s such a wrong thing to feel you know that’s just anxiety that is just getting ahead of yourself and that’s when it com I’m saying such a fine line because things could have gone South for me and I could have said I had it and I let it go and I would have beat myself so hard even though I had full corn Fair status because I had it in my hands and let it go right yeah but again I knew the back nine like my like the palm of my heart and I think that’s what kept me calm knowing the opportunities out there and those that don’t know you you go you proceed to chip in twice yeah in a couple holes I chipped on I chipped in on 10 which it was you know I hit on the left rough which is perfect to a back left pin I’m like okay I may catch a flyer but let’s not play for the flyer and I had a little mud so I went mud B mud ball it went left but it ended up being a little teed up Dow grain and I’m like perfect I can be aggressive in this chip and I know it’s going to turn left and it’s gonna hit a soft bounce if I hit it with my 54 or my 50 and it’s just GNA release all I got to do is read it the right way read it like a putt and you made it and I made it unbelievable at this point like what what is the anxiety level relative to playing second stage Latin America event is is it the same is it harder to control your thoughts and emots or you feel like you felt pretty comfortable at this point well 10 11 12 13 14 I felt pretty comfortable then you get to 16 and then when the roller coaster begins a little bit but that’s that’s when I was able to embrace it the most and again I just kept repeating myself and I was so calm saying it doesn’t matter if you don’t make it it doesn’t matter that’s when I I would think I was able to free it up my swing um plus I knew I didn’t have to hit it far because the ball was not rolling anywhere so he’s I was not going to gain 15 20 yards a roll and nobody’s getting anywhere with the wind so you know I just had to play I had to play chess so then I missed the green 14 and if you could have seen that live is this the one on the up slope that you chipped that was a terrible liot you made a huge divot my cad and I were like let’s try to hit this one within 10t because you were going to get a lot of roll it was going to get knuckly and we just wanted that chance for par cuz I was putting I put it so well I think inside of 5et the whole week I made everything I think I was 100% And I was dropping some 10 15 Footers so let’s just let’s just get a chance for par hit a good pot and if not we get to work that thing came out like a pot it rolled in so soft it was beautiful it was amazing you know you you you heard the broadcast they were like man you should start missing more greens I know they’re telling you to miss greens um and that thing that’s when I cut momentum hardest t-shot of all of them 16 that’s a tight t-shot I hit a nice draw again I hit in the fair one I’m like if you don’t see that these things are you know that you’re able to keep these things under control then you’re not looking at the right things I laid up so good too and we wereing looking that shot between 75 and 90 yards and I laid up to 83 yards no 87 yards I’m like perfect the way I was hitting it I knew where the pin was I know what the green does they were so soft that my landing area became from 3 feet to 30 feet cuz I was able to hit it so far right and the what was just going to spin to the hole with how self the greens were and I aim I think I aim yards to the right I hit this beautiful mid trajectory 54 Dee landed a yard past the pin or pin high and just pun back trickle down the hill hit about three feet make it birdie and I’m like now I know I’m safe it’s over now I just need to you know walk home downwind of the left on no actually downwind of the right on 17 it’s a part five that we play part four and I’m like I’ll be dumb if I hit it down if I aim down the middle and I actually draw it this time so I aimed to the middle of the rough on the ride I drew it a little bit and they caught the rough and I’m like okay I played for a flyer didn’t come a fly didn’t catch a flyer hit a sh of the green I chipped it nicely and I thought it was like three four feet but he he ended up being like seven feet maybe six feet and my friends remember getting you know when I went through my text they were like dude I thought that broke maybe a bowl outside and you aim a good hole or hole and a half to the left of that hole and D made it again I was keep catching momentum you know I kept catching momentum through the end with those shots and you think oh you know it was just a it was just a safe for par I was like yes but it’s a safe for par that will give me the confidence to pull the driver on the 18th hole and pipe it down the middle because you could have seen everyone hitting different different things to get the water out of play but again I had so many rounds from that course that I know that the wind blows left to right away from the water I aim it in the middle of the water and I cut it you know and the driver that I was using then the tsr3 had such low spin rates for me that was never going to go left so it was it was it was game for me but I was so smart again to not aim in the middle of the water because there always comes out shot with the adrenaline that you get quick that you get handy and I could have just hit it straight maybe double cross it didn’t turn and I am to the middle of the Fairway and I kid you not I saw the Tracer that shot Tracer once that thing moved about two yards wow and I know that when you know I get quick I get pumped the adrenaline kicks in I had 170 yards I think in a 168 and that’s a full eight iton for me you know I’m like nope I’ve learned enough I’m gonna pull my nine iron hit it remember whole one yeah I’m gonna hit it normal and I caught it a little thin so I was just barely on the front you know the green goes sort of diagonal so it’s like the back of the green but it still has you know a short side so I was just in the French of the back of the green you know short of the pin and I I was going to chip it and I’m like no cuz then if I spin it a little bit I don’t want to deal with this anymore so I grab my putter I’m like whatever if I three poot it’s fine I’m still in and I grabb my Putter and I laid it up from the French with my putter to like five feet and I’m like perfect I’m in the best position it’s it’s a flat pot I can get aggressive or just get a good put in that’s it yeah I I read it going a little bit left right but it went left to honest and I did not get mad I did not get stressed over that because I hit such a good pot I HD the pot I wanted with the spit I wanted and it didn’t do what I thought it was going to do so I can’t get mad over that and then I had a the longest foot in a half ever you know because then I was able to turn around and look at the leaderboard and I’m like okay I can still miss this when I go you know and get so at that point you did not know for sure that you’re in or are you not a leader board Watcher I had to BU s 16 to be safe yeah you when you’re playing normally are you looking at leaderboards are you someone that tries to stick to your process I’m not really worried about what other people are doing it’s hard I keep getting yell out by my cad to not look at the leaderboard to not look at everyone’s you know at other players pots because I don’t know how they pot if they put side spin if they put Top Spin if you know everyone could have a little different technique and can have everyone can have clubs that perform the opposite of their misses so you know someone can add some lead type to the toe so they don’t miss it right and someone can out let type all those things so he keeps telling me don’t look at their pots and to look at these things and but then I looked um yeah I mean I I go back and forth on like leaderboard watching like if if I look at the leaderboard and I see the I’m four back am I going to go make four birdies because I know I’m four back like no it’s not that simple yeah um I think a lot of there’s a lot of value to being able to stick to your game plan until I think you get to like whole 18 like at Q school and you realize you have a two shot cushion maybe maybe that changed your strategy but but you’ve also come to that hole going okay this is how I like to play this hole like nothing necessarily needs to change the way I would do that um but everybody’s a little bit different um I’m sure there are guys that look at the leaderboard religiously and there’s others that come off shooting 57 they’re like I had no idea that I was you know 1400 I like looking at leaderboards but then sometimes that’s just if you’re not near like having a chance to win what’s the point and so too if you are having a chance to win that can change how aggressive you play and how you react in the thrs and how tip you get and how handy you get and out of sequence and it can throw off a lot of stuff but some for some people like I’ve I’ve done in the past I’ve been able to Rally those things you know make a charge at the end yeah which I really like to when you have to really you know pedal to the metal um yeah that may just be a very individual thing that people have to kind of learn over yeah but I think I’ve learned just to look and not care or I’m trying to learn look and not care and just to stick to my process cuz it’s hard man you make one birdie and you don’t move up sometimes you just like make one birdie and when it updates you’re going from t42 to t41 right you know those things so speaking of that so now you’re on the PJ tour I think you’ve played a few events to this point like how would you how would you assess the start to your season um and then what would you say like the biggest surprise is being out there from like a core standpoint and then just you’re playing a different level of player now right like you’re not playing Latin America level players you’re playing the best players in the world like what is that like for you getting used to that it’s just it’s a lot of work and a lot of hours that I have to put now at home because I never played on the corn faery and to be honest I’m thankful for that but on the other side it would have been nice to play a year and then did this because then you would be able to learn so much more have that learning proces I got to first event in Palm Springs my eight iron is is spinning 6500 coming at AOW yeah nine and a half degree launch that’s a little low yep and landing at 32 32 degre land go would be pretty flat I’m like yeah I hit it solid but I’m not going to stop the ball I’m not going to launch it in the desert which you need Spin and launch to to make the ball go and I can’t hit a draw because the ball just knows Dives it’s not spinning yeah so it’s just out a out a course or a tournament which is the American Express where they we clearly saw DL go 27 under yeah and I battled to shoot one underpar then I’m like is it’s not a lot about me it was my equipment and of course at finals who cared about that because I I had I keep it low because of the wind I didn’t need extra spin because so much into the wind shots that that was creating the spin I needed and it was wet so I was creating more spin so I didn’t really have to adapt to anything I put more weight on my driver so I was able to like spin it a little bit more and I didn’t really that didn’t really matter then but think you know you always hear when guys talk about being in their rookie year they talk about like needing year to get to know all the facilities and all the courses and like even like little things like that about like equipment changes heading into to the West Coast Swing maybe just because of grass types or green surfaces or elevation or air density things like that like is that what you’re kind of seeing is that the courses are just I always you’re a disadvantage almost cuz you just don’t know I’ve always seen the elevation you’re going to play Mexico City man you don’t want to be playing that 7,000 yeah you know but I’ve always learned that I have such a low spin rates because I develop my game in at sea level Florida where you don’t have to hit it high you don’t see many firm greens but the firmest greens we ever played in La America are the normal type of greens that you play these days on PJ tour so it’s like okay I need to do something so I Chang shafts I Chang ball I changed driver head it’s a lot of change yeah and every a lot of change yeah like why did you change the equipment that got you to the PJ tour is like because this equipment is gonna make me stay at the PJ tour yeah right and when you see well you of course have both sides of the like the game you see Rory hitting it so high but then you see other guys like Austin cook that he doesn’t hit it high enough but creates so much more spin so it’s like you want to hit it high yes but you want to have enough spin I mean who’s the king of spin tiger in my opinion Tiger Tiger always found always was able to have this penis BS he’s shape the ball and to shape the ball you need Spin and we saw what happened you know every one of these days every golf manufacturer every golf company they’re creating drivers that spin less and Bs that go further spin less too you know so that’s what they’re doing they’re maximizing the role more than the fight but to be honest basically so basically from like college through all of your professional golf you haven’t had to make like crazy adjustments to your golf game but now that you’re on the PJ tour you’re feeling like you’re having to so is it is it just the equipment or you feel like for example you’re having to try to hit like some like more cuts to create a little bit more Loft and spin on certain situations or actually I I like moving the ball I I grew up hitting Fades draws highs lows everything so I I have the technique to do all those sh okay so you’re already doing all I I know how to move the ball both ways but I always like hitting a draw but I think I gave up hitting a draw because my draws were just diving so I became a fade player but I cannot fade a play I cannot hit a fade when I have a draw path so I’m like today you know now with the clubs that I have and the bowl bowl and Chef combo that I have I can see the ball turning that much more you know actually doing what the path of my swing is supposed to do and now I have to feel like my feeling is to leave the face open to feel like it’s sort of a square now I’m hitting so many flare rights yeah that I’m like okay that’s in play you know this not such an aggressive shot and I’m learning that if I want to hit a draw I don’t you know it’s just a slide draw make it just sort of Chase the pin if I want to hit a fade just make it fall right not go a glance you know and yeah so you know how you were talking about how you grew up kind of hitting different shots are you noticing now though that you have to the reason why you need to hit a fade is different it’s not necessar because I need to curve it to the right but it’s to create almost like to take a couple yards off and to create an excessive amount of spin like is that a yeah but I don’t I don’t I don’t with the equipment now I don’t need to create the spin so it’s creating it on its own yeah it it’s just if if you want to get close to a right pin without compromising anything you’re going to hit a fade and if you yeah you know you overcook it you are by the pin you hit up something that just holds ride you’re temp feet and if something goes astray you’re 20 feet and you still in play you know but it is so nice and I’ve learned with the other guys that I’ve been able to play like there’s guys that only have that they have only one shot pattern yeah so if they have a right pin they know that that Ball’s goingon to move three yards to the left a a to their right Edge and they turn it to the pin if they want they don’t want to flirt or they don’t want to play with the right Edge they a to the pin they move it three four yards left and they still have a 15 footer yeah yeah and with how they just own their shop yeah with how good the greens are out there on the PJ tour everything’s pretty makeable and I was when I when I put a foot on you know linta and you know PJ West I’m like I don’t even want to put my spikes here I don’t want to mess it up it’s so perfect and and that’s the thing you know everything is so perfect out there that it really proves you how good you are and so is this you’re now you you’ve played with some incredible players like I know you’re friends with a lot of the guys that have gone to live and so you’ve seen tour level golf has it been surprising playing with some of the guys of like how good they are is it more again that social media saying like man these guys they’re really it’s really not that much different than what I’ve been playing both both I’ll tell you I’ll let you know when I play with Rory or Justin Thomas that’s when I think I would really know how good they are yeah but that they’re good they are good I mean they’re amazingly good because you will see that the guys that are top players in the world I had an okay week and I finished 15 yeah just printing just printing money you saw Scott shelford wasn’t it wasn’t his best week last week nowhere close to what we’ve seen him play and he wins by five yeah I’m like but you can see the difference of someone that doesn’t shape the ball too much and if he wants to get a fade doesn’t matter if that ball moves 15 30 yards to right that the intention of moving right it’s there he wants to hit a draw doesn’t matter if he overcooks it the intention of moveing the left is there because what happens if you want to hit a draw and you hit a fade then you start like over thinking right and you know they’re very good around the greens I had to learn a lot I mean I have very good hands around the greens but I had to learn how to hit those High soft shots my caddy was giving me such uh so many shots shortsighted he’s like open the open the open the the club of fa the the face of the club I’m like it’s open like no when I’m telling you open it it’s like make sure that you have like L that thing on the ground right yeah you know 180 I’m like it feels like it’s GNA go anywhere and I’m GNA have to scoop it or I have to like turn it to go and like well you have to practice that shot so every time I go practice now I try to feel like I chip with the face completely open so I hid that high Stu shot and I’m getting better and better and better because what happened when I hit when we play in line America nothing against it uh they don’t prepare the coures just not necessary three months in advance is not necessary because the greens are not firm are not super fast so you don’t need to open the blade you hit those low shots all the time try to get the ball to the hole now you can hit that high shot that is going to still release six seven Paces yeah in fact I had a lesson with George yesterday before he left and he wanted to work on some high shots and um I’m really really good at hitting it high and spinning it and uh so I said why don’t you show me he wanted to work on it and he’s hitting them I mean maybe head high not very high and he’s like that’s good enough and I said yeah that’s good enough for right now but that that’s not going to be good enough if you’re playing really really firm fast screens um and I actually had him he has a 58 I had him try my 60 a te grind uh just to show him what may have to happen at some point if he has a good year he’s going to definitely have to to add a higher softer shot and uh Jim son Luke is is one of my clients and he’s an incredibly good Junior and one of the things that we’ve noticed is better with him and he’s playing some high level ajga is he’s really really good at hitting it high and spinning it and I and I and this made leads a little bit to one of the things I wanted you to give some advice on but I I preach with the kids ey coach that you have got to develop the shot early cuz at some point hopefully you’re going to need it like when you go play the PJ tour you can’t bump and run eight irons and pitching wedges everywhere it’s just not going to work you’re going to have to add Loft you’re going to have to add Spin and so I’d love that you allowed me to say that because I I say that every time where I’m on this podcast yes yes 100% And I mean you’re seeing guys that incorporate a 62 in their bag I just said that to George like 62 man there’s guys that have a 62 and a 58 and then a 50 they don’t care they give up those other two wedges but yeah I don’t know I feel I was I’ve been so good with my hands over the years because I’m not long hitter so I’ve learned how to make up and down all the time that I’m I’m gonna bust my time working on that open phase to hit a high soft you know yeah so speaking Yeah yeah go ahead go ahead well just the past few years that working with my coach now under sports brand who who he won on the European Tour 12 plus times wow played the tour many years so when I made the transition to him I’m like he’s got to know a thing or two about how to play on the professional tour so uh he’s been so so amazing to me and he’s helped me so much and guided me through things and again that’s amazing you guys saw the video Jeff CLA is a mentor to me and he played on tour he had to retire because of epilepsy so I got a lot of people or great people surrounding me and it’s just I landed in a good spot with the right people and those are also things that sometimes we don’t see as as answers to our prayers you know people who you surround yourself with I mean you’re seeing it more and more on the PJ tour these I mean it’s it is you playing but it’s definitely a team there is definitely a team behind the player it’s very much like an like an F1 team like there’s the driver but there there is a lot going on behind the scenes with you guys I’m sure now you’re the ones that have to hit it though like I I I had a podcast with a coach recently where we said I think coaches get a little bit too much credit sometimes um but yeah hopefully you have a coach and it sounds like you do that is that is pushing all the right buttons looking at your performance I did want to ask on like what the difference is because as you said you said it a couple times that you’re kind of a shorter hitter is that something that now that you’re on the PJ tour you feel like is something that you’re trying to get faster or addressing are you pretty content with where you’re hitting it and you have your strengths elsewhere like you’re 143 pounds is is that is that something that you’re actively trying to change or you’re just I’m sticking with my with what I’ve got because you know that and that’s what Pro Golf has been right I mean look at all the guys that are already long like trying to get longer um it’s not like but also what you said like with Latin like maybe it’s not necessarily necessary do you feel like it’s necessary the next level yes and no but here’s why I swing depending what device you use let’s say average 110 one tournament 112 little bit amped up yeah um so you can get up to low 170 ball speed yeah 168 16 I’ve never gotten to 170 but 160 okay fly 280 I I Chang changed to TSR to I changed to I changed the ball now I’m consistently flying uh 280 now I can properly ride the downwind because I can keep the ball in the air I get affected with the into the wind more yeah but I’ve learned how to Club up you know yeah that’s not an issue today was my first training session with the the stack ah okay stack maybe that’s a new sponsor I am also a fan of the stack I reached out of the guy that developed it he he was so kind and I was so interested about it and this is why I’m using it I’m not using it to hit it farther eventually I will if I do it properly but I’m using it so I can let’s say I’m at 112 let’s say I bump my average to one 16 over the next year and a half that would be nice but so I can keep it at one 16 114 112 Max over the lapse of four weeks on the road and not see going down to like yeah 105 right right right right that’s the why I’m using it’s genius very smart you can also mess up with your swing doing speed training 100% mess up with your Technique and I’m someone if you take away my round of my Sunday round in Puerto Rico I’m someone that hits a of Fairways I hit zero Fairways in for rck on Sunday so take that okay um but I hit a lot of Fairways and I remember I see I’m telling you this because I saw um one of my good friends a friend of mine he did he put his predictions of final stage in Twitter right I’m gonna read it to you that I have it here so you can see you probably got it like tattooed on something uh I could have but they way he mentioned it is just he described my golf game the best and who I am the best you know he was like his predictions were me and Hayden Springer in you know yeah in between the he the ones he he did the best yeah I I would have yeah definitely hated his name is Alex Scott and what he wrote about me was this kid hates to lose he shows up to play when he has to play and he drives it in his stream yeah that’s me which is invaluable that’s me I hate to lose I’m a sore loser not that I will be mad to you or anything like that but I will work twice as hard the next time we Face to Face yeah I’m not only bidding I’m bidding You by six so you’re going home that’s good you know I that’s that’s who I am and I love doing that I remember I was in Dallas and I went to play with Rafa Becker and George ton and Naro we played TBC Craig Ranch that day first time I go out on Craig Ranch which is a long golf course yeah fless 63 never seen the course 63 I’m like you guys know who’s the boy in town here so but I’ve always like I’ve always admired Rafa Rafa is such a such a laidback person and he he showed me what it’s like to enjoy life enjoy the sport that we do even though sometimes we get hit in the face yeah on our own sport doing what we love so I don’t know I just that just definitely determines who I am as a person it’s like more than being a soul loser is I don’t I don’t like getting defeated by challenges you know I miss theot at Palm Springs I was extra motivated to go next week of course I’m doing these tweaks in my equipment that are giving more consistency but missing the cut this year Mexico being the only player from Mexico with a PJ tour car this year hit me in the face again I’m like what’s going on I was so close but yet so far I feel you know then I go to Argentina to the corn fairy event a couple weeks ago and I get sick I cruise through the first round without knowing the course because I had to go to the hospital on Tuesday did a couple hours practice on Wednesday and I didn’t see the course at all I shot 68 bogey free I’m like well maybe let’s practice round some let’s you don’t need play more conservative year and of course when you have status when you have a card when you have when the points matter if things change you know last year I played the Mexico open but the points didn’t matter yeah experience was What mattered for me and Def play the scenario is different so getting those points is huge I laid an egg going through the last nine holes in Argentina and I didn’t make the cut so yeah that was hard and I put good five or six hours of practice on Saturday and a few hours of practice on Sunday and those few hours that I put in those two days that’s what helped me make the cut in Puerto Rico also because I think that making the cut the opposite field events are key to my season yeah for sure I can’t let those ones slip away um but yeah that that’s a good point yeah but doesn’t matter what place I finish I wish I you know going forward I’m going to push for the top 10 and those events because again they’re key to my season but making the cop in Puerto Rico was just it was giving it pce to my head you know again shot 10 under and finish t t 42nd but I made the C and I didn’t care what that’s still very validating it is absolutely and and I didn’t make the cotton and shot one under at an easy course I I pushed hard I shot 10 under that you know that there’s you know 35 players every week at least yeah at least you know they’re so stuck together it is it is an amazing challenge every day and every round out there on the tour because you fight something different every day and the day that you feel like you have to take it inside to hit a fade and the the day you have to feel that you take it outside hit a draw it’s just off and and that’s why my caddy keeps reminding me we put the work at home and we come here to play you show up yep you show up ready to go yeah so I don’t care if you wanna I just I told him I don’t want you to tell me start it in this line and finish it here I just want you to tell me finish it left of the bunker finish it right of the tree this and cell so I know that how depending how I’m feeling that day if I’m going to aim 15 30 yards left and cut it or aim it straight and hit straight or aim it right and rope it you know because it just depends how you’re feeling every day you know sometimes you can aim straight and hit straight all day sometimes you gotta bend it a little bit to make it f with do I rarely get to aim straight and it goes straight I I I aim down the middle because I don’t know if it’s going to go left or right so if I aim down the middle then maybe it’ll end up good I don’t see straight I see I see curve I see a lot of curve so for me something that draws three yards that someone is behind and say you hit beautiful draws I see those ones almost falling right or going interesting interesting I have for me it’s see a draw I have to bend it seven 10 yards and I’m still trying to understand what S10 yards look at 170 yards away because sometimes you feel I moved it 15 yards left I’m like no you moved at six to seven yards and that’s not at allot so that’s when you understand your straight shot is a three yard draw man this has been great um I I would love to pick your brain for just a minute because a lot of our listeners or parents and juniors that are are coming up and playing a lot of them are going to go play in college some of them are going to hope to play professionally like what would be just like number one advice for kids playing junior golf uh that have a desire to play in college maybe professionally like what would what would you tell them um that would be like something that you would think would be really really valuable take notes of everything take notes of everything that you do you we we laugh about um what’s his face fatrick thank you we laugh about him but that is so good so take notes of everything pay notes of how you were feeling that day but that’s not only thing take notes of I shut 6 to6 but what did you do that day I woke up yeah three hours before my tea time I brushed my teeth with my left hand I didn’t go to the bathroom today I had french toast and bacon for breakfast I had a Coke for breakfast too whatever it is but try to understand what made your buddy your mind your feelings be in sync for that day you know I I had nothing to eat during the round or I had three PV and jellies or I had whatever you want to call it whatever you want to do but try to find those patterns what skill would you say you would say to Juniors like practice this the most I’m trying to remember a little bit of my game when I was a junior um it it is so up in the air I mean I’m playing with uh miles Russell tomorrow oh okay interesting number one uh 2027 grad and that kid is number one in nation yeah he hits it past me he chips like the Gods and he’s got an amazing stroke what would I do if I were a junior still develop the love for the game more than anything develop the love for failing develop the or falling down because then you’re gonna develop that resilience to stand up and say I can’t wait if if I’m going to fall down 100 times so for every 100 times that I fall down I’m going to stand up so strong that I’m going to go win one tournament I can’t wait to hold down the 100 time yeah so develop that passion for the tough days man yeah we so bad at that aren’t we we’re so bad at that we’re so bad we’re we’re like little kids we’re like three years old when we’re not getting our candies you know I I had on summer I said I was done really you were done you really were done well I was not really done but I said if I don’t if I don’t get through second stage then yeah I can’t do almost almost I’m almost done you know I will I will keep playing until I actually have something already lined up to do yeah yeah playing the same I mean again no offense to any of the developers but like waking up and doing that every day every year it’s like it’d be easy to feel like I’m just not necessar moving forward yeah especially in your case where you’re just finishing like you know 11th 15th 22nd it’s like man when is my break G to happen and I’m so thankful that that happened for you because it’s just an incredible story man yeah and one other thing that I would say and I think this is more focused on your Junior Amateur college guys and this is something that my coach makes me do and I’m very bad at it still but I’m trying to and I I’m trying to get so much better at it because it actually works it’s you set a beginning and an ending to your practice and that’s how you feel that you are improving let’s say you put 15 balls at 20 yards and you try to hit them within the 5% of your distance so you try to hit them within you know couple yards you know three feet yep yeah six feet either you set up your your beginning as in like I’m not gonna go home or finish this exercise until I hit seven out of 10 or better or I’m going to do this for an hour and if in that hour I don’t succeed and I don’t hit those seven out of 10 I’m done but I will come back tomorrow and if that you got to come back tomorrow and if in 15 minutes you do it you’re done that’s you’re finished to your practice so you see that you’re improving otherwise you’re you’re in a darkhole loop where there’s no beginning there’s no ending there’s there’s no you’re not seeing any Improvement and you’re not going to wait until you go out on the course and you you have those scenarios present to yourself that you feel oh I’m improving you don’t have yeah having having some objectively tracked performance-based practice is key or else it is very very difficult to know like hey did I did I do any better today I mean cuz time is not a good metric for measuring someone’s success people come all the time my kid’s working so hard he’s spending so much time and it’s like yeah so is everybody everybody’s spending a lot of time but how are you measuring like the things that you’re doing so I think that’s great advice not only for juniors but just like guys playing in college guys playing professionally like at the end of the day especially like someone like you who’s going to have more and more commitments like making sure you’re maximizing your time even though you have lots of time like you’re not in school um I would think that would be like a huge game changer because then it also gives you like I don’t need to work on this so much like I’m five days in a row of like nailing my yardages 20 40 60 80 within two yards four out of five like I’m I I can keep doing it but I don’t need to go like I’m about to go play so and so course I need to work on driving it because it’s super super tight and I got to make sure I can hit eight out of 10 within a 15 yard uh radius so I would think that would really really help yeah and just be be very flexible around your grains don’t only use your 60 also learn how to use your pitching witch you know learn how to do the bump and runs when you’re in a lower surface than the green you just to bump it over you know against the heel and just try to get that release and not that release and how to take spin off when you draw it and how to you know cut it a little bit and they create more spin those things again we said that we need on tour now these days you need the high and soft shot and hi the spin Sha but yeah sometimes you have that chip that is straightforward where you’re going to grab your 50 and you’re going to hit that little chip that checks out little bit and just releases yeah no just be versatile that’s well said man well I appreciate you so much thank you for coming on and chatting with us you have such a cool story we will be absolutely rooting for you I would love to hear how the miles Russell round goes tomorrow too I will tell you I I him is like we’re playing right cuz I wasn’t sure it’s like yeah 910 I’m like you better bring your A game cuz I want to beat you last time I got to hear that SC I got to see that score card we played the stadium course and we were just we started on 10 and we just like we’re just joking around a little bit hitting some shots and not taking the serious all of a sudden I said okay let’s play we take it serious starting one he goes birdie one two three four from the back teas with me he shot four under I shot five oh wow okay so you got him but I felt defeated then by a 14 year old kid just because how talented he is I’m gonna tell you that little ball doesn’t know how old you are doesn’t know your name doesn’t know anything doesn’t know how much money you have it just knows where it’s being told that’s just that’s just um in Mexico we say kakano it’s just a slap on the face with a with a a glove a white glove you know it’s a it’s a gentle slap that is too funny that well you po hey on Instagram you post the score tomorrow so we can all see and then I will but but that just shows you how much better kids these days are we could spend hours talking about that it’s young professional athletes yeah if you ever come to Dallas we’ll we’ll get you with a couple other really good kids love for you to play with I’ll keep you guys posted every time it’s just it’s just almost a you know hit and run and uh I’m gonna try to get early before the CJ Baron Nelson yeah for sure that would be great we’d love to meet up that’d be awesome well thanks for your time um best best place for people to follow you is on Instagram uh yeah most likely Instagram I’m trying to you know step up on my game there and trying to keep every post it there so Instagram is my my to go social media to post about my golf uh career Facebook is just a waste time yeah okay got it okay man well thanks for the time good luck to the rest of the year and we’ll be rooting for you thank you guys for having me I appreciate it you got it man [Music] thanks all right Andrew Lewis welcome back to the angle of attack with Andrew Lewis yeah Jim thanks man good to be here yeah so last time uh we discuss we’re sort of in the 78 to 70 getting down to 76 category and one of the things I wanted to discuss we had Raul Pera that was great great uh Episode by the way great interview and uh really enjoyed his positive outlook and his like his technical expertise on like his golf game and being able to articulate it and one of the things like he knew relative now to the PJ being a PJ tour rookie is that you know his driving distance is probably below PJ tour average like pretty significantly low below PJ tour average and he’s able to make up for it in other ways and it made me think about sort of this category golfer that we’ve been talking about this 78 to 76 category golfer um you we talked about like high school golfers that are trying to be more competitive or or starting to to compete in more sort of local events and wanting to do well there like when you have seen clients sort of in this category when we talk about driving distance like do you see that as sort of something that’s coming into play and maybe a limiting fact a limiting factor relative to getting into those lower scores yeah for sure unless you’re swinging and and we’re going to say again this is a a high school kid that’s shooting 78 to 76 if if you’re that kid and you’re swinging your driver less than 100 miles an hour um you’re just flat out at a competitive disadvantage relative to your peers and the reason that is is because at this level if you’re playing High School events or or two-day events you know the yardages are going to be 66 to 6,800 yards at a minimum um up to you know somewhere in the 7,000 or low 7,000 um so at those yardages hitting your driver 20 you know 60 270 yards at a maximum just means that you’re you know you’re hitting a lot of long irons in um you’re probably not reaching par fivs to where there’s a a term I use a lot with players that are kind of in this category of like your personal par you know yes the the par of the course say 72 but personally you know when you can’t reach any of the par FS when you have hybrids Woods or long irons into par fours I mean you’re just flat out you’re just going to miss a lot of greens um so the days that your chipping is really good you know maybe you shoot you know a lower to mid-70s but majority of your rounds are going to be 76 to 78 and and that’s not because their skills aren’t good it’s just it’s just the odds of what’s likely going to H going to happen over 18 holes if you like consistently have these shots so yeah for sure I would definitely see this as a as one of the reasons someone might be shooting that and rul mentioned he started using the stack which you mentioned you’re proponent of I’m definitely a proponent of and we we had Jared Phillips on back way back in episode three I believe where he was talking about you know when and where to use it so are are do you like prescribe that sort of stuff or you like hear the different swing speed options that are out there I guess the one thing I I wanted to get your perspective on and I haven’t quite solved for this is like how do you incorporate that versus like in season say like how do you how do you keep building that momentum up without losing some of the skill stuff is that like a very fine line yes yes I it makes sense um in season I think like the way that Fitzpatrick or even rul said is like they’re using it to basically like maintain what they have um I don’t think necessarily in season is where you’re going to see a lot of speed gain but I think the stack is helpful from what I’ve seen again this is not research based just from what I’ve seen with players it helps them maintain um what they have when you’re playing a lot um you’re not doing a lot necessar a lot of rain sessions like it it you for sure your Club head speed goes down um so doing some specific speed training like the stack it helps you maintain it for a for a player let’s say that has lower Club head speed you know they’re not necessarily looking to maintain their Club head speed they’re looking to gain Club head speed so as far as prescribing it I think I would say I do more than that because I’m not trying to get them to maintain it so yeah my my first thing with a kid if if they’re struggling with that is to send them to someone like Jared that’s usually it’s a fine line because if they’re if they’re just smaller you know take for example my son Cameron he’s just a late bloomer he’s just a little bit small there’s not a whole lot that can be done like he’s not going to swing 110 by December he’s currently swinging 95 but he’s going to see Jared I mean I think getting into the working out has been really helpful he’s definitely seeing speed gains the stack is there to as a as a piece of the puzzle but it’s not going to be the only thing that a kid’s going to need they’re going to have to build muscle mass they’re going to have to build size you’re going to reach a point where you can only swing that thing so fast um so yeah it’s definitely there the one thing I’d say is you just have to be careful when you’re doing speed training not from like hurting yourself I’ve just seen it backfire with form issues uh with the number one being probably like the length of Swing getting like excessively long the arm swing because obviously if I can move the end of the club further I’m producing more like potential in your swing it faster and that’s great but you still have to hit the golf ball where you want to have control have control of the low point and the and the curve so I think you have to do the stack or things like that in the context of your general swing and of course they do ask you like sometimes to do like 100% swing and that’s fine but in general getting that little radar to like say as fast as possible like isn’t the end all Beall like you’re not going to shoot lower because it for sure says you know 5 miles an hour faster has to be done like in say it has to be done in context one thing I wanted to made me think is you know I used to coach baseball and in the Young years especially because like you know kids they hate to strike out they’ve got 20 parents screaming 40 different instructions at them when they’re at the pl come on parents aren’t crazy but like they’re you know you have kids that maybe just want to try to make contact you know and they’re not really Swinging with in really intent to hit the ball hard drive the ball hard and some of that some of that like first boost that you can see is just like allowing them to swing with intent like do you do you ever see maybe this is not necessarily in this category but do you see golfers that are maybe uh a little too careful with their full swing because they’re worried about swinging too hard or maybe they’ve been told to not swing too hard like sort of the things you hear like keep your head down like don’t because like you see you see a lot of the modern golfers now like they get into the ground and I mean look at Scotty shefford is a perfect example like uh you know they just Luke is another example right he just gets into the ground and he’s he’s is violent right yeah and do you see like like those coaches those swings wouldn’t have been coached 25 years ago right someone who’s like moving their feet in their in their swing so do you ever see like golfers like that or maybe there there’s un just untapped potential because they haven’t been given the freedom to actually like try to swing a little bit harder yeah you know as golfers anytime you guys play golf anytime you hit one bad you almost always say an excuse like I topped it so oh I lifted my head or you hit it fat obviously you kept your head down um most parents when they see their kid hit it bad they say the same thing oh you swung too hard you know oh you swung out of your shoes oh you just had bad Rhythm or what whatever it is it’s all the same thing saying if you would swing slower you would hit it better which is so dumb it’s just not even close to true yeah you’re just going to hit it less offline because you’re hitting it shorter that’s basically what you’re saying if the at 300 yards the cone is going to be bigger than 200 yards yeah um so yes I do see that I also see when kids don’t hit on launch monitors often they just don’t realize how short they’re hitting it relative to like how far they should be um for example I had a lesson about a month ago with a kid and he was saying that this kid on his team was out driving him by a lot and I said okay well let’s let’s hit on trackman and he was swinging about 102 miles an hour I was like okay that doesn’t seem crazy I said why don’t you swing as fast as you can the next swing was 180 miles hour and he’s like well I could just never play like that and I was like you just flew it 275 in the air on our string what do you mean you can’t play like that so part of it is we also condition ourselves to think I can’t swing like that I can’t swing at 95% you can if you practice swinging 9 5% you can swing that hard um half the time some come say man anytime I try to kill it I always hit it good so I would say most people don’t play their like Peak Peak speed but when someone is intent I like your word of intent like someone has the intent of swinging hard they definitely swing harder than if they don’t think about it now someone like my son Cameron when he tries to swing harder it does not go any faster because I don’t think he has enough the the club’s fairly long plus he doesn’t have a lot of muscle mass to moving any faster but in general if someone’s a little bit older and more mature muscle wise I don’t see that that there usually is another gear that they can find which oh by the way did you guys see Xander at like 188 ball speed at the Players yeah like he found another gear I think it was because of length of Swing he’s leading less laate off more across obviously the club’s traveling further but like maybe he to a degree was like maybe I can swing 190 so yeah I think there’s a lot of like control let’s just control the golf ball like no don’t you don’t need to control it’ll if you have control it’ll be there if you swing fast yeah and I guess related to baseball is I mean there’s still this Mantra even in youth or in high school about like you know you shouldn’t bulk up because it’s going to make you like less flexible and not be able to swing as fast and if you ever go to even like a college baseball game like everybody is a giant you know it looks like football players yeah it’s crazy I don’t see that at all I mean I mean no these guys are huge no I don’t think flexibility necessarily leads to like that much more Club head speed I’d rather have the muscle I went to I’d rather look like Bryson I went to a college golf tournament at I was not Colonial this year was at Shady Oaks and pretty much every guy was like quadz zoa you know it’s like some of the biggest legs I’ve ever seen and These Guys these golfers especially are getting in after in the gym there’s no reason not no reason not to start now right they’re probably cruising 120 like lowend yeah and I guess you want you mentioned cruising like I think that’s sort of what Raul was talking about is like yeah you know not necessarily going all in and trying to be Mass fit Patrick but like increasing his top end speed therefore his cruising speed is going to be a couple miles hour and like you said more sustainable over all the travel and everything you know playing back to back weeks and everything and I think that’s where the stack is helpful obviously can help elevate your Peak um I think it helps you get to your Peak if you want to raise your Peak you’re going to have to do something in the gym most likely um but it does help you establish and get to your Peak for sure and and get there more often if you’re trying to because Club head speed it it fluctuates a lot I mean it really does um I’d say I see frequently 6 seven miles an hour differences just between guys between weeks what weather I mean obviously coming out of the winter you’re obviously swinging slower in the summer you’re going to be hitting it further I like as a totter but just your body moves a little bit better it’s looser so yeah but paying attention to it like again it goes back to all the same stuff just like we talked about in last episode of you know chipping and putting things it just needs to be paid attention to just like all your other skills um it it’s important to see that improving just like you see all your their skills improving so if you don’t have a plan for that it should be part of your kind of of your pie like of everything I’m giving attention to yeah yeah that’s great so if folks uh have more questions you want to reach out it’s an Andre Lewis golf probably Instagram is probably the best way to to reach you I did want to mention like uh stack we’ve talked about stack a lot uh they’re not a sponsor at least yet right but Sasha McKenzie is I think the founder of Stack he’s a biomechan biomechanist and uh really a brilliant kind of golf mind a lot of good resources there I would encourage folks to to look into that or there’s other other kind of competing uh swing speed things they actually they actually just came out with a radar a little little radar thing that Bluetooths to your phone because it used to their app is really user friendly it’ll program you you know what you need based on your Baseline testing but you had to sort of like say your speeds that you’re getting from the radar trans to your phone but now this like Bluetooth radar will automatically upload those things into your into the apps which is pretty cool and then the other thing is like trackman actually they upgraded their new their software version and there is a swing speed kind of thing on there if you just click on swing speed you can basically do you know swing speed training and the the swing speed will come up very cool it’s a very exciting yeah so this is this is really the new you know they’re going all in on this right I think it’s you know you see the pros dedicating their you know to swing speed and they’re just they’re just these tools that are just making this speed training as easy as possible so I just wanted to mention those things for people that are you know out there and searching for information hopefully that’s helpful yeah real quick one one last note just because it needs to be said the clubs are part of this um if you haven’t been fit for clubs or you think that your clubs are off from helping you generate a lot of speed um that would be something to be checked um that is generally speaking one of the first things I check when I see a new client so definitely look into um that aspect if you think that might be off but just some just some context there like I imagine spin rate’s a big but like how much how much opportunity is there like you see do you see people coming to you and they have like 3600 spin rates and they’re basically leaving 20 easy yards on the table or well I think it’s two there’s the club head speed and then there’s the efficiency of the at the same Club head speed um yes yeah the the with the driver the spin is massive you know that a lot of that can be face contact assume it’s in the center and you’re spinning at 3600 yeah you should go get a new driver or intentionally hit it high toe if that doesn’t work then yeah you can reach out to me but I I’ve seen four or five miles hour gains with shafts for sure wow uh in both ways again I had a kid today first lesson I had with him he swings on the slow side and he had he had shafts that are 20 gr higher than mine bu a fitter and it’s like how is that possible that he got fit into those and so I said the first thing you got to do like I the only thing I can do to help you is to tell you to go get new clubs like he can’t play golf in those clubs so that it’s all part of it having a good fitter having a good coach um having a good uh Fitness coach like all of those things are part of the equation not not necessarily just for for tour players that competitive golfers that are in this 78 to 76 if you don’t have that start creating a team and that will definitely like help you increase the likelihood that you get to where you want to go it’s not a guarantee but it definitely it should not hurt especially if those people have a track record of doing good things with people yeah you you raised an interesting thing I think there’s a distinction here between getting a fitting and having a fitter who’s working in conjunction with your swing coach so you guys are on the same page and like communicating like is that that’s probably like this next level right cuz someone may say oh oh I went to the you know I went to the golf store and I I bought the stock new tailor made but I got it fitted you know and they feel like okay I got fitted I feel good about it but they’re you know it may not be exactly what they’re what they need yeah I I definitely have like a list of Fitters that I trust because I’ve seen the work for a period of time not that you know you can go see a I don’t say generic fitter but you can go see a normal fitting company or go to the PJ Superstore and it might be fine um it if you want to make sure that you’re getting stuff that you like 100% believe is going to be good then I I would go to an established fitter they do this full-time talk to a like the coach that you have they should have connections to someone that they think is good and I I think it’s incredibly valuable I just spent three out Cameron had out of fitting this week we just spent three hours with the guy that we’ve seen for like five times in a row and it’s so refreshing it’s so nice to go there and know that what you’re doing has a real real impact in like what he’s about to have to to use um versus being like I don’t really know if this is the right thing and that the thing that I left with today with that kid is like he doesn’t know that kid doesn’t know that these 115 G shafts are too heavy how would he know that and so as as the consumer whatever we’re buying we put our trust in people that are in a position of authority we just think yeah they know what they’re talking about and I’m here to tell you just because they work in the golf business that does not mean they know what they’re talking about okay so be like have have a Discerning ear and a Discerning mind or hire a coach that can help you with that because that that’s all I’ll say on that just be careful the one thing I found you we go the same fitter as you but they’re they vested interest in staying sort of like a half a step ahead of a junior golfer right and like almost like obsessing about that like thinking about the kid and where they’re at and what they might be needing next often we hear from the fitter before we even think that we need to need to be thinking about being fit so that’s been a really great experience next level in my mind on the and again this is further down the road stuff I guess but like on the idea of creating a team and like I guess we could identify a team I’m I’m saying a coach a fitness specialist and then a fitter that you trust like I’ll tell Juniors and parents that and a lot of times it’s met with like this well we’re not really ready for that and I and I always say Well then well at what point are you should you be ready for that um and if you objectively define it I would say at this level is kind of when this should be happening doesn’t mean it can’t happen earlier and it shouldn’t happen earlier but like if it hasn’t happened to this point you’re probably not going to progress a whole lot further than this point unless you’re just really really good and and that does happen you know maybe you’re GNA blossom and grow and get stronger just generic or organically and that’s fine but I’d say at this point like you should have a a pretty solid team around you so that may be a goal for someone listening if they don’t for a wakeup call yeah that’s great advice Andrew so I really appreciate it and look forward to next time we’ll go from 76 and start think about the things that differentiate a 76 shooter down to a 74 as we Whittle finer and finer into this series so I think it’s great looking forward to Great CH all right talk to you soon okay see yeah the deren golf podcast is produced by Joseph K if you like this episode like it subscribe pass it on to a friend you might be interested it really helps us out a lot we’ll be back in a couple weeks with the next episode until then remember in in this great game the journey is the gift enjoy the [Music] journey Youngy when as an amateur future so promising looks are going yeah Bo is no stopping me Mama Knows Best wor off thege the new Jack of Jack Town J you in his sights it’s do be and climb to new heights all a sun on it way never not a maybe weing through the season like a feel the days kids got no quit ready for the flight gra through the stages the M’s P the light back not CH my man I’m Po’s not stop until he smells his keep the in the house about to tell you something hit the M 100 times he gets up 100 FR to the from the to the keep it P in the house yeah about to tell you something H the M 100 times he gets up 100 fight to in from the 100 to the 100 [Music] [Applause] [Music] foring for [Music] people [Music] [Music] Val
