The ultimate coaches guide | 1st & Pod

Danny Parkins and Andrew Fillipponi dissect and debate every NFL head coach in creating their list of the best in the NFL. The guys also identify the challenges of ranking rookie coaches and seasoned veterans.

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all right what’s up everybody thanks for hanging out with us it’s Danny Parkins and Andrew philipon on another edition of first and pod it’s an off season which means we create the content there is not news to react to we create the news subscribe rate review tell a friend let’s make this pod grow there’s room to grow here Pony first of all hello how are you my city won the draft this week it’ll come here in 2026 I have absolutely zero interest in attending other than maybe day three because at that point you can just people watch and take in the spectacle of the whole thing uh I am someone that is meticulous about the draft I like to have my paperwork I like to have my rankings out I like to hear the analysts I like to be bunkered down sequestered so the idea of being like one of those screaming lunatics that just gets excited about my team’s pick or booze my team’s pick is at this point in not an experience that I find all that interesting or enticing so I’ll be there if my bosses make me go but I have no interest personally in being a part of the draft celebration no I mean it was cool to go to do shows from a remote media location um but standing around with 250,000 other people to hear a name be called is not my idea of a good time and it’s unbelievable how the NFL has convinced so many people that that’s the place to be it’s pretty insane it was and by the way for the people watching it was spectacular because you just see you know a lot of good-look women no no you see a lot of super fans you see a lot of guys in Jets helmets and shoulder pads face paint is prominent face paint zubas capes capes is a very popular accessory it’s it’s quite a collection of humanity and by the way they are our listeners so thank you subscribe yes we love you okay so we’re ranking all 32 coaches today yeah I have my master list in front of me um I’m GNA give you the honorary first pick it’s an easy pick this is like a draft with LeBron James or Victor wanana or Trevor Lawrence or Caleb Williams or Sydney Crosby or Andy Reid or Andy yes Andy Reid congratul ation for making the easiest pick yeah thank you the number one ranked coach listen I I think we’ll at some point have to do some debates on like are we doing it for accomplishment or if you were starting a team tomorrow obviously if we were strictly saying starting a team tomorrow uh there’d be some push back here because of age but he’s not slowing down there’s like literally six different quarterbacks who have had career years with Andy Reid Jeff Garcia Kevin Cobb Alex Smith Mike V obviously Patrick Mahomes um so he’s a quarterback maximizer he’s a play calling and play design wizard he can get the the Mal content to perform well so you can draft like the character concerned guys and he can wrap their arms around them and put them in a situation to succeed so he’s uh he’s clearly number one and there’s a gap between number one and number two I would agree with that um all right so number two for me is the coach that he beat in the Super Bowl Kyle Shanahan yeah there’s going to be other coaches on this list that have more hardware and have been a part of Lombardi uh celebrations and Super Bowl parades but a lot of the points you made about uh Annie Reid I think now count for Kyle shanan Brock py uh development winning and going to a Super Bowl with Jimmy Garoppolo uh taking guys who were not first round picks necessarily George KD Debo Samuel um making them work and make turning them into stars in his offense uh surrounding himself with very smart people and becoming one of these guys who produces coaches who go on to bigger and better things um so I’m going to go with him number two usually I don’t like to put Guys Without championships that’s high on the list but having gone to two uh of the last last five Super Bowls and coming very close to knocking off Patrick Mahomes in his prime I’m going to give Kyle Shanahan the nod number two rank coach in the league yeah uh I that been your pick uh it it would have been um it would have been quarterback maximizer brilliant offensive mind uh you know electing to receive in overtime blowing double digit leads in Super Bowls these are not great characteristics but if you’re in the Super Bowl with Brock pie uh you’re pretty damn good so I I can’t hate it he he would have been the pick but I did consider Shawn McVey who is the third pick in the draft Shawn McVey is a wizard he is brilliant and yes he has Matt Stafford who is spectacular um but this guy just gets the job done he made puka naua great he made Cooper cup great this is anecdotal I don’t have the the measurements for this but do you watch a team that has more receivers running wide open than the Rams the 49ers 49ers would be in that conversation but they’ve got they’ve got more Elite Talent that it feels like that you know it feels like Debo Samuel and George KD would be great and Brandon auk would be great regardless of system I’m not sure I can say the same thing for the guys that I’ve seen Shawn McVey scheme open on the Rams so uh this was a pretty easy call for me I I there was there was a question of three and four but I’m GNA go with the brilliant offensive mind and he was doubted I was trying to tell you all offseason everyone sleeping on the Rams they had five wins Super Bowl hangover uh all kinds of injuries conspired against in 2022 and all the retirement talk people thought he was mailing it in uh so I thought last season Stafford getting healthy did a lot to restore his reputation among the elite coaches in the NFL I think I’m GNA surprise you with four I think Four’s going to go a little off the board you’re going to hate this pick because of who he coaches but who he did it with last year and how close they came to actually getting to the NFC championship game has to be putting Matt lefur for on this lift the Jordan love development he is no longer a byproduct of Aaron Rogers so starting his career with 13 win seasons and the response being well he’s only doing it because of Aaron Rogers that went out the window last year because of what the work he did with Jordan love the youngest offense in the NFL the defensive coordinator was a problem he replaced him now we’ll see about half Le doesn’t exactly have a long resume in the NFL but this goes back to your question if I’m just looking at coaches currently in the NFL and not judging them based on what they did necessarily back in o08 or 09 or something like that I love what Matt lefur lefur is right now what have you done for me lately he’s my coach number four I had him five okay yeah as a bears man dude dude I yeah I I have no problem with the pick um I had him five his ability to adjust and have it be seamless going from Rogers to leflour but also make the McCarthy to him adjustment seamless for Rogers uh and get more out of Rogers than McCarthy was getting out of him at the end is uh he is an excellent coach he had the youngest receiver group in NFL history last year youngest team in the NFL they hung 48 in a playoff game last year uh I had I have no problem with Matt leflour for that pick I I I have zero issue with it uh the GU so let’s start making some picks that offend us let’s start doing some things here that piss each other off well I mean this is a guy in your division but it’s not your coach I will take John Harbaugh for the F for the fifth best coach in the NFL uh I give him a lot of credit for being a guy without a specific expertise as a former special teams guy who’s been able to have the degree of consistency and success that he had I respect the different number of players that he’s won with uh it’s pretty hard to you know completely change your scheme around Lamar Jackson and then also change your scheme again with Lamar Jackson and hire Todd monin and get another MVP season out of him he hired um Mike McDonald and then that guy became the hottest defensive prospect at coaching in the NFL he he overachieves he hires good coordinators he wins with different systems he’s solid in game uh John Harbaugh to me was a pretty easy top five pick here they got two playoff wins since they won the Super Bowl or three playoff wins since they won the Super Bowl in 2012 they beat the Steelers in a playoff game and then they beat uh Tennessee with Lamar Jackson and they beat um they uh they obviously won the playoff game last year against Houston that’s it so he’s the the overachieving is fine if you limit it to the regular season but I’ve got to be consistent if I slam Tomlin for his lack of playoff success lately I gotta be consistent and say the same thing about John Harbaugh so I would not have put him five I would put his brother ahead of him and that’s why I’m GNA put Jim Harbaugh six even though he has not coached an NFL game in a very long time he hasn’t failed as an NFL head coach there’s like other than his final year in San Francisco where it’s not like they were a dog crap team and the falling out with balky the GM there short of that he’s been spectacular you go to an NFC Championship game year one after Mike single ter couldn’t win uh diddly Pooh with Alex Smith and if not for Kyle Williams right is Kyle not KY is what’s the old White Sox president’s kid’s name who blundered those K Kenny Willam Kevin K Kenny Williams is the old yeah and then his kid yeah fed that game up uh if not for that they would have beat the Giants and they would have gone to the Super Bowl in 2011 and played New England and then to go there the next year with Kaepernick got the most out of Kaepernick I know it’s been a while maybe the game’s passed him by a little bit he’s getting compared to Will frell by Denzel Perryman he is six on my list he was six on my list look at us yeah yeah all right this one you are gonna you’re GNA hate I know you’re going to hate this one Dan Campbell yep you’re right dude is there any team in the NFL that takes on the personality of its coach more than the Lions take on the personality of Dan Campbell I Can’t what takes out the personality and wins and wins the the guy listen it’s an ex’s and O’s League some of this stuff feels like it should have an expiration date on it but it doesn’t do I think it’s insane that he went for two from the seven yard line yeah but you know who didn’t his players they fully have bought in to all of it they dance and Bob and weave before kickoffs they talk [ __ ] they say we are going to be aggressive they are tough they love him Ben Johnson just keeps not leaving uh it’s a remarkable thing like part of the job of being an NFL head coach is leader of men and this guy is a Vibe he’s a personality and I can’t argue I mean finished unbelievably strong amidst resiliency two years ago backed it up from week one through the NFC playoffs last year could have been in the Super Bowl his players love him his coaches don’t leave I I I gotta give it to him Dan Campbell number seven it’s a great I I’ve used the argument what have you done for me lately with Leaf Flur so you can throw that back in my face with Campbell because he did The Impossible they won more playoff games this year than they have like in the entire history of the franchise so that’s great I mean that’s terrific and I just have a bad taste in my mouth from the way that NFC Championship game ended but then again to go back to Kyle Shanahan point it did happen in the NFC Championship Game and he did do it with the Lions this guy gets on my nerves a lot too but I think he did the same thing with the team he coaches and that’s McDermot because they had the longest NFL playoff drought in the League when he took over there he got them over the hump and that was even before Josh Allen took over at quarterback that was with Tyrod Taylor when they lost to Jacksonville in 2017 and yeah 13 seconds was atrocious against the Chiefs and I feel like every year there’s at least one moment in a playoff game where I want to pin it on him for not being up the snuff but they rallied in the second half of the season when people were bringing up that Tyler dun story non-stop um they had a ton of injuries we know that Diggs ended up being a bit of a Mal content that’s probably on the coach actually but I don’t know man yeah part of it is Josh Allen he also drafted Josh Allen and they win 12 games every year and they win a playoff game every year too by the way they win a playoff game every single year there so wow so this this is the first pick that uh like he he was not in my top 10 he would not have been in my top 12 um the the defense the defense consistently overachieves even without a ton of Blue Chip talent and they still overachieved when they lost forain Edmonds and all of that um they’ve had coaching turnover obviously with dble and dorsy and everything that’s happened there Leslie Frasier Lesley Frasier yeah I I think I have two like I think Josh Allen’s the second best player in football I think he’s the second best quarterback in football and it’s hard for me to not to to wonder what it would be like if sha McDermot coached the team without that truly Elite player so that I probably maybe I ding him unfairly for that because his side of the ball does tend to overachieve based on talent and financial investment and he is the head coach but too much let me ask you a question though about like everything you’re saying there other than winning the Super Bowl in 2012 which was a which is a long time ago what makes John Harbaugh a better Coach than Shawn McDermot right now I think that the the I me what I said about the coordinator hires is pretty significant in terms of the guys that have come through there and had success or been in demand elsewhere and and stayed and had success like they’ve won in a in a multitude of ways I guess in Baltimore whereas he’s one with Josh Allen well the only thing I’ll say about Josh Allen is I think McDermot gets a little bit of credit even though he’s not the GM because they made the aggressive move to get him while he was there and they also had to and part of it is Allen taking it upon himself but he did not start off as a CJ Stroud Andrew Luck Ben rothberger type Patrick Mahomes type quarterback who had immediate success he turned himself into in your Awards the second best player in the NFL in that incubator yeah um all right we’ll keep it moving here um this is where it gets a little dicey for me on some of the rankings but I took I’m gonna I’m gonna put Mike McDaniel at at number nine I I know the argument against him but if the seasons end in like like Thanksgiving I would put him in the top 10 I get it but also he’s got a quarterback who maybe just can’t play in the cold and their entire pass rush got injured in December like that team that team fell apart in a multitude of ways uh late in the season I can’t put it all on coaching two has never won a game where the temperatures 45 degrees or lower and they suffered all of those injuries late so I think that there are circumstances there that are Beyond his control he did unlock Tua and part of it I love I love listening to the guy every oh my God you’re giving me the you’re giving me the Big Bang Theory coach uh take here that because he’s like the smart like fun nerd yes cool football nerd he everything that he says feels funny and smart and relatable and that’s not just to the media that’s in the miked up videos the sideline interactions the NFL film stuff that you see uh yeah this is projecting a bit but he’s like the coach that I would want to play for if I was good enough to be in the NFL there’s there’s something there like an he’s so young that he unlocked Tua um if I he’d be high on my list like if I was like projecting outwards and starting a team so I I got Mike McDaniel at nine all right you’re probably gonna think this one’s baddy and I’m I don’t even know if you have this guy in your top 20 I’m gonna put Shawn pton 10 and here’s what I want he he would he would have been in my he’s in my top 15 when was the last time he had a bad year as a coach does last year count they went eight and nine I know that I know that based on the situation he inherited what we thought of Russell Wilson after the year prior the season started 0 and4 and with a 50o loss yeah he benched the guy we know that and they lost games at the end of the year in Houston to New England but if I’m grading That season for him as a coach I give it like a B minus you know the last year in New Orleans a million they went through all kinds of quarterbacks Ian book started games I think they still won nine games before that it was 13 wins 13 wins 13 wins he’s he’s prickly and he’s annoying at times and he’s not everyone’s favorite coach and he seems to you know play the media like a fiddle and leak stuff and try to put himself over and uh make excuses and everything else but I think he’s a tremendous there’s there there’s nothing about his track record that tells me he’s not one of the best coaches in the league I will be picking the name that people are probably screaming in their car and on their pelaton now that how could we claim he’s not a top 10 coach uh when we come back on First and po after this all right thank you for hanging out on First and pod we’re ranking NFL head coaches I wrote down on a sheet of paper before the show and I’ll hold it up to the camera here it says me Tomlin because I knew there was no scenario in which Andrew philipon Mike tomlin’s number one critic would be drafting Mike Tomlin Mike Tomlin is gonna go 11 here he is a top 10 head coach the playoff success recently has been what it’s been but dude he’s never had a losing season oh here we go dude he’s never had a losing seon season and am I am I wrong did you guys win 10 games last year with Mason Rudolph Kenny picket and Mitch trabis yeah okay never had a losing season 10 wins with that grouping of quarterbacks feel like Arthur Smith should be a pretty significant upgrade over Matt Canada so I’m uh leader yeah you just said over Matt Canada Tomlin was the guy that kept Matt Canada around and dug himself a hole last year that you’re now giving him credit for digging himself out of hey man when you’ve been around that long you’re not going to be perfect I’m not saying he’s perfect but when would you have taken him is my question if if it was an Andrew philipon coach Power Rankings when would you have taken the guy that you rail against every day on the radio uh I probably would have taken him around 15 there’s two coaches for sure that I have ahead of him and there’s a there’s a few that I have in the same cluster but one that I absolutely have ahead of him and I think he again one of these guys that because of an injury had his stock go up last year even though his team didn’t make the playoffs and that’s Zack Taylor with Jake Browning in there they were still a very competitive team they won nine games with a journeyman quarterback he at times looked better than that where he was completing 70 plus percent of his passes and making throws downfield and he’s the only coach uh that’s going right now that’s beaten Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes in a big spot because Bruce arens and Tom Brady and Bill bich are no longer in the NFL so um he’s an offensive mind is he’s got offensive coaches now like Brian Callahan that are getting taken by other teams as head coaches so uh full resume Tomlin is better than Zack Taylor but if you look at the last three or four years I don’t even think it’s remotely close between the two guys one’s gone to a Super Bowl one’s gone to two AFC championship games and Tomlin hasn’t won a playoff game since 2016 so Taylor 12 well we’re gonna wrap up the AFC North then in the top 13 picks Kevin stefansky 13 the guy was the coach of the year last year and his team gave up more draft Capital than ever for a quarterback who didn’t play and when he played he was bad and Joe flacko outplayed him and they won 11 games and I saw this stat when I was just kind of doing some reading on this stuff Browns became the first team since 1970 in the merger to play a playoff game without their week one starting quarterback running back left tackle and right tackle Browns players who consisted of 27% of the team salary cap ended the year on injured reserve highest of any playoff team that guy got dealt a brutal handline and they started five quarterbacks yeah guy got Del a brutal hand last year and won 11 games so the reigning coach of the year who doesn’t have an excellent quarterback and just wins he he definitely deserves to be regarded as a top half of the NFL coach Kevin stefansky off the board yeah I still have misgivings about him though um but what you said about last year in a vacuum I have a hard time poking holes in it they did get crushed in the playoff game but to have the corpse of Joe flacko out there throwing for 300 plus yards and three touchdowns in a handful of games in December when the guy was picking his kids up from school before that in flying uh economy to Cleveland to sign with them yes which by the way a Steelers rookie was on my flight from LA to Pittsburgh and he was in first class so Flaco what the fs going on man flying Southwest buddy no first class it’s a meritocracy he probably you know had priority boarding took an exit row on Southwest maybe a little drink ticket but yeah he was flying Southwest man of the people Joe flacko I hate southwest’s whole flying system the whole line and you’ve got to line up behind people and ask them and butt in and say hey what’s your number because this is where I am and oh wait let me move up here oh you’re ahead of me let me move back I hate that so anyways uh Mike McCarthy next you’re dude the other name on my sheet of paper Pony McCarthy yeah just PR pre podcast predictions there was no scenario you were taking Tomlin and there was no scenario I was taking M which I don’t really get with you because you I thought take great took great pains last year on our weekly shows after games to say hey I got to tip my you don’t wear a hat ever but I gotta tip my why don’t you wear hats I wear hats when I golf okay and you said I just got to give some love to Mike McCarthy yeah their offense he took over the play calling uh offense of Juggernaut last year Dak Prescott had has the best year of his career CD Lamb’s a monster blah blah blah blah blah this is not you know your uncle’s Mike McCarthy maybe he’s turned over a new leaf and now after the Green Bay playoff loss you said he’s Untouchable and he’s Radioactive in nuclear in this process and taking Mike Tomlin over him who he lost to in Super Bowl and McCarthy’s had more success in January than Tomlin lately uh yeah I just don’t like him he’s like he’s honestly though in terms of guys who I would probably get along with and relate to you he’s one of the most likable humans no you don’t think so he’s an every man yeah he’s a he’s he’s a you don’t see like Kevin James should have played him in a movie not Shawn pyton yeah uh I mean great regular season success nothing in the playoffs ever since he’s been in Dallas stale fraulin in Green Bay I’ll never forgive him for those field goals inside the five yard line with Aaron Rodgers against Seattle in the NFC championship game cost me money um that’s like your bill bich costing you the Survivor pool yeah play last that’s right I hold I hold grudges against NFL you will take a personal Vendetta and have it affect the uh he won one Super Bowl with Aaron roggers that’s not very good Deo Ryan’s number 15 off the board board mhm part of this is buying stock in a guy who’s Young Who seems unbelievably charismatic but also obviously had a ton of success as a coordinator with the Niners uh we talked about it a ton on the Pod last year there were a lot of options for Coach of the Year there were a lot of them um and so he was a finalist but he didn’t win but there’s probably no one in the NFL who exceeded preseason expectations more than demo Ryan’s I know bobby slowick gets credit for that I know CJ strad gets credit for that but we’re not drafting coordinators we’re not drafting quarterbacks I can’t say that demo Ryan uh doesn’t deserve to be a top half of the NFL head coach based on what I saw last year yeah tough because it’s only one year but it was just a A+ start to a coaching career and so you know we both like them this year yeah I love think it’s not like we think it was fluky or fraudulent you’re right okay so that’s 15 this one I gave a lot of thought to and I’m curious to hear how you feel about it I’m going to put Dan Quinn 16 oh wow and I’m gonna put Dan Quinn 16 because as time has gone on we’ve not really seen him Coach much since in six in 17 they win a playoff game in LA and they lose in the division round of the playoffs and then shortly thereafter things fall apart he starts off 0 and5 he gets fired uh midseason um that would have been in the 20 uh that would have been in the 2020 season where they let him go mid-season But as time has gone on I think I appreciate especially the 2016 Super Bowl run even though they choked and blew a 28-3 lead he had that team in the Super Bowl and he had he got Kyle Kyle Shanahan there he had the smarts to hire him so and he was you know get gets impeccable reviews as a defensive coordinator thought of as like the one of the elite elite defensive Minds uh at his you know calling defensive coaching and he’s a coach that’s been to a Super Bowl so I’m going to give him some love and say that he’s an average NFL head coach on this list and put him 16 having not seen him in a few years but what he did in Atlanta overall did he succeed or fail he he exceeded with he succeeded with flying colors there with the Falcons I think this gets much harder as we I think it’s much easier for us to rank good coaches than it is to rank bad coaches I don’t know if you feel that way but it’s certainly how I feel I think it’s more fun to rank the bad ones but I get it I I that that that’s fine but I’m say I like I like splitting the terrible hairs so I I I these guys more in in tears I don’t think we’re at the terrible stage yet though no you’re right um I’m gonna give you another guy and so this is similar to my my last pick I’m going on like you’re doing with with Quinn on like projection coordinator should be better than the last time all that stuff I’m goingon to go small sample size liked what I saw overachieved and a guy who I think is a pretty good bet for Coach of the Year this year Shane styken yeah if it’s probably unlikely that Anthony Richardson’s G to win MVP but we talked about him as a long shot bet that we wouldn’t hate having but if he’s even if he’s fifth in MVP Shane Steen could win coach of the year they improved over six points per game in terms of points per game scored from 2022 to 2023 and Anthony Richardson got hurt he did it with our Guy Gardner muu I I just think that that was a very impressive coaching job when we did not know really what to make of all the the Eagles coordinators getting those jobs with him and G Canon and the Colts we’ve talked about it it’s not a team that’s going to get a lot of love on any of the national shows Market size and all that but I think they should be a very fun team to watch I think that they in a really sneaky AFC South that’s going to be tough to pick this year in terms of power rank the teams after Houston like I think there’s a real chance that Indie is better than Jacksonville this year and is fighting for a wild card spot in 10 wins this year so I I’m gonna put Shane steik in here okay I don’t I the logic of where you put him makes complete sense to me but based on what you’ve said on some previous shows I’m very surprised that you’ve allowed for one guy to last this long and I’m not going to take him with this pick I’ll let you come back around and tell me why you waited this long to pick him with your next pick I’m gonna go Doug Peterson Doug Peterson I know I know who you’re referring to Doug Peterson will be my next pick uh if we had done this podcast in May of 2023 I think he easily would have been in the top 10 because we the eagle Superbowl would still be uh somewhat on our minds and what he did getting Jacksonville to the playoffs coming back and winning the Chargers game respectable showing against the Chiefs in the divisional game and it just the last four or five games of the Season were a disaster um but you know still had a winning season in Jacksonville hasn’t really looked like the game has passed him by there whatsoever so 18 but a big year for him I think the the Jags if they don’t bounce back this year then I think what he did in Philadelphia winning a Super Bowl is going to look more and more like an outlier and his place in the NFL history will be similar to maybe like a Brian bck or somebody like that coaches that won Super Bowls that are not really viewed as you know special coaches coaches um so 18 for Peterson yeah listen I I like Peterson he’s accomplished a lot uh but he’s he’s on the hot seat in Jacksonville this year uh this is probably too low for Kevin oconnell I’ll I’ll take Kevin oconnell at 19 you’re right it it is it is too low I maybe got a little too cute with some of my projections the maybe it’s because I think that they’re obviously taking a step back this year with with losing cousins but uh I actually just heard from like a very respected football voice that’s in the NFL uh as like as an executive that he’s positive that the second best quarterback in this draft was JJ McCarthy and I wish he would have told me that before the draft um but when I when I tried to like regurgitate some of that stuff to you you didn’t seem to want to listen to it and now this random ass NFL executive says it to you and Danny Parkins is like well I have to I got TR my sources over yours but all it took is one man’s opinion for you to be I don’t see anything special in JJ McCarthy he just I’m ju I’m just saying he managed the offense at Michigan they ran the ball and played great defense he had to make two or three throws a game yeah yeah I I’m just saying I I’m open to the possibility of being wrong you gotta be able you’re not even being wrong now you’re just you’re just now you’ve replaced your own opinion with this man’s opinion no no no I’m not no no no I still stand by my own opinion what I am saying he should have said that to the executive well I disagree with you I think you’ll be very wrong here he’s going to suck uh if they’re right they have a great play caller who got something out of dobs last year when cousins was hurt and they’re gonna pay Jefferson and you’ll have Jefferson and hackinson and Addison with a good rookie quarterback and a good play caller and a good coach so this guy has a 13- win season on his resume without you know Elite quarterback Talent even though he has gotten Elite quarterback production when he’s been healthy uh and you know I I do think he’s a very good coach the 0 and-1 postseason record you know not not a large sample size there I think he’s an overachiever which is what you want out of a coach he’s definitely better than 19 20 for me is Nick serani another one of how these how the mighty has fallen he top and on the hot seat yep he would have been in the top five last year crying before the Super Bowl and everything else and even halfway through this season with their undefeated record and you know they lose to the Jets but other than that they were pretty much perfect and uh you know with the tush push and everything else um you could C you could cut and paste a lot of what I said about Doug Peterson here on uh Nick serani it looked like and this is why I’m you put stien ahead of him it seems like the brains of the operation were probably uh departed and left for Indianapolis however I think they hired good coordinators this off season in the roster I think is still top 10 in the NFL don’t be surprised if serani is back in our top 10 or 12 best coaches in the league after this year and if they if they just make make the playoffs or lose in the first round I do think he’s done I think they’ll get rid of him and they’ll bring in someone else because they’ve had such good success there moving on from coaches and finding guys thereafter who go on and do a lot of winning so yeah I mean they’ll be a team that’s mentioned for Bill bich yeah I don’t think they’ll do it because I don’t think Hoy Roseman wants to seed that power over to Bill I don’t know that Bill’s going to want Personnel control we’ll see how much he’s able to win people over by doing uh the Manning casts and McAfee stuff which people might laugh at that but I absolutely think the personality he displays publicly will go a long way in softening owners especially on the idea of bringing him in and working with him in 2025 all right more first and pod right after this oh thank you all right back in on First and pod this is where it gets down to the nitty-gritty this is where we have gross decisions to make the bottom third of coaches in the NFL Antonio Pierce off the board I got some questions for you okay I mean it’s a small sample they let the players pick the head coach but I don’t know that they’re going to have a lot of success given the quarterback situation but he went five and four he beat the Chargers he beat the Chiefs the players like him it’s a small sample size but I’ve got to at least say in terms of the coaches that are left he has [Music] shown maybe a higher upside and like they won because of him you know like these other guys feel like they’re more like along for the ride or whatever happens is more inspite of Antonio Pierce had a positive impact unquestionably on his football team and they overachieved compared to what they were getting with the exact same roster and the exact same players which Josh McDaniels before him so Antonio Pierce I think it’s completely disrespectful that you put him ahead of the guy I’m taking at 22 and that’s Todd BS Todd BS won a playoff game last year if Todd BS was an offensive coach and not someone with a defensive resume he would have gone in the top 20 picks for sure but we ascribe Baker Mayfield success to other people and I really don’t think that that’s entirely Fair he was seen as dead man walking when the season started you you brought up Houston overachieving Tampa Bay was looked at as a team that was going to win five or six games and they were one of the last eight teams standing and there’s another coach that did that the year before uh who still left out there but with the bucks even in a weak division uh they they were their record like they were legitimate uh winning team there did not have some fluky point differential or they just had a tendency to win one- score games and that’s the only reason why they made the playoffs they earned it and then they went out and they kicked ass in the first round and embarrassed Philadelphia and we’re good I thought I me know they did not go to Detroit and get punked so I’m putting Bulls 22 I’ll put Matty E bro 23 okay so this is why I brought up the Antonio Pierce thing to you you are a man that believes that the Bears are going to do a lot this year and win a ton yeah and yet you ranked an interim coach who has very minuscule accomplishments in the league ahead of a guy who you think is destined to be the shepherd of a team that wins like 11 or 12 games this year and makes the playoffs dude great players matter more than great coaches Mike McCarthy won a Super Bowl John Fox won a Super Bowl you can you could be carried by the power of your roster what’s Bill bich without Tom Brady so I don’t M Matt Eber Flo is the defense got better when he called the plays and took that over and they got but they also got montz sweat they got healthy in the secondary and they beat bad quarterbacks the culture is there the players seem to like him all of that stuff but it’s other than Dan like like Dan Campbell seems like it’s a force of Personality thing mat E bro feels like it’s a little bit more like gimmicky high school he has the hits principal hits hustle intensity takeaways smart situational football like it just it feels like it’s a little bit more of a house of cards his leadership style so I do give him credit for the defense and taking over the play calling but his defensive coordinator left in disgrace and secrecy which is why he had to take over the defensive play calling so I do I think he could win coach of the year like how Matt naggie won coach of the year which was on powered by Vic fangio’s defense when they had 36 takeaways but Matt naggie won it and he could just win it because he gets carried by the strength of his roster or I think Caleb could be good but the team underachieves and wins seven or eight games and he gets fired at the end end of the year like I think both outcomes are on the table and by the way he’s a co-favorite with Jim Harbaugh for coach of the year right now preseason because of the hype around his team I just personally haven’t seen enough yet to believe it’s it’s because of him and not with him being along for the ride uh I’m gonna take Raheem Morris 24th um there are a lot of uh NFL coaches who think this is a long time coming and two of the ones that are his biggest proponents and biggest Advocates are McVey and Tomlin uh what is very unique about Raheem Morris is that after he was the head coach in Tampa Bay at a very young age he made a transition to the offensive side of the ball and he coached offense and then after that he went to LA and was the defensive coordinator for the team that won the Super Bowl so I like that there is uh some depth and some versatility to him as a coach and we’ve seen guys who get a second chance who end up doing much better who learn from their previous mistakes belich is obviously one of the most famous examples of that so I I think I think was deserving that he got a job I was stunned that they picked him over some of the other candidates for that job but like you saying about eberflus they are in a division they are in a situation where they could make the playoffs this year and we could still have some doubt about his credibility as an NFL head coach this next one is partly because you and I have been talking about buying stock in them for this year so this is a bit of a projection but based on how Philly finished two years ago I thought that this was one of the most ridiculous hires ever but Jonathan Ganon uh they they did play hard for him and they won four games this is true but they beat Dallas they beat your Steelers in Pittsburgh yep I was there they beat Philly in Philly I know that was in the midst of Philly’s late season collapse but still the wins were good they did Cover spreads they were Plucky and so you get fully healthy full season Kyler all of the draft pick infusion second year of system I we think this is an over team this year and we’re ranking bottom seven coaches in the NFL 48 minutes into this podcast I’m gonna put Jonathan Ganon at 25 I think Giants fans believe that Brian DA’s a good coach and that’s why I’m gonna put him 26 I was debating between I was debating between those two and we have in a roundabout way giv him Kudos because you mentioned with Buffalo how you know maybe the Josh Allen success or some of it wasn’t was due in part to DA’s coaching and Kyle and uh dorsy was just not on the same level uh Daniel Jones now the Giants overall in 2022 were a mirage were a paper Champion team but Daniel Jones despite not throwing a lot of touchdown passes he was a much better quarterback and to D’s credit he utilized the the legs and the athleticism of of Jones better than any coach before him and that part of Daniel Jones’s game turned turned into a real threat and by the way they had nobody to throw the ball to Isaiah Hodgins who they had picked up from the bills was their best receiver um so I think last year he took a step back the injuries there and playing guys like DeVito at quarterback it’s hard to analyze coaches in those situations but then again we’ve touched on a ton of coaches last year that made do with uh backup quarterback so it’s weird I mean it’s a little bit reminiscent of what happened with their with madoo with the J with the Giants where in year one they made the playoffs and the New York media was convinced the guy was a good coach and then it fell off a cliff after that and I think there’s a chance that happened happens with dble Danny I mean if they go like five and 12 I I believe he’s going to get fired there and it’s going to be another short stint for a Giants head coach this is the part of the Pod where we get in trouble here I think not that any I mean there’s no consequences but I’m gonna just say Mike McDonald like I don’t know he’s never been a head coach but are we going to say that all of the firsttime head coaches have to be last or are we going to put them all together in a ranking like this guy’s the youngest head coach in the NFL he’s 36 years old he’s a defensive wonderin like they were Baltimore’s defense was first in points first in takeaways first in sacks I like him more than the other guys left on the board in ter in terms of upside and you you know what I mean like I yeah I don’t have I I obviously can’t prove it but unless we’re going to say that all of the firsttime head coaches can’t be ranked or they have to be ranked dead last I’ll I’d rather have Mike McDonald as my coach than Robert Salah yeah that’s why I’m not GNA take Salah either I’m gonna take Canalis at 28 the recovering porn addict um and I’m going to do that because among the coaches that got jobs here I think I’m I I am personally more impressed with what he did in that t with that Tampa Bay offense than what McDonald did with Baltimore’s defensive players uh to get Mayfield to the 30 touchdown number to get the Buccaneers to you know help them get to a playoff uh Victory uh and then in Seattle before that he was Gino Smith’s quarterback’s coach so I like this guy’s resume and I am actually interested to see what he does with Bryce young this year um so I think I now know how this is going to end with the two guys who are going to be 31 and 32 so I’ll just I’ll just take Brian Callahan um in tennessy go with the pedigree uh but this is real tough BEC I mean it’s a first-time offensive coordinator a firsttime defensive coordinator a first-time head coach and a first-time play caller so I don’t I mean I don’t know he does have he does have his dad coaching the offensive line and he’s one of the best of all at that exactly so I will I will go on I will go with pedigree call it nepotism whatever you want to say but Brian Callahan 29 congratulations for not having an NA next to your name uh I’m going with Dennis Allen oh wow I thought he was gonna be 31 or 32 okay yeah Dennis Allen is 30 for me it’s not like they went 5- 12 last year they did win nine games it was ugly uh I thought they at times underachieved and they should have been a shoe in to win the division I picked them to win the division before the season started I thought they were kind of a Darkhorse team I was still a Derek Carr guy uh that changed last year and he barely survived I mean getting if if they lose the last game of the year to Atlanta and finish 8- N I think he gets fired instead of Arthur Smith and he’s out that’s how much that game it shouldn’t have meant that much but I think finish with finishing with a with a winning season uh had him avoid the Executioner so 30 for Dennis Allen but among coaches I I don’t know if you’ve seen this prop like coaches who could be fired in season first coach to be fired I think I’d put him one yeah going into this year even ahead of Robert Salah well the Jets schedule is pretty easy so I could see Salah like having like a inflated record if Rogers and the guys actually stay healthy for a while in season and then be tougher for him to be fired in season uh but I mean I’ll just make the point now so we can keep it moving but when Salah comes off the board which will be at 32 like if he couldn’t fire if he doesn’t have the juice to fire Nathaniel Hackett and he’s 18 and 33 or 34 whatever he is he’s got 18 wins in three years I mean he’s Salah deserves to be dead blast so I’ll say Gerard Mayo at at 31 um you know he’s replacing bill bich it’s not easy but young the NFL has a minority uh coaching issue and it has for a long time and that’s why Brian Flores filed the lawsuit and Flores uh had enough success in Miami where I think he should have been given another head coaching opportunity by now and overall did a uh extraordinary job Minnesota’s defense getting it from dead last to pretty respectable last year that all being said I was not a fan whatsoever of the process in New England that led to Mayo getting hired as head coach it just kind of felt like to me that they were just extending the bill bich program you know we uh we Syracuse alums just kind of like okay bim’s getting pushed out the door he’s a legend so let’s just keep it going by promoting one of his assistants who’s been here for a while you know when when don’t I know it’s hard replacing a legend you don’t want to be that guy the old cliche but my personal opinion if I were J if I were Robert and Jonathan Craft I would have wanted to cast the widest net possible and looked way outside of my comfort zone to find the next head coach there given the way New England has performed in the post Brady era all right so Robert Sal off the board at 32 yep he sucks [Laughter] he does suck yeah 18 and 33 Nathaniel hacky gets some blame Zach Wilson gets some blame but congratulations someone had to be last thank you to Spencer R our producer tell a friend about it send someone a link send someone a link and say hey check out this great NFL podcast then screenshot that to Pony and I and uh we’ll retweet you so prove to us that you’re still listening and that you’re doing the good work and spreading the love of first and pod we’ll talk to you next week peace