A United Victory or a Liverpool Defeat? | TLC 59 Live at 5(ish)

After Liverpool somehow conspired to lose 4-3 to Manchester United after extra time in the FA Cup, Gareth Roberts and Paul Cope discuss why tragedy chanting needs to end as well as chatting about what happened in the game and what positives can be taken once everyone’s processed the defeat.

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Hello and welcome to episode 59 of the late challenge podcast hopefully you can hear us now um after a few weeks of short and stuff out in the new studio we’re live at fiveish again so if you join join us live hello um um hopefully that can they hear us are you getting

Comments um well the first comment I’ve had is come oh yes sounds good oh no no sound hey just tell us it oh loud and clear two people have said the can and one says no sound so the majority says they can’t hear us so we can hear you

Sound’s good yeah but they’re all coming in there we go s up the ads were in this is what’s happening with live recordings and so if you’re recording if you listen to this back as a podcast none of this will make any sense to you but this is

The first time we’ve gone live again in the new studio um and we’re back live following something we haven’t for quite a while which was Liverpool managing to beat Liverpool 43 or Old Trafford which we’re going to get into um we’ve got loads to talk about including hardwood

We managed to to lose that game against the maddest formation I’ve ever seen in my life so like we’re going to have a good old therapy session for the first part of the show and we’ll get through all the negatives and we’ll sort all that out and then we’re going to bring

Back come back to the positives and we talk about all the great things we’ve got ahead of us someone just suggested that we just change the day with the podcast to the the late podcast [Laughter] nice I like that oh yeah and we should say shouldn’t we as well that now that

That we’re back to being live again H people can do that thing now I still don’t know what the name of it is super chat Super Chat super like whatever it is it’s another way you can throw money in and say that you like what we do and

You want it to continue we’ve got the other thing as well haven’t we the buyers of coffee yeah we got patreon as well yeah so there’s links to we don’t we don’t we don’t actually cuz we’re you know by by our own admission middleaged fellas now so we don’t even know how you

Do this Super Chat thing do we no no idea but if you know how to do that you can do it now while you’re watching live but if you don’t know how to do that you can subscribe to our patreon show or if you don’t want to do that buy us a

Coffee there’s links underneath or there will be links underneath this show on the podcast and on the YouTube channel um we’re going to do what we usually do now which is just talk about it in two big shows put together a couple of people recently have had a little moan

That the second show which goes on our patreon Channel isn’t out quick enough and hopefully going to sort that because that’s going to be we’re going to try and do that live as well which will be after this so if you want to join us straight after that one after this show

You can come to patreon go to the links below the show if you’re not already a subscriber you can join us for free on a 7-Day free trial to check it out there’s loads of shows there there’s a bad catalog of stuff you can get into but now that all that admin is

Sorted let’s get into the The Man United game which was yesterday as we’re doing this if you’re listening after the event um as often these days you were at the match and I was at home so we’ve got two different views we’re going to start with the negatives as I’ve said nothing

More NE more negative than the thing and I know we’re going to start and most people watching this going to be Liverpool fans so we’re preach into the quiet but I still think it’s we it’s worth us talking about um and it’s mad that we still have to talk about this in

2024 but just to say and get I want to get your view on it because I know you’ve got strong views on it it’s mad I have to say out loud that chanting about people dying and poverty is not acceptable it never was but it especially isn’t now so can we just

Knock her on the head and it was mad at watching her at home and I’ve seen a couple of people have tweeted us about this when we’ve asked for comments saying why wasn’t it called out on TV because it because I think carig on Sky called something out a few a couple of

Months ago didn’t he and and he did aie on it was audible it was a on ITV and they didn’t mention it and I think I actually think that’s one of the things that needs to be done now the TV comp companies need to say to their commentators and the co- commentators

Call it out there just needs to be lots of pairs of balls grown over this some from the TV commentators yeah I agree some from people covering the match and and you know who I’ve got a platform via the media that they work for and then they’ll say things like blah blah blah

Blah blah blah blah blah blah meanwhile there was some tragedy Tron now klopp kicking off in an interview with One broadcast that is not biger news than people mocking dead people at a football match and and like I just think we we need to talk honestly across football

And across all fan bases about this going on and one of the things that’s really disappointed me in the time we’ve had since the game is I don’t see any man united fan groups I don’t see any significant you know fan influences for one of a better for coming out and

Condemning this there’s a lot of silence and this isn’t one or two people I’m seeing loads of water about I’m seeing um a smoke bomb ended up in the disabled section at man united look I was in the ground I was at the in the top tier I

Could see smoke bombs go I don’t know where they landed if they landed in the disabled section quite clearly that’s not acceptable that is not head’s behavior that is b endri a football match sound but so is thousands of people singing the sun is right you’re murderers you know you you’re singing

About something 35 years ago where 97 people died where hundreds more were deeply affected by what went went on where people ended up committing suicide where people are still coping basically with PTSD had the fames ruined lost the friends lost the moms lost the dads lost

Kids you know whatever why why has this been seen why is it ever put in a frame of it only bant and it’s acceptable that you can go to a football match stand in front of Liverpool fans and start doing things like this to simulate a crush in

1989 I just like I don’t get why that isn’t called out by absolutely everyone it’s got nothing to do with Liverpool man united or anything else [ __ ] the tribalism off put the tribalism to one side and just say how about we be decent human beings in 2024 and all we ever get

From some people is the silence and silence to me is getting close to being complicit uh and then you get you know um well what about this and what about that and look okay so I’m 47 years old and I can remember when Liverpool Liverpool fans were guilty of chanting

About Munich but in 2024 I can’t I can tell you honestly with me hand on me heart that I can’t remember the last time that happened and if I ever he it I games I’ve challenged it personally not yesterday I didn’t he I didn’t hear anyone do it genuinely didn’t hear

Anyone do it I don’t see people doing playing gestes I don’t see all that stuff that did go on go on now and so the order of how these things happened doesn’t matter anymore it’s 2024 so let’s just all be better because if there are people like Charlotte

Hennessey who’s affected by this cuz she’s lost family and she’s putting it on Twitter I am affected by this can you all stop doing it let’s all stop doing it and why won’t man united groups why won’t their supporters why won’t their influential fans why won’t they come out

And condemn this where are they what are they saying cuz if it was the other way around I’d say it I I I don’t think any tragedy any form of Death at a football match or around a football match is acceptable to sing about to throw at

Someone to to you know imitate to throw around on social networks whatever I just think we need to jib it all off and and look you know there have been loads of steps made you know we we’re now seeing clubs saying B if you do it we’re now seeing police forces get involved

We’re seeing fa put out py statements which is you know part of the course like what is that statement that they put out like it doesn’t even say who was doing it like the whole well a big section of the stord Ender doing it mate

Like I can hear it cuz I’m in the away end among 9,000 Liverpool fans and I heard it and I and we never show up pretty much for the whole of of the two hours well obviously moments where we did based on what happened but I could

Hear it I could hear them singing it and then in and around the game you know like walking to and from I hear stuff about he I hear stuff about hills and I he it said in so just a throwaway jokey manner so to me there is there is

Clearly a problem not on mass but among the significant proportion let’s say that of the of of their fans saying this is acceptable and it is okay and of no one self- policing and of no one challenging it m so do better Lots do better because I’m I’m telling you now

If I saw someone in our end doing it I would challenge it so you do the same or or or crack on if that’s how you want to be crack yeah well 100% and look we we have talked about this before and it’s it’s a shame that you have to talk about it

Again and I think it’s important to repeat this stuff this stuff until it stopped and it’s worth saying on a couple of things you said then to be clear before anybody else chips in and fans from other clubs see this and have a go like we have said before I have

Been part of crowds I have sung those songs when I was a young a young kid basically before I knew the implications before when you when you do think oh it’s just a song in a football match and as of nearly 44 old man now I’m ashamed

Of being in crowds that did that and I would never do it again and if I saw someone else doing it I would say stop doing that and he’s why you know better cuz you’re educated cuz you understand the consequences and how many people are out there that don’t like are you saying

That be who’s all over social media today look at the age of the man are you saying he doesn’t know what he’s doing and what the potential consequences are and how that could affect people’s mental health Etc of course he knows that’s why he’s doing it he wants he

Wants to do that he wants to go that far he chooses to go that far and there might now be some consequences for him and you know what good well there should be and that’s that’s the point we’ve got to and and I do think one more thing to

Say because you mentioned not seeing Liverpool fans I think it’s worth us saying as well if there are any Liverpool fans who are watching this or listening to this who do participate in this type of stuff stop it yeah like it’s time to stop whether you’ve done it

In the past or not stop everybody like arms down guns down end end the game like it’s not it’s just Grim it’s it is it’s just Grim it’s grim and it makes you know it makes you want to make you know it it should be a place that I’m

Quite happy to take my son it should be quite a place that I’m happy to take my daughter etc etc it’s not the 1980s anymore um and what what about you saying well what about when Liverpool did X and Y I’m sorry but you just haven’t got a big body of evidence in

Recent times was it’s not there because by and large yes there are blades that follow Liverpool there’s no two ways about that and some Behavior sometimes crosses the line but you it’s your turn you’ve crossed the line on mass so where’s the voices within your crowd within your fan base even the club

Itself you know I’ve not seen too much I looked for it ear and I couldn’t see too much and someone can correct me if the if I’m wrong on this but I I looked for a Club statement couldn’t couldn’t say anything not on their website or

Anything like that um and I can remember 2012 when Fus was still there he challenged it he come out and said let’s just stop singing these songs because you know we’re better than that we don’t want to be doing and then the club reinforced what the manager said with a

Statement so where’s that kind of stuff now you know why aren’t we seeing stuff like that um and I just think we’re going down like a bit of a grim Road lately and I’m not too sure what the the trigger is for it but you know we’ve

Seen you know man city fans engaging in similar Behavior we’ve seeing even their their players and their manager on a plane singing a certain song Etc and you know once upon a time not so long ago we had you know I don’t think we’re ever getting Hands Across the m62 or anything

Like that there’s always going to be rivalry and there’s a level of it that I love but just know where the line is like even that I met reference the be again what the be does before he goes down the road of Mo tragedy if you want

To give me a wanker sign and a football match if you want to give me the V if you want to call me a scous bastard s cuz I’ve said all that back and you know what when we went two one up I’m throwing V signs out at people cuz that

Is part of it I don’t mind that bit of it I like there to be some form of edge just recognize where the line is there’s loads to go you can skip people’s ear you can skip people’s clubber you can say our BNS are better than theirs or

Our club is better than yours or whatever you want just don’t go there just don’t go there just know that that’s the line and just don’t go there and looking now as I say they are increasingly likely to be consequences for that behavior as well because you know the the police have arrested

Someone H they haven’t said it is but they’ve arrested someone H one arrest like but yeah the fa as I say put out their py statements but where are the rest of the the py statements and and like I said I find that a bit disappointing because you know I’ll be

The first one to say and I’ve said it many a time that hav worked there for 10 years there’s a lot that I recognize about Manchester in terms of culture and how people act and their humor and even the politics Etc this doesn’t Chine with

That so is this what you want your Club to be like is this what you want your F base to be like is this how you want to be thought of would you want to be better up to you Lads yeah and look the point you made then about Ferguson and

Happening you know that’s over a decade ago now it it is a bit of a segue into to talking about the match which is a difficult you know it’s difficult to talk about footy after dealing with something a serious topic like that but it probably says a lot about where

United are right now about the leadership of the club both both the manager and off the pitch and I think that that might be something we do see change in the in the coming months when the ownership ship structure is the the new people involved that you know more

Heavily involved because it it is time for something to be done I can’t imagine it being left the other way around to our end for for all the criticism FSG get like I think something would be done and I think klopp would say something he’s criticized our fans yeah for for

Less of stuff than so of the club yeah yeah yeah I mean the other thing I wanted to add on not just while while I’m on one and while Timmy man um I remember I wrote a piece about about this for the a going back some years and

I talked about what what I tragedy T so you know you talk about hills where we talk about mun all of that how about we just knock all on the Ed and as you just said but the other thing was that I can you know I can remember where I grew up

There was a massive bit of GTI on a wall Munich 58 when I was growing up and when I F I can remember first seeing it on a bus when I was with me an and I didn’t understand the reference I remember seeing it though stuck in my mind and

Then as time went on obviously I understood both what it meant and why it was there and I know I also understand why Once Upon a Time people or some people thought that was acceptable place to go and I understand as well you know let’s let’s get fully into nuance and

Context here I understand as well why there’ll be some Manchester United fans who say well you used to sing that you used to do that you used to write that used to throw that at us it was even on a flag Once Upon a Time as the other

Classic and we we’ve got to put our hands up say there were people in our fan base who did think that was acceptable and and that did happen but again it’s 20 24 and again you know hillsb is 35 years ago next month just time to let it go to leave it

To move on you know let these people have rest you know let let them live in a world where they can still engage with their own football club and not be getting upset by what they’re heing do you know what I mean and and as I say and some responsibility comes to

Broadcasters to media and to fans themselves to to to self police to shout out and to say let’s be better than this you know there was the there was the park song as well like where’s that come from why is that come back really like I I remember reading a fantastic piece by

A monk about that song and about why everything about it was wrong and why everything about it was a poor reflection on the fact that they were singing there it was again yesterday why why have we why have we gone backwards you know what I mean like you know I

Can’t remember City fans old and about the Sun that like in solidarity with us do you know what I mean why have we gone backwards why are we going base like I don’t get it yeah well there it’s it’s interest I mean there is a deeper conversation to be had about society and

Post lockdowns and Co and all of that that that does tie into this stuff and I’ve seen quite quite a bit about and at the end of the day there’s no excuses it’s as we keep saying it’s 2024 and all all these references to the past and we

Can talk about this in so much of society now like well that was all right in the 1960s like well it’s not all right now times change things change and this has changed little Britain’s not on theal anymore yeah Etc exactly like and look we can have a big debate about

Where the line is and what’s acceptable and what isn’t and you and I we we have those conversations ourselves on here and privately and some things are just there is a clear line like I’m happy to discuss other things this is a clear line I don’t understand why any grown person would argue

Differently Joe in The Cold Light of Day caught up in a motion but walk like face to face I don’t understand how you can justify it so if you want to justify it come and do it but don’t justify it with you did this 20 30 years ago because

That’s not a justification for anything um but we’ll leave it there CU we’ve talked about it a lot and and as I say it is don’t it’s hard to go well let’s move on to the footy and have we do we do need to go to the footy so let’s get

Into the match you were there because because the Mad thing about it was like we we actually exchanged some messages at half time didn’t we yeah and I’m watching on telly and you were like oh it’s a Pity I didn’t see that like literally at half

Time Roy Keane is losing his mind on telly you could tell he’s about to blow his top in the way only Roy Keane can about man united cuz he was furious with them and they were worried that they were literally worried we were going to run all over them in the second half

Which is what looked like was going to happen there’s 9,000 Liverpool fans there and so what was it like what was the experience like of being there yeah um I mean fantastic to have 9,000 Liverpool fans there for a start off and that is one of the uh bonuses of the FA

Cup the fact that you get those big allocations I I read and heard a lot about um the atmosphere being brilliant at Old Trafford and all this kind of stuff and I I had a bit of a Ry smile about it to be honest cuz I kind of

Think a lot of that’s FU by the fact You’ got 9,000 Liverpool fans there who didn’t shut up for you know the duration pretty much and that obviously brings helps to bring to life other parts of the stadium and then there’s the game itself of course and the roller coaster

Nature of it but look I went there and I’ve got to be honest I went there thinking we were going to win and I went there thinking we’d win quite well and because I’ve watched them a fair bit this season and to be honest my opinion’s not changed of them after

Watching that either they’re not very good yeah and I’m not I think this is the spit about the whole thing yeah and I’m not having the manager and I’m not having like a lot of players they’ve got at that football club and like it made me laugh because I know why football

Phoning exist and I know why the people who get air time are giving it and yet still you know me and a chimp still is gets triggered by it and and that’s the point isn’t it like I say and you know the the other side the rational side of

Me brains going don’t get triggered by that that’s what they want you to do and why even listen to it I don’t know classical music on or something but but I never do I always I’m always there but I had a classic of you know we’re back we’re back and I’m

Like you’re not back where are you back to you know how many points are they behind us in the league 17 is it or something like that um there’s a huge gap for a reason and and look as you said at the top and it was good intro you know we’ve beaten ourselves

Ultimately because they start well they you know and you’d sort of expect them to in terms of what the recent schedules was being for the two sides like they had more energy and that that told ultimately and I think you know if you were him if you 10 give DED he can get

Sort of fired up I’m just not sure about him at all but you know you can almost imagine a team talk is what I’m saying about this is your last chance this is the last trophy we can win it’s against Liverpool it’s our Arch Rivals it’s at Old Trafford they’re rocking into town

Talking about quadruples you know they’re up there challenging for the league they’ve already won one trophy our fans would love nothing more than to see you layer punch metaphorically on that chin so let’s go out there and do it Lads and that’s that’s how they came

Out and we I’ve said before I here that sometimes Liverpool are weird and sometimes you I think you see in how they start what the day is going to be like sometimes and it was a bit like that I thought I thought he didn’t start well they’re getting down at Jo Gomez

Time After Time and you’re like why are why aren’t we figuring that out why aren’t we yeah why aren’t we figuring out that the coming down that side you know give him some help over there do something change it um you know you know what really infuriated me actually and

And I’ve not seen too much discussion about it was doing my head in our routine of goal kicks and stuff you know like you know the past V or this that the other and I’m like like I felt like we’re invite impr pressure on ourselves

Here you know what I mean like I’ve said it before I don’t think we should be aare sometimes in situations like that to just go long a bit especially when you got Nunes on the pitch you know what I mean like and yet so often the the you

Know it’s it’s confidence stroke hard against that isn’t it all get about this but that’s the point isn’t the whole point of that is to encourage them onti a because then you take them out the game that’s the point and that’s it’s high risk but it’s high

Reward it’s like counter pressing but I think like [ __ ] you know there’s nothing wrong now every now and again especially in like moments of the match where you feel like get they’re getting encouragement and the were you know just have a little bit of nouse and I thought

A little bit of nouse was lacking generally across the two hours or whatever it was in the end mean you know cuz Liverpool made did a lot of D things and they let them off the O and look you know ultimately like everyone’s doing the thing now of well that was the least

Important match left and all that kind of stuff I wanted to win it I don’t like going there and watching us get beat um I like the FA Cup I value it um I really enjoyed the you know the Wolves centry game and stuff like that at the weekend

I’m still a traditionalist I like going to Wembley all of those things and I you know I don’t want to do the thing down and look at get it yet we’ve still got the Europa League and the title to go for and we’ve got every chance of

Winning both of those things and that was still equal fantastic season and we’ve got a trophy in the bag already but I can’t come on and say here and just say well I’m not really bothered about that I’m bothered yeah and I think well it’s GE said funny this this ties

Into the stuff I do for a living but like I think people and this is the person development with the world as well even like this is an optimist thing everyone’s too quick to want to get to the like the upside like no it’s all

Right for us to talk about the ship if you know like it’s all right for us to say we’re GED we’ve gone out especially because like that well like that against them and and they’ve drawn centry in the in the semi which would have been us which means you like without without

Tempting fate like you you would imagine we’d have beaten centry to get to the FA Cup final which means one of klopp’s last games maybe his last game as Liverpool manager would have been the FA Cup Final you can’t tell me that wouldn’t have been a good way for him to

Sign off and potentially I was thinking about this in the buildups of the game and I think this does tie into how we played actually and what you said earlier it one of his last games could have been if not his last game an FA Cup Final against pep guardiola’s Man City

What a way to wrap up the the story you know what I mean like an epic end of like end of era Clash to to win the FA Cup and I think the problem was all of us went there you went to the game I’m watching at home the players went and

During the game it all played out the way we thought that they shite and will beat them I that’s the way we all the teammate you know like I I said like there’s a lot of hindsight analysis now you know what I mean about he shouldn’t have done this and he shouldn’t have

Done that and what about Thursday now Thursday looks St and all of that I mean I went on Thursday and like they were crap and like you know KS come out himself and said he would have subed Salah but he couldn’t do because of Clark’s injur he thought Clark was

Carrying injury and all that kind of stuff and so instead he’s basically said to Salah well just don’t track back yeah and like loads of the game was almost at Waring Pace it was an absolute you know possession like I I was saying afterwards you know like a training session would probably have

Been more intense than a lot of that game and plus it’s Thursday Sunday which I think you know is in football par and most people say that’s enough to R over so I’m not really having the it now means kaps crap because you know he didn’t rest after team on Thursday or

Whatever sh that that’s just a but what I did think is and I I think you saw it there are obviously still players that are in full fitness there are equally players that have played too many minutes and probably could do with a bit of a rest and the combination of the two

Meant well we saw what it meant but I think he went at it with the you know I saw the team and I was like wow go on that’s pretty much the strongest team you can put out right now yeah and I and everything said about that was right we

Winning it in the 90 we’re going for it and look not a lot went wrong really we just didn’t put the ball in the back of the net we like you know second half we had utterly dominated them and we should have been out to S we should be s here

Talking about 51 52 something like that and like it it’s maded the other way around and mistakes were made um you know and it is what it is and we we can’t sort of te back the clock but like let’s not do the baby bat water thing

Here do you what I mean like how good have we been how many scrapes have we got ourselves out of how many times have we turned it around how many times has the spirit been unbelievable you know how many comebacks have there been how many late winners of the be and this

Time it’s the other way around but let’s not lose our [ __ ] here we’ve won a trophy and we we can win the league we can win the league yeah well and look we’ll come on to the positives of this because I do think there’s a there’s a

Rocky story thinking this for us but some of the stats that just go into what you were saying then and this is this is Kar this is anfield from from minute 36 in the first half up until Anthony scored to make it 2-2 in the 87th minute

We scored two this is a way at Old Trafford we scored two had a had a fair the 14 shots and almost double the amount of accurate passes they had in the second half 11 of the of our shots 11 or 13 shots came from inside the box

And we had 61% possession and touched the ball 27 times in United’s area and then even after all of that the overall stats after 120 Minutes was they ended up on 3.92 XG compared to R 2.12 and I think this is the big thing about it

That sums up our second half we abs absolutely dominated but we you said about the Sparta prag game being like walking pace I think we did this something that I haven’t seen Liverpool team do for ages I was when you’re explaining to someone who’s not really interested I was explaining to me

Girlfriend home saying Liverpool used to do this all the time whenever we played a team that was waste than us we would lower our standards to match them instead of just beating them like City do and that’s what I think happened in the second half United was so bad it was

Like our side went we scored about five in this second half so we’ll we’ll just do everything at walking pace and it’ll be all okay and nothing sums that up more than loads of people have mentioned this but for me it sums up the game and

It THS why stats of crap that that five2 we had that didn’t even result in a shot I know so that in stats like terms means nothing you get nothing for that you get you get more for someone just having a pot shots from the edge of the box but

In any other like day of the week with this Liverpool pool team we score from that from that opportunity and it it was just poor like and that happened a number of times and it does take us onto like I want to have a chat about a few a few specific

Things and I know a lots of people are talking about this but I wanted us to have our little say on it and see what you think because he’s because he’s come up recently what’s your what’s your view on gakpo um I think there’s a lot of like

You know all of a sudden everything’s his fault think going on and and you know like I don’t feel you know and and some unfair stuff about like you know I’ve seen some stuff about like his mentality being questioned and all this kind of stuff he’s probably not in the

Greatest of form right now and he didn’t have you know it’s not a classic performance obviously from him um you know he’s he’s chewing the ball he’s not doing anything with it he looks a bit slow he looks a bit lar all of those things but equally you know it’s not

Like he’s never had a good game for Liverpool he’s in double figures goals wise this season yeah and so for you know in terms of what he now is which is essentially a backup stri you know he’s not he’s not violing at the moment currently to be fair choice is he I just

Think again some of it’s just a bit unfair and and some of it’s born out of frustration um I I don’t again you know the baby batw Point like he’s not he not forino forino was outstanding foro was unbelievable like I loved foro and he’s

Not him and he’s brought into kind of be him hasn’t he and he’s he’s not as good um but I think but I think in his defense even further and didn’t expected as I raised this to be defending him but to be balanced I don’t think he gets

Given enough opportunity to be forino now often we bring him on and we we’re asking him to do things like we be playing like either in Midfield or be playing out wide and you’re like well that’s like I think of all the criticism we had of Brendan Rogers for playing

Firmino on the wing and then klopp came in and went while you’re playing him on the wing play him there and he’ll be brilliant I I think if you were CH could be M though it could be mad he could be at Man United and he could be playing Center

Half I I have no idea what he was doing at the end there this is another point about how all these fellas and going don’t worry the win like this is another point about that isn’t it how did we not win we we all had to go with Chelsea

After the Cup Final and all piled on them of like how how didn’t they just beat us when we were bringing on all these kids but when at no point in that game did like as they were making all those subs did our Lads seem to get together and go fellas

Bruno Fernandez is playing Center back here can we not just box this off now do you know what I mean nunz what you KN a bit just go and stand on him yeah you know what I mean we just keep kicking the ball to you and you the these are

There are times in FY and I know this is very basic and I the people like Clopper be screaming at us like talking about like but I do think there are times in footy when you just everyone over complicate and you’re like do you know when they’re

Playing a defense and the only Defender they’ve got there is Harry MaGuire you should be doing a bit better boys like you don’t need to over complicate it that that that’s just what’s so frustrating about it such a missed opportunity against the Poor Side and and you know them beating us you know

It’s not sour grapes and they’re just they’re just still not that good and and I can’t see them winning the thing he’ll probably be C you like but they’ll lose in the final I would imagine well we’re in the process of of trying to get a a

United a famous United uh YouTuber on the show for the the preview to the the United League game aren’t we and sort I’ll be saying to him is think about what you’ve done here though think about what you’ve done because it only dawned on me as after we got

Beat I know everyone was dismissing this including Guardiola a few weeks ago but they are creeping towards a double treble without anyone really talking about it to one I think and by United knocking us out they have in vly increase the chances of Man City doing the treble again because who’s going to

Stop Man City winning the FA Cup United sorry Lads that’s not going to happen that is not I’d be absolutely amazed if they play Man City and Man City do anything other than annihilate them then you look at the Champions League draw and think the only good thing about this

Season is we him with a Chance of doing something about it when we couldn’t last year so we’ve got Arsenal have got a chance of stopping them Chelsea have got a chance of stopping them United will have a chance of stopping them and we’ve got a chance in the league but United

Could have helped them get like one step closer to that so I hear people saying I know the phone and stuff again like you said D they’ve stopped us doing the quadruple and you’re like well may maybe they’d actually prefer City to do the double treble and then watch us do a

Quadruple including the Europa League I guess that’s the case but so I think I just thought i’ looked this up sorry mate um gakpo 13 13 for the season 13 goals four assists um so he’s above he’s above Diaz on both of those you know so

Diaz is 11 goals three assists so if we’re going to start throwing people under the bus and I’m not throwing Diaz under the bus I thought he was good yesterday he was a good attack and was a way that Liverpool got out time after time but this is why I raised him though

Because I I think there’s a I feel for gakpo because I think there’s a bit of a thing going on here where I used to say this about Harry Wilson sounds like a mad like Side Track to go on but Harry Wilson was was our best like Prospect

Coming through the youth ranks I remember seeing him I’ve mentioned this before but I remember seeing when he was about 15 playing at anfield in like a a kids game and he was unbelievable and he was just destined to get into Liverpool’s face team and what happened

Wasn’t me to do with Harry Wilson it was that we got better our face team club came in and turned us into a world class team and all of a sudden we were too good for Harry Wilson to get in the side and I think what’s happened with gakpo

Is not that he’s not good enough but our forward line has turned into because of the evolution since the the famous front three it’s turned into an all action think about the other four Strikers or the other four main attacking players Salah Nunes jot and Diaz they’re all high impact players do

If you throw any of them on us a sub they’re going to impact the game with with pace and with that just that like more exuberance that they bring to a match the gakpo that’s just not in his game it’s like bit like throwing firmino

On as a sub he’s not going to impact a game the same way as a sub and there is a I think there’s a strategic thing here for me which i’ love to have the conversation with klopp and I understand what the counter argument would be that well you potentially weakening your starting

Lineup but I think in in in an era of five subs and potential extra time a away Old Trafford there’s an argument to start gakpo yeah and say that look you do the first 60 yeah and then we’re bringing on a Diaz Nunes or against tired legs and that changes say the same

About Robertson as well you can throw him into the mix because you know essentially you know our subs started to make us worse um and there’s you know seemingly made them better which is mad I mean you know when I said before like I’m I’m not having them I’m not having

Them like you know like Anthony like he’s just he’s just lucky to goore I’m sorry but he’s just he just swivels and it’s something that falls for him in the area he’s not suddenly good he’s still [ __ ] yeah um and and so you know longer term even the rest of

This season I’d be shocked if they suddenly you know they suddenly go on a run and the racking up result we we won the game twice we won the game twice we we woned a normal time we woned an extra time and it’s our own fault that were

Not in the semi-finals the FA Cup 100% well and that’s seems to be what most people are saying as well which is why I started like that that like that wasn’t for me and United fans might argue against this but it’s one of and look we

How many games have we had where we we rob the opposition and we won a cup a few weeks ago where Chelsea should have just beaten us and they didn’t so it’s another one of them but we’re on the other side of it this time the reality

Is they are they are no better now than they were the day before they played us and all the criticism that we’ve seen La leveled them from ex United Pros like Neville and Kean we saw firstand like they are no better than I thought they were and it it’s just unbelievable that

We didn’t beat them yeah it really is and obviously we’ve got to go back there as well well let’s get into well go on you going to say short but all going to say is we’ve got to go back there and I’ll absolutely fancy us all day when we

Go back there Sunday 7th of April um hopefully I’ll get hopefully I’ll be there and I will fancy our chances all all day um and that isn’t being cocky Scout that is that isn’t being anything else that’s based on what I’ve seen of Liverpool what I’ve seen of them and as

You just said what’s happened yesterday doesn’t change a thing because I can’t imagine Liverpool being that loose in terms of the finishing in terms of the final ball again and you know when you said before about when we exchange messages at half time so obviously at

Half time we we turned it around didn’t we we two one up yeah and it was like and and I can tell you now no one in that ground thought what would unfold would you know no one could have predicted that United were going through at that point they were quiet they they

They they were like Liverpool have turned this round every time they go forward they look like the scoring a goal and we all just expected that to continue into the second half and it did we just didn’t put the ball in the back of the net we made the wrong decision

Over and over again and then we gifted them goals you know so I don’t know what nunz is doing I don’t know why I don’t know why he’s out there I don’t know why he passes inside I don’t know why he sets them up he’s Goose the manager said

Himself he was um Elliot similar you know it’s a it’s it’s a Daft one I don’t know what he’s trying to do it’s a bit like what Forest were like you know we were on air criticizing Forest w we saying what’s he doing yeah we can we

Can level the same atot there I still like the fella you know I still like nunz I still like the team I still like the manager I still like the squad I still like this season we’ve been on an unbelievable ride I’m we still on it and

Look it you know it’s a punch in the stomach it feels horrible but we’ll all be all right well let’s let’s just finish the like the the therapy of the negative stuff and then we’ll come into the positive stuff because the new NES and Elliot mistakes again two individual

Crazy errors the thing that’s been mentioned loads as well which we should we should mention is the setup for that corner in that like lit the last minute of extra time when we this is the thing about you with the tiredness thing United looked absolutely Goose after

Half an hour they even mentioned it in the commentary on the Telly like that the United midfielders are blowing here so it doesn’t surprise me at all that everyone in the ground was thinking this is done because at home even though we when we went One n one nil down I’ve

Never been more relaxed going one nil down at all Trafford in me life I I remember just thinking will it be sound cuz all those big holes in the of the the pitch is still there and we’re just going to run through them in a minute

And we did and then so the tiredness thing is I think is a bit of a red herring because we should have done the game we should the game should have been wrapped up in normal time and if the game was wrapped up in normal time we

Wouldn’t have got to extra time and we only look goo in in extra time but then once we are goo in extra time I don’t know whether you saw this in the ground there was a there was a moment in the in the middle of extra time before he got

Subbed where Diaz was TR trying to track back and you when you talking about someone who’s explosive and never gives in and all that and he looked like he was running on Sand and you’re like oh we’ve gone here like we’ve got a few lads who just legs have just completely

Gone and we need to make changes well bear in mind he had a break you know like with because of what happened with his ala and all that rightly so by the way does only van DJ’s play more minutes than this which is unbelievable isn’t it yeah and and

Especially when you can see the how he plays I was just about to say it’s not like well think about think about van dijk’s like movement on the pitch how many kilometers van dijk will have like run in those minutes compared to how many not not just how many kilometers

Diaz would will have run but the way in which he’s doing them he’s basically doing like shuttle Sprints all the time is and he’s like elbowing people and holding people off and you know it’s like permanently the benel music’s playing as he’s going around the pitch like keeps emerging with the ball and

You’re like how’s he doing that you know I’m not at watching him exactly yeah exactly but take we’ll take all that into account and how Goose we are wear and we know the players on the pitch know they’re Goose we know they’re Goose watching them klopp knows they’re Goose like he

Said after the game didn’t he it’s the first time I’ve seen my my team really struggling it’s crazy to me that with the senior Pros we’ve still got and we’ve got the and the coaching staff on the side we’ve gone we’ve got a corner at the end of the game and we’re just

Going to leave Connor Bradley standing there and put everyone not even we didn’t even have anyone cuz endo and Elliot both end up on the edge of the box so there’s no one even there to break a to stop a break Beyond just the edge of the box so think about being

Conor Bradley in that moment when you’re like [ __ ] like I’ve got the United Team basically running at me to win a game in stoppage time here that was again I near give them it in in normal time you know like everyone seems to forgot about you

Know they had a chance to to have boxed it there as well which again is mad so we didn’t learn from that either but I think the thing with that is again like you know me S of theme for the day is is the baby and the bath water and just you

Know let’s not get let’s not go too far down the road of absolutely hammering them the thing that’s got us to where we are in in in many respects is like you said before all the risk taken that we do it feels like it’s like theyve gone we’ll just throw everything into this

Season let’s have no regret about anything and it’s just that maybe because they’ve done that so many times this season and it’s worked they just didn’t have it in them this time to go just lock up the shop you know what I mean but it’s done that that is I mean

When when Elliott scores and and it’s it’s you talk about look that’s lucky it’s taking it it’s taking a deflection that should have been it shut the thing down keep the ball and as you say don’t make mad take mad risks like throwing everyone up for a corner like that why

Yeah but this this it’s because they back themselves to score off this does t into the longer stuff doesn’t it so if if you’re going to stick with us and come over and watch us on patreon we’re going to we’re going to talk a bit about um Michael Edwards coming back and and

The new sport director and we’re going to we’re going to check in on on jabby alono because he’s still the clear favorite be pleased to know by the way M that um there’s some other little thing that’s popped up here that I have no idea why and neither will you and now

We’ll need to work this out so someone was saying in into the button where they would they would be able to give us you know the the super cash or whatever it’s called I’ll just keep making new words up for it um there’s just sounds like something

From like an 80s strike it looky or yeah instead of that is just a smiley face though yeah what cuz someone said why is that Lads I don’t know I don’t know yeah that’s it’s mad that is it where the wrong people to ask Ju Just

Just go on um you know buy as a coffee instead coffee that works well just go old school and send us money in the post in a c or just come up to us in the street give the next thing came then I like that thing to say well stamps IL

Legal tender you know fell stopped me at the I went to see cast on H satday oh nice and a fell stopped me in the gig and said um I just wanted to say love the late challenge um I’ve got cop’s book as well really like Paul stuff too

And all that and he said um I just wanted to say that to you cuz you always say on the show oh you should have said you should have come up you should have said alow so he said I’m saying alow so fair place you make that was a nice

Little very nice my my sister had one that she was away on me brother-in-laws like brother-in-law once you go was on a ski trip with his work big like business networking thing and my sister went this year and someone was talking about the late challenge podcast like there she’d

Mentioned it in a message to but I just assumed she’d started the conversation to me and said oh Paul coach my brother and it it turned out that wasn’t the case like they were in a conversation and someone was like like oh yes start talking about us and then start was like

Oh I used to watch that but now I watch them on the late challenge it’s it’s boss blah blah blah and she chipped and going that’s my brother I was like oh did that came up before they knew you were my sister yeah she’s like yeah I

Like look at that go get mention in val it is good all that there was a fellow next to me as well yesterday I M had a good chat with him and he was like you being the snook yeah and I was like No

And he was like I’m the one who sent you the thing saying like you should try and get you know get in at Manchester like and I did try and get in another Manchester one but all the good days and the good matches are gone I just want to

See Ronnie that’s R like that’s on me book let’s see Ronnie oan play new live but anyway we’ll get there I want to see him too because I don’t think I’ve ever seen him but you oh you’ve been haven’t you I’ve I’ve been a few times but like it was probably before he

Was as well you’re doing the thing now where we ask each other about stuff that’s in in our memory I don’t know I can’t remember who I saw um it would it was a Preston it it would have it would have been Henry’s era so

But I can’t remember whether I saw him I remember seeing Roger feder at Wimbledon that was that stuck in me memory that was good what’s happening why are people putting things that make no sense in the in the comments I’m not looking on like what vas of flowers says I love Steve

Nichel in the a rap video I mean that’s nice Like I’m made up for for of ours of flowers I’m just wondering what the relevance to what we’ve been saying so I say to my mom all the time what’s that got to do with the price of fish I start

My niece do you say something and like remember when Rafa used to do this Rafa used to use Spanish sayings and translate them word for where to English and then joural to kick off because it didn’t make any sense it’s like a piece of sugar on the

M yeah do you remember that one and everyone’s like what I was like yeah but think it through like our sayings don’t make sense if you translate them literally do they and I I say this to my mom all the time you just say something

I’ll go to it what’s that got to do with the price of fish I me nie a few years ago my niece was like why’ you keep saying that about fish and I was like what me n say something and then you just say the saying about fish you like

This one M um Juke Valentino obviously his real name his real name yeah hey Lads could you talk about the footballers collapsing or are you too scared I has been speaking out for ages yeah cuz he’s a good one to follow me yeah seems full of sense not

Weird at all so you want us to do conspiracy theories well we’ve already done that mate yeah don’t don’t worry come and see us on the page and you’ll get you’ll get you’re going to get some conspiracy theory I’m lying robal break like what what’s the bit

That I’m scared of tell me what I’m meant to be scared of mate anyway go on WE we’ve digressed like we always do we always do but well there’s what it’s it’s a nice dig because there’s something I did want to mention before we go into the like we we’ll WRA up

We’ve got 10 minutes left we’ll wrap up on the positive stuff and you sent me a picture of half and half United and Liverpool scarves outside the ground you know it’s just mad to me that they they exist and look when I saw he was buying

Them when I saw them I just thought well you know and to be fair I’ve talked about things iard United fans singing and saying I did actually hear them singing a song some of these Lads that I was walking up by about if you what you

Are if you if you wear a half and half and I kind of agreed um but yeah it it to me it’s just so wrong and it does it goes against like you know the fan culture that I’ve grown up with and some people are now just say it’s not a thing

And you’re just being an ny old man and if people want to buy them let them buy them and all of them thing but I just don’t get like if I’m if I’m one of the 9,000 in our end why would I want something with their badge around my

Neck or around my son’s neck cuz you know I like oh it’s just the souvenir of the day and and you know it’s like it’s like what when you used to buy a program well it’s not that it’s an item of clothing yeah it’s it’s it’s a thing

Where you show your support didn’t someone make a half and half share at some point and you like we’re taking yeah I mean hat scarf on a badge to give Mi a shout out I know that he does um an half and half scarf Liverpool and Liverpool reserves yeah that’s a good

One is right have told you about my my I had always reminds me of this I probably mentioned it to you before I had a boss a partner in the the first big law I worked in when I was just a trainee and I remember saying to him once H who you

Support and and his his answer was Liverpool and man united that’s what his answer was to who he support yeah and I I remember in that moment where was he from Warrington he was from he was from lipo but I don’t know whereabouts on the map but I remember thinking in that

Moment I’d lost I lost all respect that was the first conversation I ever had with this man and Jo you just lose all respect for on in one sentence yeah and I was like well me and you won’t be getting on then so he buys one then so

There’s there’s one I guess one he wasn’t the type of fell who’d buy a scarf outside the ground well I mean I imagine a lot of people will say it’s people who just come B at lists they they don’t know anything about the game they don’t support either team they just

Paid Grands for a ticket and they want to come and take off go to a Liverpool man united but how many of them are in the be that you make a box of them can I mean no I mean there definitely wasn’t any in the in the upper tier of the

Liverpool support I can tell you that I I didn’t spot any imagine if someone had one on in the ground it it honestly baffles me it does baffle me and look I suppose the they’re not for me and all that kind of thing but I tweeted it and a lot of people

Seem to agree with me I don’t think that that’s not an old man thing is it I’m not having that I know we things to us lately that are old men things that we didn’t even know like things like memes and gifts are apparently an old man thing now you’re

Like [ __ ] people people are just being off now come on Phil bab’s better than canate is he Dave yeah I mean I think Dave just wanted to shout out there didn’t he well in Dave Wood 1982 for the most ridiculous comment on here even more ridiculous than the one about Matt

Latisia well done me Phil Bob was not better than canate but that’s one that hasn’t been mentioned canate is just like he he’s got one of those like mysterious injuries now hasn’t he where it looked like he just had a knock and now he’s missed three games this is the

Thing this is why no one wins a quadruple though isn’t it yeah because you know Liverpool have played five games more than man united since January and then then there’s another stat I think I sent it to you before didn’t I about sort of the recent minutes and all that yeah and and

You know their workload compared to ours and all the rest of it and it yeah yeah this you sent it to me so because obviously klopp referenced the uh fatigue and got a cob on with a a journalist and stormed out this was our 9th match across four different

Competitions in 29 days and the second time we played 120 Minutes in that in that sequence which is mad isn’t it so so’s poor um if if it was canata he would have broken the post against Chelsea with his balls you know the famous Phil bab incident

I like that M thank you right we’ve got five minutes let’s let’s end on even more positive news and that um going back to what you said before and klopp said the same look in general the team’s in an outstanding situation at the moment we got through all these different different situations ABS

Absolutely exceptional today we could have won the game and we would have deserved it but we lost it the first positive that I thought well not the first one cuz the first one I thought was it’s a good kick up the ass I think

This is like I I I often think of Rocky movies in in life it helps me get through and we I think we talked about this D we talk about why is klopp so popular and it’s because he has the he likes them he has well it doesn’t

Surprise me at all like he has that Jo losing and winning thing that all great stories have it it’s why Guardiola is not that popular and guardiola’s teams are not that popular it’s why Floyd Mayweather may be the best pound for pound boxer of all time but no one

Really liked them cuz it’s boring watching someone just win every week people like The Comeback story and and it did remind me I was thinking about it as I was watching it thinking afterwards like which Rocky is this like and it was that second half was a bit like in Rocky

3 where do you know he’s got a bit he’s just got to bit comfortable and then he has a fight and he gets beaten up and it’s like right you’ve got to you’ve got to find yourself again now You’ got to find the meanness inside yeah and come

Back and I think that for the like for this end of the season that’s potentially the best thing could have happened to us cuz now when we go to Old Trafford in three weeks kpp’s got the perfect team talk same for when we go to gooderson we can’t go there going look

These are crap we’re just going to beat them you’ve got to go and actually beat them so we’ve got to come back from the international break win 10 games and if you win those 10 games you’re going to win the league so that’s the aim get

Some players back from injury um but J back yeah J the main J is the main one cuz both there’s two games on the run now if we’d have brought J on as a SW we’ have beat man City and we de beat man united I have no doubt about that

Something that really annoys me on on S base and and I’m for the first time ever I’ve going oh no such um so if you if a game goes to extra time or penalties they put it down on your record is a draw with an aster on so draw with an aster yesterday

Lad yeah yeah yeah so we drew uh but you know if you run through those games now next game Liverpool V Brighton at home then Liverpool V Sheffield United at home then we go to Old Trafford you have to win all three of them and well we

Have to win all 10 probably yeah but why aren’t we winning those next three what is there to be sad about I can’t wait to get in the ground again for Brighton I’m going car is going um we are short odds to win that game the ground will be the

Ground will be back like this is this is now we’re now at that point where we can do the fan thing 100% all start saying to each other every time you see another Liverpool fan you need to be bang up for that Brighton game you need to bring your A game let’s get

Behind them let’s get the ground rocking cuz there’s a title there to be well look and look for everyone who’s going to the ground to the ground themselves you you’re counting down the games you’ve got left to watch Club yeah that’s literally where we are now there’s a handful of games left cuz

We’ve got we’ve got 10 games in the league I don’t know I don’t know what the split is but let’s say half of them are home games and then you’ve got potentially two in Europe oh no sorry five so we’ve only got seven counted atanta so a maximum of seven home games

Left on the clap that’s it and we’re done so go we make the most of it because absolutely we are we are fast approaching the end of this the other positive to end on or two things we’re we’re going to talk we’ll we might talk about City and Arsenal and the EUR

European draws because I think they have def definitely helped us since we were we were last on um two good things we we love our Omens don’t we and you sent me this Jed re who’s the I think he’s the official Club statistici isn’t he yeah

The last time Liverpool lost 4-3 in the FA Cup in 1990 to Crystal Palace we ended the season as League champions so not a bad om and the other thing which I I do like is I like that we can compare man united to Crystal Palace in that context as well and to

Finish on them this might be enough to keep his job and if they decide to keep him as their manager considering what we saw I’m more than happy with that and it goes back to something we’ve often said we like I’d do this if I owned the

Football club I’d be keeping an eye on what the Rival fans think of our manager like do they want you to keep them because think about how everyone’s reacting to klopp and I know this is it’s a no-brainer every rival fan will be delighted when klopp leaves at the

End of the season regardless of who we get next like it doesn’t matter they just want Klo gone we want ten hard to get his contract renewed that’s like like I remember every time salaw won a game I was made up cuz I was like add another 10 games to his tenure that

Would be fine maybe I wish I had sent you this now just so but I’m just doing my usual thing of not remembering who it was H I’m quickly trying to find them but did you see a tweet that seemed to do quite well um from someone who just

Does some kind of like West Ham Channel um and he was like sorry Li it opened with sorry Liverpool fans but no one likes klopp he’s not a nice fell blah blah BL all based on you know that he got a bit of a titty lip with the H

Reporter and it was like so what are you apologizing for I don’t care like he’s the manager of Liverpool the club I support we’ve won virtually everything under him that he just needs the Europa League for the full I’m still in that and we’ve got every chance of winning

That I do you think I’m bothered what you think about the m i don’t give a [ __ ] I love for people like that as well though people love doing this on the internet like purporting to speak on behalf of everybody else sorry sorry Li fans I’ll just chip in on behalf of

Every other fan in the world we don’t like him like I’m not sure that’s true mate not not really B like not not here for you to like I want toiv poool manager to to you know give Liverpool every chance of winning every competition to fight

Corner and he’s done all of that and we’ve had an unbelievable time with this manager I don’t a I’m like what a Weston fun but I prefer it when they ate him like why do I want you to like our manager I don’t care I like I we all

Know this when you’ve got those players who play for your team who everybody else hates but you love that makes them better like I’d prefer that you don’t need to like our manager leave us alone anyway we’ll leave it there we are going to we are going to talk we’re going to

Roll on into the p patreon show and we’re going to talk about um the European draws we’re going to talk about a bit of the running and we’re going to have a chat about Michael Edwards because I don’t know whether you saw the article in the athletic about him coming

Back but it was really interesting and there’s a lot there’s a lot to it um and there may also be some well there’s going to be we’re going to have a little chat about ja alono and there’s some random stuff in there as well if we get

To it so come and join us there if you’re if you’re watching live and you want to carry on watching live go to the patreon now and once we’ve um shuffled everything around we we’ll be there in about 10 or 15 minutes I would think if you’re listening or watching to this

Recorded watching it back do the usual thing you know if you if you want to come and subscribe come and do the free trial if you don’t want to do that but you want to throw us few quid to help support what we’re doing keep us going

You can go to the BIOS coffee link now and if you don’t want to do any of that which we completely understand in this day and age um share it with your mate tell people about it like the video on on YouTube leave a review on a

Podcast app saying how good you think it is if you think it’s crap don’t leave a review anyway and that’s it thanks for watching thanks for listening we’ll see you next weeks