How the Nuggets match up with the Best of the West + East’s Play-In Race | The Lowe Post

In this episode of The Lowe Post, Zach and Adam Mares of DNVR Sports check in on the Nuggets and break down all the key matchups at the top of the Western Conference. Then Nekias Duncan of the Dunker Spot joins to talk about playoff races in the middle of the East: Knicks, Sixers, red-hot Heat, Hawks without Trae Young, Magic’s present and future, the frisky Raptors, the Pacers with Pascal Siakam, and much more.

0:00 Intro
12:23 Is this anything?
23:35 How the Nuggets match up with the Thunder, Timberwolves & Clippers
43:38 Duncan joins
49:04 Heat
1:02:27 Pacers
1:12:35 Hawks
1:20:07 Raptors
1:27:54 Magic
1:35:41 Suns
1:40:41 Clippers

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And now the low post welcome to the low post podcast you know there’s a team in Denver I think they’re pretty good they won the championship last year from what I recall 39 of 19 and Nia yic in his last three games 21 19 and 15 on 10 of 10

Shooting 295 and 14 on 12 of seven shooting now that’s against the Wizards and the Blazers whatever you just congratulations Denver you beat bad teams you could throw those away if you’re a Denver skeptic going into the redot Golden State Warriors toast to the NBA for the last couple of weeks can

They become a contender again a cool 326 and 16 on 13 of 24 shooting reasserting his grip on the MVP and that was a landmark win if the Nuggets need a landmark win they probably don’t uh I thought it was a fantastic uh playoff level performance from them they brought

Their a defense we can talk about that uh they brought their a playoff rotation with the twist of Zeke Naji thrown in which I was happy to see and they overcame a rather large early deficit and a loud crowd and now as we bringing Adam Mars from dmvr Sports and other

Places they are facing a next five game slate where we’re going to find out how much does this team really care about homec court advantage home against the Kings home against the Heat at Lakers home against Phoenix home against Boston the nuggets are currently third behind Minnesota and Oklahoma City and uh they

Had home court last year for the finals run of course they have played uh 27 home games and 31 Road games they got some home games coming to him and they have certainly come out of the shoot here in the second half of the Season like they do care about maybe getting

Homec court advantage I just want to give the biggest broadest question for someone who lives this team every day we just don’t talk about them at ESPN because they’re in Denver I mean you know I have a soft spot for the Nuggets I love the Nuggets I talk about them a

Lot but and they’re just I think people think they’re just kind of coasting along waiting for the playoffs to start uh they are tied for ninth in offense tied for 10th in defense that’s a good that’s a good number plus 4.1 per 100 possessions that’s eighth seems underwhelming right you start to look

Back and you’re like how many championship teams that have had net ratings in like that three four five range can’t be that many oh I remember one last year’s Denver Nuggets because their two best players appear to thrive under high pressure situation Adam moris where are we on this team you

Feeling good you feeling confident is confident as you were a year ago I think probably as confident as a year ago because of course last year they hadn’t done it before so they hadn’t proven it this year they have but to your point they’ve been underwhelming but I have a

Theory about this e that I’m curious what you think so every year their their plus minus is lower than you would expect given their record and given what you think of them plus four I don’t even know what the number you said plus four or something there are teams that are

Plus n plus 10 and I think that the reason for that is Denver is I’ve compared them to Floyd Mayweather they’re not going to throw a bunch of knockout punches and win easy and do all these big oh they won by 38 points tonight and they did this or that they

Just kind of always put you in a bind slowly work you down and beat you and they beat you with mid-range yic beats you with floaters they beat you with a very slow pace halfcourt offense and then they get to clunch time and they really defend and they it’s not that

They eek out a win it’s just that they strategically wear you down into a win and the result of that is one I think you you know when you’re not dialed in you’re not going to get some of those easy you know you don’t build giant leads so you’re a little more vulnerable

And two they just happen to win a lot of games by seven points six points five points and you never felt like they were going to lose but it’s just that’s just their style so watching them play joic Murray Aaron Gordon the starting lineup looks exactly like last year if

Not a little bit better questions about the bench but yes I feel confident about them because they look like the team that dominated the playoffs last year yeah their starters uh which is if not the best lineup in the NBA um tied for Boston with the quote just the magical

Fake title best lineup in the NBA they’re certainly Mo the most aesthetically pleasing lineup to watch in the NBA just like like a Magic Basketball combination of skills uh plus 14 per possessions they are plus 14 with Murray and joic on the floor um I guess

I would ask this do you care more about seating at the top like for for homec court purposes or do you care more about who Denver’s first round opponent is because if you look at the projection systems right now they’re overwhelmingly likely to be third or fourth now some

Some systems give them like a 30% chance at one and two some give them a little bit less than that if they’re third or fourth and I’m not ready to posit that because this team first of all they have three games left against Minnesota um tough match up for them but still three

Games to go they lost the first one so they can make up ground there easy but if they’re three and four you you got a grab bag that’s like it’s Luca maybe here it’s maybe the Suns dudes over here maybe things break right no disrespect for the Kings but the Kings the Pelicans

Nobody knows what to make of um what are you more focused on in terms of like projecting out the playoff path well I think I align with the nuggets in what they have said about this very question which is a couple of factors here one we’re not going to know I don’t think

We’re going to know matchups until the final day this year this season because there’s so much so many teams are jumbled up one through four and then five through through 10 so I don’t think we’re going to know the matchups and it’s almost difficult to play that

Matchup game and then secondly if you look at Minnesota and Oklahoma City and I don’t I’m not trying to disrespect them I love both of those teams and how they play but they’re unproven and I think Denver did this last year even when they were looking at it is teams

Like Memphis are they are we sure they’re going to be in the Conference Finals and are we going to push ourselves to get that one seed if we feel like hey that team’s less than a coin flip to make it there I think Denver probably looks at it similar and

When they were asked this question about seeding or opponent I actually heard a common theme from all of the players and the coaching staff which is we don’t care about either of those it’s more about us finding the style of play we need in the playoffs and finding Rhythm

There because over the course of a long season you have moments where you find that and then you have moments where you fall out of it and I think they’re just looking at we’re going to win if we can just play our basketball which we found and peaked going into the playoffs last

Year they peaked in the playoffs if we find that Rhythm I think they feel confident whether they’re the three seed the four the two or whatever and the matchups are going to be the matchups whatever they fall the last day of the Season yeah I there are certain like I

Just would rather not see Luca across the court from me for like he just just terrifies me just by himself U and they’re playing pretty well they got blown up by the Pacers last night but they’re playing pretty well um you were going to say something about luk I could

Tell you had you had a you had something gonna throw it to the other side and say you know Gafford lively that’s the easiest match up for joic so you’re right Luca scary but that’s a zero resistance front court for for Nika yic so I would look at that that’s gonna be

A series with 240 point triple double edges from two guys so your point is is well made but I think it’s equally as tough for them on the other side well you were you got ahead of where I was going which is I just think offensively I there’s no matchup that

Gives me any anxiety about the Denver Nuggets offense now there are are little things that have happened this year that are interesting to me but I just think this is Unstoppable is too strong a word it’s hard for me to see any defense holding them to let’s say League average

Or Worse offense over a seven game series yic is too good he’s the best player in the NBA he has now based on this stretch of games I think gone back in front in the MVP leaderboard for me and for probably most voters over SGA

Who’s making a hell of a case I just don’t and and I do think something about the way they play slower at times with mix I like when they mix in like throw the ball you know throw the Home Run pass like get Aon Gordon some buckets and transition but methodical patient

And with Murray and yic is ility to hit shots from everywhere on the court and my God is Murray a big shot shot maker a tough shot shot maker like spinning fading mid-rangers ridiculous how good he is I do think their offense is more built for the playoffs than even the

Average contending team defensively I mentioned their 10th in defense um that Warriors game like I don’t I wouldn’t say the Warriors are like the white whale for the Nuggets but there is a lot of people including people within the Warriors who are curious to see how they operating at Full Throttle whatever that

Means for them now would match up with a healthy nuggets team remember they did beat him in the playoffs on the on their way to the title but that was not a healthy nuggets team no Murray no Porter it’s kind of a fake nuggets team really

Like in tribute to yic that it was even semi-competitive you know this idea that well you know we spam that Steph Draymond pick and roll we can force yach to guard in space you know uh stretch Denver to its Breaking Point get him running around and the Nuggets showed up

For that game like they had heard all that and we’re like oh we’re not we’re not really afraid of this like yic can go up to the level of the screen against Steph Steph’s GNA get some step back threes some you know he’ll shake them a couple times draymond’s Gonna Roll and

We have faith in our rotations behind the play especially if you give us just one let alone two guys who are just so so three-point Shooters where hey maybe Aaron Gordon can sneak in from the strong side corner which you’re not supposed to do provide a little bit more

Support and if you watch them move if you watch the help Defenders move on some of those step Draymond pick and rolls it was beautiful to watch and at the same time out at the same time one guy in then he recovers then the other guy from the other Corner comes in it

Was beautiful they were up for it and if they defend at that level with that level of connectivity and urgency you can talk to me about the bench and maybe we’ll get there they’re just they they I’ve said all year the West still goes through Denver and these next five games will be

Telling I I still think they’re the best team in the west well I want to go to your point here about the pick and roll because I think it’s an interesting one for understanding Denver Denver I think we’ve talked about this before they can’t defend easy because they don’t

Have the athleticism and the rim protection that’s how you win easy but they can win difficult and that’s why there’s always these Marquee games these measur games where they look like they did last night it’s very mentally exhausting and mentally taxing to play the style of defense that they played in

The playoffs you can use that energy and joic is the key to all of this when you look at where has joic improved as a player he continues to get physically stronger I think every year just as most people do you know up until I don’t know

31 32 you just get more more strength I mean for me for me it just continues into my mid-40s just it’s just just physically I get in better shape stronger every year I I was meaning not athletes of your level Zack of course but um but yoke you know the other area

He’s gotten a lot better I think and he actually made reference to this in an interview not too long ago was that he feels like he is improving his defensive basketball IQ and it’s so interesting because we think of him having a 100 IQ right because we always think of that as

As offensive but he was talking about really studying and trying to learn the defensive uh edges that you can gain and I think when you watch him closely you see that and last night you know the pick and role when you play the drop covers that they or when you play up I’m

Sorry up at the level of the screen the way he likes to play there’s a lot of cat and mouse going on it’s like a giant Paper Rock Scissors game and he has gotten so good at that because his reaction time is inherently quick he’s just a very quick reactor but two I

Think his anticipation gets better so last night he has four steals I think he has even more deflections a lot of those in the fourth quarter and in the clutch and I just think that he has gotten a lot better at D being Draymond esque almost in and reading and anticipating

What’s going on and making quick breaks on the ball and that’s a big reason why I think that they can be a good defensive team in playoffs I’m gonna ask you a series of questions and I just want I want your I just want to go rapid fire through some

Things category one is things that have changed this year statistically for the nuggets and I want you to explain to me why or if it’s anything it’s we’re kind of playing is this anything like the Orlando Magic broadcast does my beloved Orlando Magic broadcast um offensively they are 28th and three-point rate they

Were never a high three-point team percentage wise their portion of shot attempts from three is almost unchanged but the league is taking more threes they were 22nd last year so so their threes have fallen to almost bottom of the league their shots at The Rim are down slightly they were sixth last year

Eighth this year down two% of course now that means they’re up in mid-range shots is that anything I would guess it’s not because I would imagine that those numbers are largely about the non-starting lineup numbers those are probably largely numbers that are staggered lineups and different things you had Bruce Brown

Last year who was very good at putting pressure on the rim I think it was one of the things they everybody thinks you lost his defense you lost this I think they lost his ball handling and they lost his his toughness and they lost that pressure that he can put on the rim

And then secondly I think there is a little bit of Championship fatigue in that specific aspect and I look at Aaron Gordon’s first 15 games of the Season maybe 20 games of the Season he specifically was not putting pressure on the rim the same way and he even has

Opened up about about it a little bit short off season fatigue mentally not there so I I would imagine that those numbers have normalized over the back half of the season and I would imagine that they normaliz when you look at the starting lineup and take away the

Christian Browns and the pton Watsons who are not good at finishing or getting to the room well that’s that’s part of it is you’d like to have someone so much attention has been paid to the bench and we will inevitably discuss that they just don’t bring anyone Off the Bench

That is a really a threat to shoot like Christian Brown is not going to be guarded and he’ll have games where he makes three out of four and punishes that style of Defense pton Watson’s up to 34% I love I love everything about pton Watson I just would like them to

Have one guy that would come off the bench and make you think this guy can hit shots that’s what strw looked like he was going to be and I think there’s a wh if scenario where he doesn’t what he he miss like almost two months of time

Or something like that where if he stays healthy I think he could have cracked their postseason rotation and become that player now it’s interesting that Naji got those minutes last night he he theoretically is a stretch five not really in reality though um so that’s what we’re getting at so okay so you’re

On the on the it’s not really anything I kind of agree with you I think their offense is what it is um defense I mentioned their defense looks kind of stouter to Me overall and on some nights in particular when they’re geared up um third fewest three-point attempts

Allowed in the League this year is that a thing I mean it’s not like they allowed a ton last year but they were average average to third in terms of opponent three-point volume is a big deal what is going on there I would guess that the biggest thing here is the

Length that they’ve added I mean one of the differences between last year and this year pton Watson’s enormous you know 69 with the I think he has one of the longest standing reaches of a guy of a guy his height he has his really long arms closes out phenomenally tenacious

Christian Brown also has a lot of length so my hunch would be that they just have a lot of length when they play their core guys even Reggie Jackson is one of those abnormally long wingspan guys so when they play their full eight nine ninan rotation defensively they have a

Lot of length to close out on you so that would be my hunch I think they have more good you know solid Defenders this year just in general um but I would say that this one to me is half true it’s probably a Hal truth as I think a lot of

These three-point numbers uh are always let no no more than half true well maybe the length also explains this because this one my eyes open a little bit they’re sixth in lowest field goal percentage allowed at The Rim sixth they were 29th last year wow um and jic still

Is not really a rim protector opponents are still shooting well with him near the rim um is that anything that’s that’s that could be just I mean I think Michael Porter Jr has continued to make strides defensively AG is what he is by the way you mentioned got off to a slow

Start pressuring The Rim the last month he seems like in half of their games he’s like Out For Blood he’s out to like bludgeon people near the basket and do like a flex over them while getting an and one which I love when he’s doing

That I’m like oh uh oh this is a serious game just it’s just something that number is interesting to me I don’t know the defensive part of it I’m not so sure I wasn’t aware of this number which makes me think you know it wasn’t something that was jumping off the

Screen when I watch them that they’re really protecting it hasn’t to me either so I would imagine that that one probably has a little bit of noise to it but again Denver’s numbers last year were so disguised by how bad their bench was as as is the case this year it was

Diff it was bad in a different direction this year they have pton Watson Christian Brown who have played almost every single game this year and those guys are really good Defenders like even for young players they’re really good Defenders their weaknesses come in other spots so I would imagine there’s a

Little bit of I just think Denver has more defensive upside but I would guess that the number overall is probably pretty noisy now I may be let’s just do the bench thing I may be just so seduced by Murray and yic and the beauty of this starting five and how

All the pieces fit together that I have never really been all that concerned about the departures of Bruce Brown and Jeff Green and with respect to Jeff Green like it’s really Bruce Brown like Jeff Green is a replaceable NBA player at this point even as your eighth man I

Wasn’t concerned at the time I wasn’t concerned when I knew almost nothing about how pton Watson was GNA play this year and how Julian strw might or might not play this year and then the numbers sucked again the plus minus sucks joic they’re plus 10 with jic on the floor

And minus n with jic off the floor they’re minus 17 when Murray per 100 possessions is 17 with Murray on the floor and joic on the bench that’s cleaning the glass that’s those are just bad numbers and yet through it all I’m like yeah I’m not that worried because I I Christian

Brown showed up when it mattered last year now he he he’s his minutes shrunk during the Phoenix series and went back up during the finals but he showed up pton Watson has my trust I’m in on Payton Watson and I mentioned playoff rotation you saw it last night and

You’ve seen it in Snippets and you I know you because I follow you on Twitter your antennas go up when you see it last night we saw Aaron Gordon at Center in in parts of the nonic minutes with Jamal Murray on the floor they have not gone

To that look very much this year that’s like 80 minutes they have with Murray on Gordon on yic off then in the second half when they played Naji I think they had Gordon and Michael Porter Jr on the floor at the same time for at least part

Of that with Naji and with either Reggie Jackson or Jamal Murray or both I just think they mix and matchet enough and mix in some K kcp tends to linger pretty long with the Y they they’re kind of attached to each other mix in enough of

The starters so that you don’t get too much Reggie Jackson Jamaal Murray together minutes look every team is vulnerable to injuries and like yeah one guy gets hurt the whole kind of puzzle falls apart even if it’s like even if it’s pton Watson getting hurt the whole

Puzzle kind of falls apart in terms of what we’re talking about if they have everyone I might just be naive I might be downplaying the experience factor and the veteran Savvy and all that I just haven’t cared for a second this year should I care more I think you’re spot

On with it honestly and the reason is Denver more than any other team in the NBA Denver likes to play their starting lineup heavy minutes this has been true the entirety of Michael Malone of the Michael Malone era since before they were a contending team he just

Likes his starting lineup playing a lot of minutes which means you have a lot of minutes that are just your bench and to me the number is not yic off the court because that makes it sound like there’s no solution to it the real thing is

DeAndre Jordan on the court Zeke Naji on the court as a center in in previous Seasons you know since basically Mason plumbley they haven’t had a very good backup center a very good proven backup center and so they go to these lineups I think knowing that they’re handicapped

Knowing that they don’t work and then it looks it makes everybody else look bad you know then Christian Brown’s struggling and you got all this stuff this year and and the playoffs this was true last year but this year they’ve gone to it a handful of times Aaron

Gordon at Center okay we’re going to play two star we’re going to play Murray Porter and Gordon and now we’re going to throw Christian and Payton around him those lineups have crushed what I mean to say is when they have gone to their playoff rotation which is just eight

Guys and we’re going to play a little heavier minutes they have looked phenomenal not just good they have looked phenomenal and that’s what happened last year in the playoffs you are right it does mean that they’re thin an injury or or even foul trouble maybe is going to make things a little bit

Difficult in a series maybe even more so than most teams like if you look at Dallas they lose Josh Green to injury okay Dante XOM you basically the same role you guys you’re doing fine you just swap one in for the other Denver I think has eight guys that can play and they

Have eight gu an eight-man rotation that allows them to have two or three of their most important players that makes all of their lineups make sense so I don’t think it’s an issue at all I’m with you if they get to the playoffs healthy they’re going to have 48 minutes

Of very very good rotational play I also just think fundamentally there is no good answer to Nicole yic and the league has not found one yet and even last night I mean Draymond is one of maybe four guys in the entire NBA who can be kind

Of a pain for joic because a he’s super low to the ground and physical and yic can’t really back him down like he can 95% of NBA big man and Draymond gets a lot of leeway from the refs to be super physical because he’s Draymond Green he’s undersized he’s a defensive player

Of the year he’s one of the greatest Defenders of his generation once he settled into the game I don’t it he didn’t really have too much trouble with the Warriors and you’ve seen teams flirt with it this year Boston did it I I think Indiana maybe did it with Miles Turner Golden

State half did it for portions of last night oh we’re not going to send too much help we’ll like do the little half slides here half slide there maybe try to time a second guy coming when he picks up his dribble that you’re he’s just gonna roast you in the playoffs if

You don’t send help I don’t even think he really looked bothered too much by Draymond and if he’s not bothered by Draymond he’s not going to be bothered by anybody but but one thing that is different this year compared to last year when they went 16 and four in the

Playoffs and Blitz through everybody is the West is better yeah the West is better at the top it’s better around them it’s better everywhere like if you get Luca in the first round or you get Zion in it’s just the nightmare every single round um and to review last year

They uh lost one game to Minnesota one game to the Lakers and in between two games to Phoenix right is that right that’s correct no they swept the Lakers I’m sorry swept the Lakers of course they swept the Lakers the greatest Miami yeah the greatest sweep in the history

Of the NBA by the by the losing team um let’s talk about the top three in the west around them this year okay um Minnesota they are o 0 and one against Minnesota three games left Oklahoma City That season series is over Denver went one and three joic missed

The last game but Murray played all four I believe Clippers uh the nuggets are up 21 with one game remaining and have more or less owned the Clippers since the bubble although the Clippers won the most recent game in a game that felt important for them which of those three

Matchups worries you the most for the nuggets and why well I will say that Oklahoma City worries me the least and I just those games you mentioned that you know people were available for that one I think they were missing a key starter in every

Single one of them and I just feel very confident that y I always look at it and go is yic have a good matchup then that’s where everything starts and I think that that’s one of the easier matchups they just don’t physically have somebody to match up with them so

They’re the EAS you one thing that’s interesting to me about Oklahoma City yeah is when you take the giddy element of it out and you don’t allow any team to stash their Center on Giddy and you now then you open up the C the chess match

Of like will they try to put yic on Dort at all and D’s a better shooter but is not super Dynamic with the ball if you get to a situation where jic has got to guard Chet for heavy heavy possessions in a playoff and he’s done it obviously

In the regular season because people aren’t going to get too crazy in the regular season with tactics and stuff the difference between Chad and Draymond is Chet’s a legit pick and pop threat and that’s a that’s if you put that guy with four shooters or three Shooters and

Shay around him that gets interesting to me but I I do think Denver is just so big and Polished that I mean obviously I’m Pi I would pick Denver to beat the Thunder of the series but that’s just one wrinkle I I would be in my back

Pocket if I were the Thunder okay continue I think Denver would have a hard time guarding him for sure I mean even without that wrinkle I will say that I’ve watched enough joic playoff series that guys that are giving up a significant weight Advantage tend to

Foul out against joic a lot and I think that that would probably happen in that series that they would be able to get him onto because I don’t think they would have him guard yic but I think they would be able to get him on there

And and draw fouls and by the way Aaron Gordon’s very good at that as well so I that that would to me is the is the least and again I love the Thunder this is not shade at them the Clippers are interesting because I think they’re more

Talented and they present more of a of of a challenge if you just look at the rosters and they have the bigs to combat them but to me Oklahoma or the Minnesota Timberwolves who are by the way designed by Tim Conley with this crazy lineup with with bigs and with length on the

Perimeter to me is a team that was built to beat the Denver Nuggets I think that was a team that Tim Conley saw two years ago when he went over there and said guys here’s the future of the of the Western Conference that’s the team

That’s going to be on top and we have to start building for them so you have the two bigs well really three bigs so you have extra bodies even off the Ben to throw at him with and the ability to put Rudy go off of joic which is one of the

Huge keys do you have somebody big enough to guard joic or at least to stand behind him so that you could bring Rudy goar over as a help they have that and then they have the length on the perimeter to guard Murray and not just with one guy if it was just Jaden

McDaniels I would say okay they’re gonna attack him they’re gonna draw fouls he’s foul prone offensively this or that but to kill Alexander Walker’s a heck of a Defender for him he’s he’s been an under the radar essential piece for the Timberwolves this year essential and I

Still can’t believe like he went where did he go New Orleans Portland Portland no Jazz the Jazz just got rid of him it’s I don’t know multiple teams just were like we don’t even want this guy on our team yeah I don’t know if he knew

What he was supposed to be because I think he is an incredible defensive player with a little offense and I think every player comes in thinking they’re an offensive player with a little defense but he’s a the thing it’s not just that those two players are good defensively Nik Alexander Walker in

Particular is phenomenal at guarding ball handlers in the pick and roll he’s so skinny and so hard to screen he fights so hard to get around screens I think he’s one of the toughest guys to screen and he has the length to challenge Murray those are the types of

Defenders that Murray has most typically struggled with and Denver if you want to talk about concern level for Denver like going into a playoffs Murray is such a difficult to predict player because he’s so talented at his best he’s a super duper Star in the playoffs but if you go

Back and look at his playoff run he was more hit or miss in the first two rounds than you will remember he he was almost great in every game in the Lakers series every game in the Miami series but there was a little ramping up to him that

Happened last year in the playoffs yeah again game one of the of the first round he’s incredible I think game one of the Suns round he was incredible but games in that Suns round in particular games three and four he was he was not that great and they could survive that last

Year because again Minnesota was short-handed I think the suns were just an incomplete team but this year I don’t know they might draw a matchup either in the first or second round that requires Murray to be great in every game and that’s the what’s one of the things that

I’m a little bit concerned about and if you talk about a Minnesota that’s a team that has the bodies to make it as difficult for both of Denver’s keepy players as possible the flip side of it is I don’t think that they can score either and no matter what Perfect

Defense is on Denver they’re still going to score I don’t think you’re holding Denver to 80 85 90 points they’re going to still find a way to score and that’s why I still think that’s a good match up for Denver so you nailed it with McDaniels on Murray and it’s not just

McDaniels to your point but like like that looms almost as important to me as the whole goar on Aaron Gordon Rover thing that semi bothers them that’s a wild card to me I’m with you that Minnesota’s offense is sort of TBD when the when the lights get bright um

Something you just said was very interesting about Murray and even last night against the Warriors which they kind of run away from the Warriors at the end of the game they really were dependent on two guys to do pretty much all the shot creation like we know what

Kcp is he’s great at what he is he runs around he shoots threes he gets his little elbow actions AG cutter transition occasionally you know we saw particularly in the finals like if he gets cross matches he’ll put people in the basket remember we talked before the

Season and I said the most interesting thing about the nuggets for me this year was I want to see if Michael Porter Jr has another level to get to and particularly as a shot Creator and with a little bit you know a few close out attacks here and there

Where he’ll put the ball on the floor and make the next pass it looks great we just haven’t really seen that and that’s the one I maybe I’m wrong but give me your temperature take on Michael Porter Jr I mean offensively you know he did 34 the

Other night he could hit eight threes in a game and that’s essentially what they need him to do there are just some moments where you’re like I wish they had one more guy on the floor that I had a little more faith and could like dribble and do something with the ball I

I completely agree with you about that being a thing I think Michael Porter is the player he was last year by and large but I don’t think it is as big of an issue as as I think you you’re kind of insinuating or at least questioning

Because to to rewind a little bit Murray goes down and they finish off that season really well if you recall there was like 18 games left and Denver played really well with Porter Gordon and joic and they go into the playoffs they win a series and then and then they ultimately

Go down the following year this is the year to be clear they beat Portland in the first round right and then with cazo and Austin Rivers starting at guard then they lose to Phoenix and they kind of get rolled out out of the Arena by the

Suns but who had gone to make the finals right and the following year you know Murray’s going to be out for the whole year but I was excited to see Michael Porter because I thought this is a perfect developmental year for Michael Porter he’s going to now be the second

Scorer you’re going to have to develop a two-man chemistry with yic and they’re gonna have to lean into it a little bit more and he gets hurt immediately and he misses the entire season and I think at that moment Michael Porter ceiling capped because that year I think there’s

A sliding doors where we can go through that year and he has more of that game to him and the nuggets have worked that into their system more he goes through the injury has to come all the way back through the rehab and all that process

And I just think Denver has he is now almost no different from kcp in terms of what his role is on the offense he has a corner he gets to the corners and every now and then he’ll catch a dribble handoff and have three seconds to make

Something of it or make a quick pass and I think that’s all he is but that’s all they need from him Aaron Gordon to me and people are always surprised when I say this Aaron Gordon is the third third man in their offense you know kcp and

Mpj are the release valves that’s the pressure that’s the spacing Aaron Gordon is the one that is involved in a lot of the actions that require a third person and in large part because obviously there’s physical and and and skill set thing reasons for that but also I just

Think he reads the court a lot better he’s always been a clever a more clever player than people gave him credit for in part because he spent the first five years of his career trying to be a player that he could not be and was

Never going to be but when you put him in the flow of an offense that’s already got the defense scrambling a little bit he’s a very clever player and he’s a screen Setter for joic which puts their worst shooter right into the center of the action which is good for their

Spacing I don’t even think that’s a I think you’re probably spot on about that I want to dig into the Clippers matchup a little bit because we zoomed by that you know the bubble is a landmark event for both this nuggets team and this Clippers team although almost nobody is

Left from that Clippers team um obviously nuggets come back from 3-1 embarrassed to Clippers go on to give the Lakers a nice run in the Conference Finals then injuries do them they get their team back to win the title Clippers have more or less been when healthy in elite team ever since that

Moment cracked the Conference Finals never got any further now they have Harden it’s a totally different team and I believe they’ve only played once this year with Harden on the team um Aaron Gordon was brought to Denver almost like to exactly for this matchup to guard Kawhi Leonard and he

Does it very very well then you got to still guard Paul George and James Harden kcp will guard one of them the other one’s a little bit of a tougher matchup for the Nuggets um and yet something about the Clippers has never stressed they the Denver has never really seen

That stressed about it and it could just be because at the end of the day jokic is going to put zubats into foul trouble and he’s going to own the game and control the game from inside out but this is a different team with different personnel and a third perimeter star now

That going to stress Murray more on defense they’re going to go after him now and then I want you like what have you see and they can put size on Murray too even if it’s just Terence man he’s kind of a big rangy guy sometimes PG will take him

Whatever how has that matchup changed to you so the interesting thing about this match up I’m glad you brought up the Aaron Gordon point because I actually think Aaron Gordon is as good of a Hawaii Leonard Defender as there is in the NBA he’s he might be the very best

Guy and so I think that’s works really well in Denver’s Direction especially when you get to the CL clutch I I think that the Clippers to me are a team that has or will have an identity crisis in the playoffs a little bit because to beat Denver I think the most important

Player is James Harden and in every other series the most important player is Kawhi Leonard it’s almost always going to be kawi Leonard leaning into James Harden you’re gonna get a spread pick and roll you’re gonna play them out you’re G to try to draw joic out and do some different

Things with you know James Harden’s very very good attacking Denver and I just wonder that that would be my concern is I think if Denver especially if Denver getss up in a series to me you’re going to in a fourth quarter you’re probably going to go to Kawhi Leonard because

He’s your guy that’s that’s who you play through you always go through him when the going gets tough you get to the elbow and you let him ISO and I think Denver will take that matchup to say he’s gonna hit some tough shots but Aaron G’s gonna guard him I think to

Beat Denver what you’re gonna have to do is say James Harden we’re giving you the ball we want you to spread them out and we’re almost gonna have to use you know Aaron Gordon get out of there get you know or Kawhi Leonard get out of there

Drag Aaron Gordon with you and let’s see if y kard with HP and Michael Porter and Jamal Murray as the Lowman you know coming over to help I just don’t think they’ll do that I think it’s very difficult for a team to go away from what is their best and and all season

Has been their bread and butter and to say we’re leaning into something different this year especially when it’s that guy James Harden and to a lesser extent Paul George those guys I think do carry a little bit of playoff baggage to him in a way that Ka doesn’t so you’re

Asking a team to go away from their identity in the exact direction that seems the most oh here we go again James Harden has so much playoff baggage that he has to check like nine bags before he’s the guy in the line in front of you to check the bags like how where

Are you going how long how many golf club bags do you have um it’s also like you mentioned hard the hard and picking roll against joic you know how how funky do you start getting with matchups do you try to put joic on Terence man well Terence man’s

Actually a good roll guy too do you put yachan Russ at points in the game and the Clippers more than any team in the west probably the suns are are in the conversation too but it’s it they feel less comfortable doing it tyo loves to

Go five out now he doesn’t like to do it as much anymore as he used to and and I just don’t know that they have they have a very powerful five out lineup you put their three stars plus nor and plus man out there or whatever if four good

Shooters and Terence man is okay I just there’s still a place for Nia to live defensively and almost all iterations of that lineup whether it’s man or Russ or whoever and I just don’t know that you can guard the Nuggets that way and maybe you maybe obviously you just want to

Outscore them that’s that’s a tough that’s a tough that’s a tough battle they tried it earlier this season they that it was a very interesting game for that exact reason as you got to the clutch it was close enough and they tried to go small and it was a a it was

A massacre I mean Denver scored every time and they didn’t just score in a way where you’re like oh well they made their shots this time they made they they scored in the way where you’re were like that’s not viable unless we shoot 100% And we just get threes out of it so

I think I don’t think they can go small I think they’re gonna have to play big and look zubot guards yic pretty well I think surprisingly well plumbley is zubot is a massively underrated Defender who’s big and strong with good instincts at The Rim um now you put him in space

It gets a little more difficult but yic is just he’s the ultimate Problem Solver like any he just figures everybody out but yeah zoo is done and zoo is like met him at the summit at the basket now and then and blocked his shot like zo does a

Good job against him and knows him well I think there is a familiarity there just between those guys knowing each other and have been playing against each other for for you know even longer than just the NBA so there’s that um and they have the bodies I do think I don’t think

This is a slam dunk series by any mean I’m not trying to make it sound like Denver should not be concerned about the Clippers I just think there’s a little bit I think that the Clippers would have to do the it’s always tough when a team

Can’t do the thing they most want to do in a playoff series to win and some teams have proven to be able to do that I’m not sure that that collection of player I know it’s not this team because this team is brand new but I’m not sure

That collection of players has ever proven to be able to do that to say okay well we have to do it the ugly way uh and go through it and then lastly they do remind me a lot of the Suns in one way they both are teams that I think it

It goes along with my previous point they’re teams that I think I don’t want to say Front Runners that sounds too harsh and hot takey but I think that they are more comfortable being ahead and more comfortable being comfortable and Denver is going to make you uncomfortable I think the Miami Heat and

Denver Nuggets were the two teams that were best at making you uncomfortable last year and it was a large part of why they both went to the finals Denver would make them as uncomfortable as any team I think in the west and I just question if whether both Phoenix and and

The Clippers I I think both of them are going to have to prove that they’re capable of under overcoming this well I I’ve referred to harden as a front runner before um I don’t think that’s like in his DNA it’s like what he is but at times he has been like when those

Step back threes are rolling and the rockets were ahead back in the day he’s talking all sorts of crap to the crowd he’s whatever and then like stuff gets gritty and nasty in the playoffs and it’s like where’s James Harden like where is he is he on the floor and

That’s almost it’s almost every year now like if the right shot is a sidestep step back three that might be the right shot given the moment but that shot’s easy when you’re up seven it’s really tough when you’re down three and there’s one minute left and it’s hey this is

What they’re giving me I have to go to it it doesn’t feel right look um Denver last year got Minnesota without jayen McDaniels who punched the wall and without Nas Reed they got the Suns you know and the Suns played them full blast as long as they could and

Then Denver blasted them H the hell out of orbit in game six in Phoenix and they got the Lakers who were a playing team and they swept them and I don’t care who they played or what they played I don’t really I don’t really care I don’t

Didn’t care about who faced who and what your path is your path and they demolished it almost no matter what the path is going to be harder this year starting in the first round like the first round you could get a fully healthy Dallas team or maybe you get you

Know the Kings who are kind of in this year with a barely positive Point differential but from there if people are healthy the road is going to be harder I just keep coming back to this the road’s also going to be harder for Minnesota who’s never want to playoff

Series together for Oklahoma City who’s never W to playoff series together for the Clippers who have had a checkered five years of the Paul George kawii Leonard era for Luca and the Mavs for and pick a team and I just trust Denver to navigate a tougher playoffs playoff

Path more than any other team it’s close it’s not a slam dunk for me this year to say oh I’m going all in with Denver coming out of the west but my finals pick was Boston over Denver and I’m sticking with that and I haven’t really seen you know again Denver’s middling

Along you look at their their numbers like oh net ratings kind of eh same thing last year this is a playoff team they know how to play they are still my pick to come out of the west but these next five games are going to be

Interesting I I opened up by saying you know sack Miami at home you expect them to win those games let’s see like those teams are hungry and they’re playing pretty well right now particularly Miami and they’re playing for something the Lakers it’s urgent every game now Phoenix it’s urgent every game now like

Talk about a team you don’t want to see in the eighth seed or whatever and Boston is Boston um we you know they went into Boston and won the first game a game that was just an awesome awesome awesome regular season game I’m I’m interested to see how they do but but

They’re still my favorites come out of the West last year if you recall Denver came out of the All-Star break with a bunch of these type of games there’s like four or five of them that they they were Memphis was in there of course when Memphis was was at the top of the

Conference they had a bunch of really tough games and they came out and they blasted everyone and it it was a blessing and a curse because I think they built like an eight game you know lead in the west and then they coasted the last month of the season they can’t

Coast this year but I do I am so curious to see if they look as good over this stretch as they did last year coming out of the allstar break when it was very clear that they weren’t just trying to send a message I think they were legitimately also looking at themselves

Saying can we do this or you know let’s see what our best is I think they’re going to do that this week you just mentioned the Full Slate it’s a great slate of games I think we’ll we’ll know a lot more about what this team is uh by

The end of I think it all wraps up next Thursday so between now and next Thursday I think we’ll get a really good read on just how good this team is well how good they are and how much they care like now if they go 0 and five or one

And four and they lose a couple double digit games I’ll be like uh that’s a little little worrisome like even a couple weeks ago I was like man they’re kind of limping into the allstar break but um we’ll see all right Adam Mars dmvr Sports the all NBA podcast with

Some guy named Tim Leger I don’t know where you found this guy off the street just guys just any guy with an iPad could just come on the all NBA podcast with Adam Mars Monday Tuesday Thursday and Friday it’s a lot of basketball knowledge between two very smart people

Thank you for your time and who knows we may uh meet up at the dnvr sports bar in downtown Denver uh again this year which was a great time last year thank you Adam thank you so much I hope so I want to talk about the East playin

Race today which is getting a little frothy and there’s no one better to bounce around the atlantas and Toronto and oh my God Brooklyn Brooklyn is still playing in the NBA currently they benched Ben Simmons last night breaking up the completely unwatchable Ben Simmons Nick Claxton pairing

And you know Miami Atlanta Naya Duncan this is your this is your this is your wheelhouse mediocre east teams I just can’t think of anybody better from the dunker spot old man in the three with JJ reicin increasingly cantankerous JJ reic actually Nikas how are you sir uh I am

Doing pretty well the tagline of me being the best person to talk about mediocre east teams I don’t know if that is a compliment or if I should be offended but I am excited and ready to talk about some of these teams no because everyone with a pulse can talk

About the Warriors and the Lakers and the Thunder it takes some real grind to be able to talk about how’s Pascal cakam fitting with Indiana so basically like here’s where we are kind of a fun night in the East playing race which is it’s really a two-tiered race the Knicks get

That win over the Pistons and um Dante Dean chenzo with just a straight up quarterback sack on assar Thompson not called Pistons get screwed again in their view they’re lucky they have eight wins by the way they’re up to eight they should be safe for not being the worst

Team in NBA history if they were at like five wins right now I think Monty Williams might have flipped the table after saying where’s the New York media at now closest Monty Williams will ever get to a sarcastic oneliner Nicks need need Nicks need to scr every win they

Can get with three fifths of their starting lineup hurt Sixers badly need to scr every win they can get with embiid HT and half their team in it out of the lineup we have a five team Race right now kind of a legit five team Race for spots four which is currently the

Knick five which is currently the Sixers and six which is currently the heat after the most Heat win possible last night with a complete Mash unit four starters were out I maybe three depending on who actually will start in their fully healthy starting five and

They go on the road and they beat the Kings the Knicks are 35 and 23 the magic who are eighth are 32 and 26 with the easiest remaining schedule left in the entire NBA by a lot and six Road games already in hand they have six additional

Home games coming up that’s a legit five team Race for spots four five and six that did not look like and I forgot the Pacers who are you know one game up on the Magic in the win column for for three spots and then you go down to like

The sad slap fight for spots nine and 10 which is currently Chicago and Atlanta now without Trey young they’ve got to navigate life without Trey Young Brooklyn still plays NBA basketball apparently and the Toronto Raptors who went into Indiana last night and had themselves a little postgame pizza party

For their first three- game win streak of the Season kind of getting interesting with this new team now that all the pieces are back healthy RJ Barrett’s back Gary Trent in the starting five Kelly oin oai agbaji finding their Rhythm Off the Bench Grady dick is happening they’re only I can’t

Believe I’m saying this about the 22 and 36 Toronto Raptors they’re only three and a half games out of the play in uh the 10th spot in the depressing race Nas this is this is kind of getting fun in in the Eastern Conference huh yeah it’s

Actually getting fun for me and like you look at the west and all of those teams seem to be varying degrees of good and like there are obviously tight races there the East it’s kind of easy to push to the side just because of how blessed some of these teams have been during

Some of these recent stretches but it is starting to heat up like the 4 through eight race is fun I’m going to have I’m going to be one of like eight people that’s going to have fun with the nine through like 11 race to see what happens

With Atlanta eight might eight might be high it might that might be overestimating I was trying to factor in at least some by the way and and that eight does not includes zero Chicago Bulls fans who are not enjoying any of this at all and would rather be eight

And 49 like the Detroit Pistons I think yeah at least they’re getting some soless in what the kobe white season has been IO dumu shooting over 50% from three since the beginning of the years so like that part’s been fun so they have some bright spots but to your

Overall point I don’t think they want to be in play in race they’ve been ready for a rebal for a while but you know what my favorite part of a um a uh so the Knicks have been on the wrong end and now the right end of immediately

Referees admitting oops we screw that one up sorry um my favorite part of this so I didn’t watch the Nix Pistons game last night it was not one of the games I watched so I go watch the highlights of the game on nba. on nba.com and one of my favorite things to

Do is when I know there’s a controversial call I want to see how blatantly nba.com official highlight package just doesn’t mention it at all and this for the second time with it the first time when Jaylen Brunson did not foul Aon holiday they just were like the NBA.com highlight was here’s another

Look at the replay and last night it was like wild sequence to end the game no mention of like the official review the pool report nothing um great work by nba.com putting out some referee propaganda where do you want to start you want to start with Miami eight and

10 eight and two in their last 10 games where do you want to start here actually yeah we we can start with Miami Heat because buddy what a team this has been all year long I feel like I am a month removed from going on a mini heat rant

On the dunker spot like what’s happening with this team what’s going on with the offense the defense has just been a little rickety or more rickety than anticipated uh they haven’t been able to keep the ball in front like I’ve cited the drive stat for Miami a few times

Throughout the season and then you get to February you get to the post Allstar break stretch and I think they had the fifth best defense in the league since February 1st the offense during this win streak has a 122 offensive rating per clean the glass and it’s not like

They’re getting the ridiculous they’re shooting 48% from three or anything crazy there like there’s nothing that’s been super inflammatory it has just been bam out of Bio being really freaking good having the mid-range jumper going again after a super cold stretch in like December mid January mid-range jumpers

Going getting downhill some of the finishes from that game last night were incredible from bam and the passing work the passing work has been incredibly fun uh if you’ve watched Heat games you already know he does a lot of the dribble handoff stuff a lot of the delay

Actions running into the early offense going side to side get to their Shooters he’s picking out Cutters to a degree to which it’s not necessarily new for bam but like at this volume I think he had seven assists last night but to this volume it’s been

Impressive and to do it with this unit like as you mentioned at the top they missed a whole lot of guys uh via suspension Jimmy Butler out Nico yic who’s kind of been fun uh during this reason stretch outside of you know the whole getting supended thing um but

Missing a whole lot of pieces and Bam still able to kind of put that unit on his back made some crucial plays late in the fourth quarter there they’re starting to get back into they’re starting to get back into Rhythm like Jimmy Butler gave the warning after the

New Orleans thing like it’s that time of year so we’ll see what that looks like when he’s back I think later tonight as we record but the heat are starting to look frisky on both ends of the floor The Cutting is Ping the actual spacing within the offense which is something

That I haven’t really enjoyed for most of the year like you talk about the shooting concerns but sometimes you got guys just cutting on top of each other when they’re trying to empty aside the timing is off of what the primary action is like that part of the program is

Starting to feel better for Miami and when you have B playing like this when you have an actually aggressive Jimmy Butler you have Duncan Robinson doing a little bit of everything on and off the ball KEH hake is starting to look a little bit better they’re looking frisky again

They’re looking like the team that nobody wants to see in the playoffs again they they do this every year I I I always tell people never count out the heat never take the heat lightly heat culture is a real thing and they are 8-2 in their last 10 games last

Night no Butler no hero no roier who like was on the team for five seconds played well in almost none of the games that he played or at least shot well in almost none of the games that he played uh you mentioned yich Josh Richardson is also heard Thomas Bryant who jumped off

The bench in that New Orleans kurer fuffle and was on his toes like running to the scores table hopping on from toe-to-toe like a boxer ready to go and then Jose alv was like oh I see another guy ready to go let’s almost spill into the crowd David Stern woo he would he

Would not have enjoyed that scene um and they best defense Thomas Bryant’s played this year oh he has not played very much and the heat find a way to squeeze out that game bam look sometimes it’s as simple as how many of the Little 12- Foot jumpers spinning pivoting things go

In but he’s been outstanding we talked off air two really nice maybe the two of the nicest left handed finishes I’ve ever seen from bam last night one on a floater one on a jump hook out of the post and I want to give a couple other

Guys some love you mentioned hakz he was the second most important player on the heat in that game last night and he looks all the way back to the spinning twisting bully ball how is that going in but it’s always going in kind of stuff and they were straight up picking on

Kevin herder last night with Hae hakz Jr like they can do that they would have Duncan Robins instead of back screen for hakz get the switch and be like go to work man carry us we are wheezing down the stretch carry us to the Finish Line manufacture a couple buckets in the mud

SPO actually used the phrase in the mud after the first quarter of the game so we need to get the the game in the mud more SPO loves the mud wonder if SPO has like a mud pit in his backyard in wherever he lives in Miami and Kevin Love look he’s old can’t

Jump really relying on three-point shots like last night he decided to get mean and nasty again and deep seal mismatches and Bully ball people and just run over people in transition and draw fouls he he’s been dependable for them like he’s a Dependable backup big guy for them

This team is tough as and look they have the second easiest schedule in the league behind Orlando for the rest of the season they are currently in sixth there’s a world where you mentioned nobody wants to play them we kind of penciled them in borderline erasable pen

Them into the play in tournament there’s a world where they get to fourth or fifth and they’re a problem for like a team that has legit long running playoff Ambitions like this team is is and again Jimmy had already started to pop before he issued the warning I actually would

Like to ask you this there’s an interesting conversation to have about what the Heats starting lineup should be when they all get healthy to the point that the only ones I’m sure should be it are bam and Jimmy who have only played 29 games together out of 59 by the way

That should terrify the rest of the league and you got to have one of Martin or hakz in the starting five that’s three there’s an interesting conversation to be had about who the next two should be whether one should be Duncan Robinson whether one should whether one of hero or roier should

Actually be coming off the bench for this team what do you think this team looks like fully optimized this has been the Twitter question of the year or the past two seasons what exactly do we do with Tyler hero who’s very obviously talented but also you look at some of

The lineup data what he does with Jimmy and Bam on the floor with him and that’s been especially wonky this year and just the general fit what’s his usage going to be like honestly hopefully this isn’t bad podcast but honestly I don’t know because like I’ve gone back and forth

With this myself like Terry roier to your point earlier he hasn’t really had a chance to gather rhythm with this team it feels like as he was getting there he got hurt and he’s just been out for a little bit now uh Steve and I were

Making the jokes about all the weak side screens that he was setting when he first got there very much just not trying to step on toes so like I do think what roier provides as a guy that could get downhill without a screen should be important for this team and I

Do think there are defensive question marks with him and hero together but there are also defensive question marks with hero and Robinson together or roier and Robinson together so it really just kind of comes down to okay what kind of offense do you want to run exactly what

Type of space do you want to carve out or just I guess to put it another way how exactly do you want to help Jimmy Butler and Bam maab bio do you prioritize getting as much space around those two as possible or do you go with the options that in theory can unlock

Both of those guys as screeners so they don’t see the amount of switches that they do and so like to the ladder Port that probably leans more towards uh hero being a starter there just where you get the blend of both um and if you do want to just give Terry Ro

The ball and I have to worry about how he’s trying to fit himself in within the flow it might be an easier sale to get roier off the bench since he’s coming from Charlotte he hasn’t been there D is Miami actually tried to Hero Robinson uh

Back court duel with any am of volume like it’s probably worth a shot at the very least because if you can get that pick and roll uh dynamicism with hero and Robinson both of those guys can flow off the ball both of those guys can space if you can get enough from them

Defensively and like quiet as ke again Miami’s defense has been pretty darn good since the beginning of the month they’re playing a lot more Zone now so always fun when SPO gets back into that bag if you can figure out the defense part like maybe it is hero and Robinson

And you bring roier you bring jameh hakz Off the Bench so you can kind of solidify things with that second unit you start Caleb Martin who as you were talking about some of the unsung heroes of last night Caleb Martin was incredible in that Kings game if he’s

Back to form on both ends of the floor you get the drives the shot which quietly doesn’t have as much of a hitch as it did the last couple of years so I’m curious to see like where that where that up Landing I don’t know if he’s

Going to replicate what he did in the Eastern Conference finals last year but if he can actually shoot that gets fun I think the best thing you can say about this that Miami does have options here like it’s not an awful problem to have but I probably at least give hero

And Robinson the shot and see what it looks like when everyone’s healthy it’s an interesting conversation to have and interesting to think about because on the one hand you’re right rier had no shot to develop any rhythm because not only has he been hurt pretty quickly

Into his heat tenure but guys were in and out of the lineup around him and I liked when they would have roier on One Wing and Hero on another and they could attack kind of both diagonals that way but it’s it’s an interesting conversation but everything you just

Said about all these dudes we didn’t mention Josh richon we didn’t mention Haywood heith who came in and gave them big minutes last night it’s just so interesting to go back and think about I don’t think they have a lot of Damen Lillard regret there and I don’t

Think they had any Daman L regret almost from day one because they had confidence in their depth they had confidence in what they had in has I mean people in their front office and their coaching staff were telling me in September this dude might be playing 30 to 35 minutes a

Game for us by the end of the season and they have the right kind of depth around their best players are they a little short of like a a minus A+ whatever shot creation sure but like Dame hasn’t really been providing that in Milwaukee and whatever chemistry hiccups he’s

Experienced there with another great player in Giannis I mean I don’t know why he wouldn’t have the same issues is going to a new place in Miami and and I don’t I’m not worried about Dame Dame is Dame but like the heat are tough and look I said this earlier in the season

Before they hit that trough that you mentioned December January they’re not scared of like any of these teams in their path they’re not but first of all they’re not scared of anyone like they would tell you they’re not even scared of Boston who’s 45 and 12 and just lapping the field everywhere

Philadelphia not scared of him they beat him in the playoffs Knicks different Knicks team I think the Knicks might actually the second best team in the East if they’re fully healthy but they’re not Heat beat them in the playoffs last year Milwaukee the Heat beat them in the playoffs last year and

Have beaten him in the playoffs twice Cleveland respectfully hasn’t won a playoff series I think they’re awesome like I don’t know man heat are tough um and by the way I know you wanted to talk about Charlotte the only Charlotte allowance I would give you is that you mentioned Caleb Martin Martin twin

Powers have been activated Cody Martin is back in Charlotte and is a big reason why this team I believe is undefeated since acquiring Trey man and Grant have they lost yet I don’t think they’ve lost yet have they yeah they they’ve lost one against Golden State and that’s where

You got the the Grant W oh that’s right the curry the curry Reunion game all that good stuff at the end of that game but it was a it was like 9784 or something right they like neither team cracked 100 I was like is this a typo

Yeah it was very funny like roaming Twitter and seeing Oh no Charlotte’s down 14 then going to the NBA app and seeing that 4329 I was like oh nobody scoring right now that’s going to be fun but uh shout out to Charlotte’s defense I’ll sprinkle that in since I can’t do

The full Charlotte bit today I’ll give you 30 seconds to tell me why Charlotte’s defense is better that’s all you get and I will create a buzzer here because I did look they’ been they’ve been fun Trey man’s been fun and like they they have been winning

So tell me tell me what’s going on with Charlotte’s defense I would say with the starting unit they are playing Pretty aggressively there’s a collective size that they have they don’t really play small players in the rotation outside of Seth Curry who has missed a couple of

Games at this point uh bringing Nick Richard up to the level there’s a lot of pressure that they’re put putting on teams then you get to the second unit very switch heavy group with Grant Williams uh leading thing leading the charge there um and then they are just

Doubling all over the place like it’s two on the ball and pick and roll and then you check out their double teams they’re doubling from one pass away and they’re doing a really good job splitting behind it they’re forcing turnovers Cody Martin’s been supera the Brandon Miller’s been fun on the weak

Side very good a Defender already Brandon Miller not even just rookie good so that part’s been fun there’s the quick elevator pitch if you want more check out latest episode of dunker spot boom there you go that was great and you got a promo in at the end Brandon Miller is a

Stud um and they had a very good trade deadline this is an organization to watch um the markets are not remotely similar but I used to talk about Phoenix you know Bill Simmons and I used to have a running bit of like if we could pick

One team to just take over first of all we would be horrible and ruin the team within two years we would be fired but we always wanted Phoenix because we felt it was like a sleeping giant in terms of its Market appeal to NBA players and and just everything about it Charlotte kind

Of reminds me of the is is like my Eastern Conference version of that not that Charlotte is like this dream Beach you know hot climate all that but it’s a nice climate players like it players who have gone there have liked living there it’s a basketball hot bed obviously

College basketball more than the NBA um that team when it’s popular dating to the 90s when it came into the league and had the cool jerseys and stuff like it kind of Pops there um anyway that’s my Charlotte elevator pitch um let’s talk about go down in the standings

Right behind the heat are the 33 and 26 Indiana Pacers who lost to the Raptors last night at home quiet game for Tyrese halberton what have you seen from the early Returns on Pascal cakam who obviously got traded from their opponent last night Toronto to Indiana he’s only

Played 13 games with halberton they are plus 20 in 308 minutes together the Turner halberton cakam Trio is plus 17 total points in 243 minutes together so good but not amazing stylistically what have you liked or not liked um I think the biggest thing for

Me is like just trying to Bank in the sample just isn’t super large for Pascal Indiana yet and more particular like him and Tyrese halberton together since tyres has missed some time Pascal’s missed some time then you get the allar breaking all that good stuff so like I’m

Trying to give a little bit of Grace in terms of the chemistry building but like just looking at their two-man uh paring and pick and roll it’s been a lot more switching than anticipated and that kind of sent me down my own little rabbit hole like has Tyrese gotten so good that

He’s kind of not that he’s directly limiting the opportunities that they have but because he’s now seeing bigger Defenders and seeing more pressure the Halton seak pick and role has been switched more than I anticipated I think it’s a little bit over 40% per second Spectrum it’s like what are the openings

There like Pascal if he gets a small gu on him he’ll still draw double teams he’s still a good passer so it’s been fun to watch him Opera in that level and even when Tyrese is one pass away it’s just a level of space that Pascal has

Had that I don’t think he’s gotten used to uh with the Toronto St so like seeing him attack those openings and seeing the passing pop a little bit more has been a lot of fun for me but I’m more interested in seeing like how they continue to build a boat around those

Two what kind of things are they setting up I think back to both of the Raptor matchups that they’ve had recently and it felt like every time the Raptor said let’s put more sides on Pascal let’s put yaka Perle on Pascal things just opened up immediately let’s empty a side let’s

Get two to the ball let’s get Pascal in the short roll or let let’s now combine Pascal and Miles turn together let’s get them screening for each other before flowing into a pick and roll y’all got two on the ball we’re able to play out

Of that more so like you can see the seeds of what that partnership’s going to look like again tyres incredible scorer at this point we know what the passing is what kind of space he can provide we know what kind of score and initiator and passer that Pascal can be

So like the fit stylistically I think is going to get there it’s just the usage for me and then even looking at the Pascal and Miles Turner partnership like they haven’t screened for each other a lot and I was wondering at what point does Rick Carlow tap into that bag even

If it’s just like Ram screen will have Miles Turner screen for Pascal as he lifts up and then flows into the pick and roll with Tyrese Alber do they get into that stuff to kind of get some big to Big switching and then flow into the pick and roll is

That another way for them to generate two on the ball um but I’ve enjoyed that portion of it defensively Pascal’s been fine to me and kind of like the opposite of the switch point offensively I felt like he would be switching more in Indiana than we’ve seen so far like it’s

Something that the great Caitlin Cooper has pointed out on her feed like they got Pascal chasing VI off ball in navigating screens like that part’s interesting to me so want to see like what his defensive role ends up stabilizing as but overall I think it’s been a positive you can already see the

Seeds on both ends of what kind of impact he can have I like it and it’s been uneven because of guys being in and out of the lineup because of the allstar break I do think they’re adjusting to both buddy heeld being away from being not on the team anymore they

Miss his shooting and Aon Smith has been hurt a little bit lately so they don’t quite you know they’re trying to figure out a new starting fight with neb har who I love uh but that lineup hasn’t worked very well um and halberton has been by his standards a little bit out

Of rhythm in the last two or three weeks like we haven’t had a lot of halberton games where he just looks like he has the feel for not the feel but just he has the game in the palm of his hand it hasn’t felt like that including last

Night where maybe part of it his teams are switching more and saying like we’re just not going to give you the easy passes we’re going to make you be a scorer and he’s totally capable of that that he’s that’s been the big reason for his leap is that you just can’t play him

Like that anymore I think Pascal we can talk about tactically should be switching more on defense I think he’s added the length and tenacity and just kind of like ability to guard different kinds of players and fill the gaps that they’ve needed offensively you know you

Mentioned a lot of teams toying not even toying with it like we’re going to put our centers on Pascal and our fours on Miles Turner because we don’t want to give Miles Turner open threes and we’re not too worried about him posst up I just I think they have the solves

For that strategy and one of them you mentioned is you just go oh your Center’s on Pascal you can’t switch the Tyrese Pascal pick and roll anymore because you can’t put your big dude on Tyrese freaking halberton in that step back three that just keeps stepping back

Further for he’s GNA start taking half court step back threes pretty soon um and they go right into that with Miles Turner spacing the floor um and Pascal is also just too fast for centers like he can face them up and get by them and get around them

And if you go the other way and your four is small he can post them up and get get you sort of he can get Indiana’s offense into that mid-range territory that they don’t use much and use it not to score necessarily but to playmake out

Of it or bully his way to the basket I I think this fit is going to work and I think ultimately like you look at what they traded for SE yakum Bruce Brown who just kind of hasn’t found a sweet spot in either Indiana or Toronto at least

Consistently I think he been a little better for Toronto but some games he feels like what what is his place here uh and three first round picks two of which will be two of the three will be 2024 first round picks that’ll be toward the bottom half of the draft the first

Round like that’s a good that’s a fair price for the Pacers like I I think that’s a fine deal for them if anything it’s slightly disappointing for Toronto that the draft Equity doesn’t appear to be what they that all that great they didn’t flip Bruce Brown now they have

His player option decision they could have cap space this summer I like how this fit is going to look for Indiana I want to see it when n Smith comes back and if they go back to starting n Smith the shooting when you have sakam Turner’s only shooting 33% from three

Matan who had a heater last night is at 38% but teams don’t really treat him like a shooter shooter um that that’s an interesting part of it but this is just another team who if they can figure it out and get more reps together like I I think they’ll be you

Know when they made this trade everyone wanted to know like how good are the Pacers are they a top three team are they a top four team I barely addressed that in my reaction podcast to it because I just thought it was obvious that they weren’t a top three team yet

In the East like a threat to really beat those teams but the top three in the East has got a little murkier since then like that Cleveland did not look like a no-brainer top three team I still don’t see the Pacers as like a threat to make the Conference Finals necessarily but

That’s fine that wasn’t the point of this trade the point of this trade was to set them up to be that kind of team in a year or two I don’t know am I wrong or am I underestimating the Pacers like the East is a little open-ish with all

These injuries maybe they are a threat to make the Conference Finals I don’t know it’s open-ish I can’t quite get there like I reserved right to change my mind in the month and a half now we do get the healthy halberton stretch seak stretch again like halberton out and

Then on the minutes restriction so that just kind of limits of things but I think he’s back to the normal now so if he regains that burst like that could be a terrifying Duo to face in a postseason setting that’s just going to become a

Matchup deal I don’t know if I get quite to I don’t think I get the Conference Finals like if they went around I wouldn’t be super surprised depending on who they matched up with but to your point like this was the move to set up the other moves and the fact that you

Know all the stuff come out from W like stars want to play with Tyrese halberton like I think that’s your win I want to play with Tyrese halberton and I stink I man I’m right there with you but like the fact that that kind of the vibe coming out of Indiana like you’ve

Already won for the year like naturally you want to win all the basketball games that you can but like big picture you have your superstar in Tyrese halberton You’ have acquired another star you have a little bit of optionality moving forward with some of the assets that you

Have like they can build this thing out and so the fact they set themselves up right now as long as they don’t get flat out embarrassed in round one or if they fall to the playin if they lose two playin games like that will leave a sour

Taste absent of that like this is house money for Indiana especially considering like you alluded to it with losing Buddies healed like they do feel a movement shooter short like getting Doug MC D back around the trade dead line I think is helpful but like he hasn’t

Played that much he has a shot that well so far but like I do feel like they are a shooter short like I made the switch point about tyes and Pascal very quickly like we haven’t seen Tyre screen for Pascal that often either he set one ball

Screen last night for neb hard early in the game where I just flagged it because the Buddy heeled ghost screen for Tyrese How was such a big part of their offense and I I flagged it because Tyrese If he if he leaned into that a little bit more not you don’t want to

Take him off the ball too much but he’s such a dynamic player he could give them five or six possessions where they run that scripted action for neb har or whoever has the ball that it could be very dangerous yeah like I think to the chemistry Point like there’s just an

Adjustment period there I think with Tyrese as a screener because like a lot of the Guard screen stuff he receives a bunch of it because he has the ball in his hands but even when he was doing the ghost stuff up for buddy or Andrew NIMH hard like he’s just tapping and getting

Out of there which is fine I think with Pascal if you look at like what KY Lowry would do for him what Fred would do for him it’s ghost but they’re getting contact first and then slipping out of there and like they at least have enough

Of the true hits to where when they do ghost that Defenders are off balance I think with Tes he’s so used to just going straight with the blur screen like that’s probably just gonna take a little bit we’re getting super gr but fine um like I think that’s going to take a

Little bit of of chemistry building there and I think once they get that they’ll lean into that a little bit more late game they can create some advantages from there but yeah they got they have obvious Pathways to get better and they’re already good and they’re

Winning like I again I think this is a house money stretch for them let’s talk about the Hawks who are 25 and 32 clinging tenaciously to the 10 seed uh three games up on the Nets I’m writing off the Nets I’m sorry Nets you maybe it’s bulletin board material I’m writing

You off the Raptors I I kind of got to look at a little bit because they’ve won three in a row and they’re starting to find a little bit of an identity with this new team that they have they’re three and a half four out in the Lost column of

Atlanta who their season series is 2-2 so it would default tiebreaker wise to conference record the hwks will have that Raptor Conference record is trash um but they are missing Trey young for the next month uh with the finger injury and their offense is basically built around everything Trey young does with a

A rim Runner like Clint capella who’s back healthy a cono who was playing the best basketball of his life when capella was hurt is now hurt and out indefinitely so we’re going to have to see some Bruno Fernando or more with what they’ve been doing is just playing

Playing jayen Johnson at Center um when capella is out now it’s always the guy behind the guy right like if you look at their numbers dejonte Murray on the court Trey young off the court they’re now plus three per 100 possessions for the season according to cleaning glass you live with that you

Sign up for that it’s now who is running the offense when dejonte Murray is on the bench that starts to get you a little bit worried but this team look Hunter’s back and I know you want to talk about Hunter um bogdanovic has had a fantastic year

For them and can spot start if need be and is did start the last game the the AO thing hurts and without try and aong it’s two of their top six or seven guys that are out I’m interested but I’m interested to see how they play without Trey young in both in

Style and in results what are you gonna be watching for because this is like it it’s like taking Luca out of Dallas it’s just everything is built around how this one dude plays and he’s gone now for a while well you already hit on it like I think it’s what is what

Are they gonna look like with the Jon off the floor and what kind of Staggering are they gonna do do we just get Jaylen Johnson lead get on you now especially if he’s just going to be your nominal backup five on top of that cuz like the Bruno minutes have been we’ll

Call them interesting to where like the screen you see him set the initial screens like okay you can still create open that’s cool he’ll dive okay that’s pretty good speed getting out of there he’s sucking in the defense if you have a lift on the weak side you got an

Opening there and then you toss him the ball it’s like oh is he going to catch this what exactly is the vertical pop when he does get the ball this is a little bit different and every time you every time you say Bruno there’s just there’s a bad you wouldn’t even get it

There’s a bad dad joke like my soul is trying to force it out of my body and I’m pushing it back down so please keep going maybe say Fernando maybe say Fernando instead of Bruno and now my soul will forget that this joke is

Trying to come out of me got you we we we don’t talk about that guy um but no I I think it’s a little bit yes but no it’s just a little bit interesting what that’s going to look like there because with Jaylen at the five offensively like even if it turns

Into a switch Fest like I trust him to be able to create openings and if you are playing any kind of traditional coverage like he’s very good in the pocket if you do put two on the ball he’s good in the short roll defensively is where it gets interesting cuz like

I’ve like some of the contest at The Rim but also you can tell like I don’t really love seeing Jaylen Johnson in Drop Like that’s very much not his bag especially considering like he’s been the foremost of the Year Atlanta’s been blitzing pick and rolls all over the

Place he’s sliding down trying to challeng shots that it’s funny like the the tweener he’s not a tweener forward he’s just a four now but like even like the the undersiz center in drop your footwork can be perfect your position can be perfect you’re just maybe not big

Like when the Bucks put Bobby poris in drop it’s it can get it can get ugly for them he’s just not big enough to do it yeah and with Bobby particular like some of the the depth of his drop and I go on a whole thing with Bob and a drop I just

Haven’t wanted to see that in three years but at any rate like the jayen that defied defensively is going to be interesting to track and I think zooming out and this something that we talked about when I was on earlier in the year with Atlanta blitzing more picking rolls

Than anyone I wonder would they reach a point that they just stopped doing that let’s just go to more drop let’s go to more switching you obviously will miss Trey young offensively and and again like I think the defensive effort for Dre for the year has mostly been pretty

Good like there are just size limitations there but like I haven’t super minded the effort defensively you remove him out of the rotation now for a month de jante or Kobe buffkin if he actually plays those are your smallest guys in the rotation now and they’re 65

Like Garrison Matthews a sneaky 66 still not the biggest guy but like you do have more leeway to lean into switching which made the Sunday game against Orlando interesting to me no P because he was sick so that was going to take some of

The must off of let’s see if I can pick out some stuff in film Etc but it is it Le worth noting Atlanta switched more pick and roles in that game than in any other game they have this year I was like I wonder like part of that just

Orlando they’re a big team it’s easy to switch against them they see a bunch of switches overall but is that something that Atlanta’s gonna lean into now because their rotations have been a mess for most of the year like I feel like that’s the biggest part of why the

Defense has been as bad as it is if you can eliminate that portion or at least limit some of the rotation that they have to make let’s just switch let’s just keep the ball in front we’ll help when we can let’s Identify some non shooters that we can be more aggressive

Off of let’s get into some game plan stuff but let’s just switch and keep it simple are the Hawks the 19th best defense in the league over this next month stretch that isn’t good but it’s much better than what they’ve been so far this year and if you get enough of

The shot making from Deonte if you have sadique Bay finally making Corner threes or continue to do so if you get bogdon knocking down shots if Jaylen Johnson is doing your short roll things can you carve out enough offense to hold serve I think a pathway is there for Atlanta to do so

Yeah they should be able to I mean look it you wouldn’t hang a banner for it but they should be able to hold off Toronto and Brooklyn for the 10th spot in the East um and they should be able to push Chicago for the ninth spot in the east

In homec court advantage in the 910 Showdown that nobody is looking forward to um because I I just think they have enough even with all these injuries they have enough what’s what’s disappointing is that well maybe it’s not disappointing but like these next two months because I don’t I don’t think

Either of us thinks Atlanta is doing anything real in the playoffs like the team just hasn’t been good enough um and I wouldn’t even pick them to get through the play and now that could change who knows um the next two months were more about let’s dig in and see really that

We didn’t trade anybody at the deadline we we we know there’s going to be noise about it in the offseason when the Lakers can throw more first round picks at people in particular everybody can really all the contenders can let’s see what this do can actually do let’s see

If we can catch a rhythm with if we can get healthy and see what this team is if it’s more than just the 500 team that’s been for basically three straight years um and on the one hand now we get a month of of we don’t get to see that duo

But we do get to see what does this team look like with d jonte Murray and without Trey young now to your point if you were building that team on purpose you would get a backup point guard that’s more experienced than Kobe buffkin better than Pat Mills better

Than Trent Forest they don’t have that right now but it will be interesting to see how they far they should be better defensively and I I’m just I’m interested to see it um let’s qu talk quickly about uh the team that’s chasing them in the three-legged race for for

This seed the Raptors uh on a three-game winning streak have totally remade their team and it’s always hard to get a feel for a team that trades s so many big pieces in the middle of a season they actually made three meaningful trades the seak trade we talked about OG and

Obi for RJ Barrett Emanuel quickley and the Detroit second round pick that’s going to be very valuable this coming off season and I thought one of the more interesting trades at the deadline that no one was that interested other than the Nerds like me um one of the first

Round picks they got in the SE yakum deal plus some fungible salary to the Jazz for Kelly oin and oai abaji aaji is starting to play a little bit better for them getting some some baskets on Cuts playing good defense um the starting lineup which is now quickly

Trent Scotty Barnes triple double last night with five blocks I think RJ Barrett yakob purle that starting lineup is plus 12 per 100 possessions in only 135 minutes together but for the second straight season after acquiring Perle last season and now all these trades they seem to have found a lineup that’s

Actually good and is is working um quickley and Barnes are still finding like you know just like always with two lead ball handler types you know what’s the chemistry going to be like how can we amplify each other instead of playing your turn my turn basketball you’ve seen

Some pick and rolls more pick and rolls between them more Scotty Barnes pick and rolls with Emanuel cookley screening for him which is an action that I like and they should lean more into that’s just going to be a work in progress that’s what it is Grady dick is kind of

Starting to happen Off the Bench for them had a great game last night has good chemistry with oin this there’s something this is not a fake little late season random three- game win streak I’m not saying Toronto’s like good now but there’s something happening here where

If enough things can kind of Click into place this teams at the very least like kind of interesting for the next 20 games yeah like I’ve enjoyed them during this recent stretch and like just monitoring Toronto all year long my biggest thing has been what exactly is

The balance going to be for me like evaluation wise between what they’re trying to get to and then also banking in the Personnel is only going to allow for so much and so we talked about it on the dunker spot earlier in the year I

Like a lot of the things that Toronto is trying to run here defense are just going under or they’re switching a whole bunch of stuff so like it’s getting flattened out eight seconds in and then they just kind of have to play out of that and it gets a little muggy from

There because of the lack of overall shooting that they had free trades which the shooting is is I mean Barnes is shot it okay Barrett people are going to dare to shoot it’s it’s a little better but it’s not like great still yeah still not where it needs to be but like it’s

General okay what exactly are you trying to get to what are the Personnel limitations how much of that can you control can you get into your actions quicker what is the screening looking like Etc so like that’s something I’ve been monitoring with Scotty in particular I know skill setwise he

Should be a very good role partner for a lot of guards especially Emanuel quickly like how good of a screener is he is something that he’s going to have to continue to grow with but now you kind of look at this group post trades you talked about the starting lineup and how

Good it’s been like in theory you have bear that can work second side you have a pull-up threat or a guy that can just at least touch the painting the manual quickly you have yako Perle who will just hit people all over the place and you can run some stuff through him at

The elbow he can pick out Cutters and things like that and Scotty Barnes can do a little bit of everything Gary Trent Jr now starting like he can fly off of pin Downs fly off of staggers get shots going for you and so you have an element of shooting and spacing and decision-

Making and screening that works then you get into the second unit where you have Kelly o lenic you can replicate a lot of the same things with an added element of shooting so when you get into like the pure second unit or like Scotty plus bench or Emanuel quickly plus

Bench little virtually everyone can do something execute a handoff get a drop get into drive and kick run a pick and roll you can kind of Flow side to side in a way that was a little inconsistent at the beginning of the year and so now that you have this lineup and scheme

Synergy within like their top nine and now you have Grady playing well and shooting well on top of that it’s easy to see okay this is the stuff they were trying to build early in the year now you have slightly better Personnel again not where it needs to be to be like a

Serious title threat or even win a Playoff round threat right now but you’re starting to see this is what they were working towards and this is what it can look like when they tap into that and then you throw in this is a young team this is a team that you know I

Think since the beginning of February since the trades were made no team has gotten out and transition more than Toronto that’s still going to be a big part of their calculus but now you can attack teams early and then you also have an idea of what you’re trying to

Get to in the half court it all just feels better and so I don’t know if that ends with them getting to 10 or getting to nine being you know making serious noise in the play in or not I need to see more from that front but I already

Feel better about their process and what they’re building towards it’s amazing you know Grady dick was playing for the 9005 for a part of the season it’s amazing what one movement shooter can do for their offense and how good it looks and like Gary Trent is

Kind of a movement shooter but he he’s a little more deliberate in his movement and will stop the ball more than Grady dick will like they’re just running this play with Grady dick where I think it’ll be either quickly or Barnes who’s ever in the game is the lead ball handler

Where grd dick will set a ball screen for that guy and a shooter setting a ball screen as we thought about was a dangerous thing and then he’ll Sprint off a Kelly linic screen so you’re pairing two Shooters in an off ball screening action a shooting center and a

Shooting guard and you don’t know where the hell Grady dick is going to go out of that he could cut to the rim he could stop and take a pop for a three behind Kelly Len te they’re giving team’s a lot of trouble with that and he is moving

His feet on defense better than I expected teams are going to test him and teams are going to pick on him and there’s certain matchups where he’s just not gonna be able to hang but he’s he has good anticipation which makes up for whatever lack of foot speed he might have like

He’s been hanging in defensively he’s a good rebounder he likes to get in and grab rebounds that I just um and agbaji look every time he dribbles it makes me a little bit nervous but he’s made some threes lately he’s a really good cut and he’s just his wingspan is enormous I

Thought that was like a worthy byow kind of reclamation second draft guy for them I have no idea what any of this adds up to just absolutely zero but I know that I’m like kind of more interested in watching the Toronto Raptors than I was two months ago yeah

Like I think they’re right there again that second unit has been a lot of fun like it’s been cool seeing KY o just operate and wear a whole bunch of different hats offensively you mentioned oai abaji in the cuts and the shooting like also him just randomly flying in

For offensive rebounds has been kind of fun on top of that like Bruce Brown to your earlier point he’s starting to find a little bit more Comfort there I just love when Toronto inverse the offense with that second unit he let hand Kelly handle up top it may just be like a

Simple exchange they may go to Pure delay they may go to pick and roll they may go to Pistol or whatever the case may be but from there the ball still finds Kelly lck in the middle of the floor and then Here Comes OSHA abachi from the slot Here Comes Bruce Brown

From the slot and if you put two on the ball at any time against that second unit especially when Scotty Barnes is handling things the ball just pops quickly like that is the we process the four quickly lineup no pun attended there but they they do such a good job

Of moving the ball with the second unit it’s it’s been a lot of fun yeah there is um there is a lot of loow hanging last name pun jokes on the Toronto Raptors roster that some announcers in the league are having I would say a little too much fun with um these are

Their names respect their names um but yeah Toronto um fun uh let’s talk quickly about Orlando who just kind of like it feels like they’re almost the least interesting of these teams because they didn’t do anything meaningful at the trade deadline for the 95th consec actually no it’s not the

95th consecutive season because their one tear down season has just totally reshaped their team via the vuich deal um they still their backcourt rotation is still other than Suggs who I just absolutely adore watching like you if you’re going to throw a crosscourt pass and Jaylen Suggs is in the game you

Better take one extra look to see where the hell jayen Suggs is cuz he’s coming for that pass and well he does play like a football player you know it’s funny he was a great football player he has these pick sixes and he had that was it

Against the I think it was in the Pistons game that b Carol won with the not really a travel but was it really a travel are we sure it wasn’t a travel um he had the full court heave to ban Caro inbounds pass like the Grant Hill

Inbounds pass hit him and sh I’m like excuse me I’m like this dude is so fun to watch but their guard rotation is still like oh there’s Anthony black for a lot of minutes okay is jet Howard around no um Marquel folz but but look

They are what they are which is a bad offense 23rd in offense extending my favorite Niche streak in the entire NBA I believe this will be their 12th or 13th consecutive season with an offense that’s 20th or Worse barring a late game surge but their defense has stood the

Test of time this is a legit real good defensive team they’re fifth in points a lot per possession they foul a lot that’s their only weakness but they are number one in free throw rate on offense so it all evens out in the wash and they’re good at everything else they’re

Enormous and if he can just stop getting hurt I heard Stan Van Gundy say on a national broadcast why the hell were they on National oh because it was the Shaq Jersey retirement game Stan Van Gandhi said it out loud Jonathan Isaac per minute and I realized being on the

Floor is part of being a good defensive player might be the best defensive player in the NBA and he said that and I thought my brain has thought that but I have not allowed my mouth to say it out loud that’s not a crazy statement he’s that good defensively I just don’t know

What the future of this team is offensively given their lack of shooting given the skill overlap between their two best players b Caro and frons Vagner who are awesome I and I don’t even know what to pay attention to when I watch this team like there’s nothing that I’m like

There’s no mystery that I that I want this roster to solve other than maybe the Isaac wild card but what are you what do you watch for with this team and like do they have a road map to a good NBA offense or is this just a team

That’s going to have to at some point go all in trading for a guard who can shoot and dribble and pass I think they’re at they’re absolutely at a shooting uh deficit and like this is something I’ve talked about uh throughout the year with Orlando like I think there is a subtle

Difference between a good shooting team and a good spacing team I just don’t have questions and this is a testament to Jamal Mosley who’s done a heck of a job this year I don’t have questions about how well Orlando can space the floor they do a really good job when

They’re setting up actions for poo or setting up stuff for France they’ll clear the wing they’ll clear the entire side they’ll have a guy in the dunker spot they they’ll exchange on the weak side they do a really good job of spacing around their guys they just

Don’t have enough shooting to punish it and so I really wish like I’m I’m aware of the offense uh the offense streak with Orlando because of you and listen to pod and so like now it’s something I’ve subconsciously tracked to I do wish that in general they shot better so you

Could really get the depths of how fun this Orlando offense can be especially when they invert stuff for pao invert stuff for France Pao is the point guard of the team I mean what these point forward whatever you want to call him he and France are the point guards of the

Team basically I mean folz is just he’s been hurt it just hasn’t happened just hasn’t really happened yeah it’s been a very Topsy turbo year for Mark Hill which thanks because last year was a lot of fun when he got back on the court but but no like it’s just continue to

Monitor the decision making for fron and for pao for me offensively like with Pao in particular because there was the fun stretch earlier in the year where he was taking and making threes and he was taking something off the bounds like wait a minute he’s starting to do the

Thing this is cool and that’s kind of gone down as the year is gone so I do Wonder like when he spaced away from fron what exactly is the decision-making tree there it’s funny like I wanted to bring up DeAndre Hunter a little bit earlier in the hawk section oh I forgot

That yes please do know you’re good but I was just going to tie that in together like the big thing with DeAndre Hunter aside from how healthy will he be is when he catches the ball how quickly is he making a decision and that’s been a bigger thing than what decision got be

It’s had to be faster yeah catch catch Drive yeah so like that been better for Atlanta and I tie that back into Pao to where when he spaced my big thing with him is okay less what are you doing how quickly are you gonna do it will you

Comfortably take a catch and shoot three because there have been many possessions this year where he’ll catch these wide open it’s a catch star at the defense now let me get into the iso bag or catch star at the defense Rhythm dribble now I’m going to take the three and what

Should have been a catch and shoot turns into a pullup and it’s just kind continue to monitor how quickly is he making these decisions even if he’s going to catch and drive could he get into the teeth in the defense uh we think the answer is a resounding yes on

That part he is just a monster getting downhill gets to the line a lot still the passing has really popped for me this year popped last year but like with this amount of volume passing continues to pop for him so that part’s been fun it’s just watching poo all the ball and

Then with fron like I think he can go a long way to helping maybe not saw but at least help the shooting portion cuz he just hasn’t shot the Well from three at a level that is up to his standard like I I think he’s just a much better

Shooter than he shown like some of that is injury but it’s just been an off year for him if he gets back to knocking down shots I think the Poo post ups with Fran’s one pass away become even more deadly if you want to send that double

Like Fran isn’t scared to shoot the ball off the catch and you can just kind of kick it back out flow in a two-man game from there so like they have building uh options even with them being light siiz and seeing switches they both get downhill so well it almost doesn’t

Matter and so like I’m watching the offense then defensively I really love watching this team fly around like I think jayen sus is a legit all defense candidate for them to maintain the elite defense while wle was out and you just had to Goa stretch and you get wle back

And his little wonky to start and now the defense remains good like I do Echo the Jonathan Isaac point he is ridiculous defensively but just not on the court so like that’s not going to matter for awards and then even when he was on the Court like it’s what 13 to 15

Minutes a night so you can’t even give him the matis styal he’s playing 22 so that’s that’s barely enough and even that’s controversial we’re not going to have that convers conversation today the defense is fun I don’t have questions about the defense and then offensively process-wise or just how they space the

Floor I think they will carve out room for their Stars assuming they make the playoffs or get through the play in at the very least is just going to be what will they knock down on catch and shoot jumpers and I super reductive there but like if

They have a hot if they have a hot stretch from three they can absolutely win a series the defense is going to take them to the dance but that’s kind of what I’m monitoring there I just don’t think their offense is good enough to do anything look we have to see how

The matchups shake out and if they are able to either get into the top six or if they’re going to have to cut through the play in tournament I would not pick them to win any Series right now with their offense in the state that it is

And that’s fine like I think they’re going to have to come to a Crossroads at some point of we have all these draft picks all these future assets like do we need to put some them on the table finally and get a guard in here who can

Loosen up our offense run it some of the time but not take too much away from what we have in banero and fron and I I agree with you I think fron three will be fine like I I think he’ll become a good three-point shooter again um let’s

Move west real quickly I had Adam marz on before you we recorded actually last night in La uh to talk about the nuggets in the top of the West in the matchups there um there were two teams I wanted to get your concerns about like not concerns but just your temperature take

On um that that Adam and I one we hit a little bit when we didn’t hit a lot but they actually interestingly have the almost the exact same statistical profile uh and for one of these two teams this is the statistical profile to which all of us like if they get here

Look out and yet no one is really looking out for them and the other one it’s slightly disappointing because they’ve hit a recent slump but it’s the Suns and the Clippers um the Suns for the season are seventh in offense and 14th in defense now seventh in offense

Is a little low given their talent but when they have their big three together they’re blowing teams out of the water they’re plus 13 per 100 possessions plus7 total points in 440 minutes with Beal Durant Booker so let’s just say their real offensive ranking is like

Fourth and 14th in defense we all said before the season this can be an average defense look out and yet they’re three and three in their last six games Beal’s hurt again they are in a five way tie I’m sorry a four-way tie in the Lost

Colum for fifth to eth in the west and obviously seeding is going to be Paramount hard team to figure out um you know I talked on my last episode about how I I thought there had been a kind of stagnation in the beal and I’m sorry in Booker and Durant like working together

On offense it was too much your turn my turn I thought against the Lakers their win the other day they kind of corrected that and veered in the back in a healthy direction but just boil it down to me on Phoenix like what what’s what’s what’s

The number one thing you watch for like can they get better at this before the playoffs um I think the big thing for me is well naturally the big thing is going to be how healthy are they going to be which isn’t a scheme thing so I can’t

Really talk that much about that portion if they’re healthy I think the offense is going to be good and I think they’ve shown like with the starting lineup in particular if you have the big three out there you have nerk out there and if you have Royce out there now if that’s going

To be your guy or Grayson Allen whatever the casee may be like they should be able to generate good enough shots like you have two at least two guys if not three if you include bill that can get two on the ball almost whenever they

Want to you have nerk as a passing Hub and a really really really good screener if they do want to operate second side to have him setting pin ends and stuff like that I don’t really have concerns about the offense and defensively with nerk in I have and have had my questions

With nerk defensively uh throughout his career but like at the very least that is an element of size and rebounding that helps and more importantly that KD into more of a Roma role defensively as a four and I think that’s where he’s best used and I think you can defend

Well enough with that grou my primary concern is with the Suns is what happens when they don’t have a center on the floor because the Drew Eubanks signing just did not hit the way that I thought it would and many suns fans thought it would he hasn’t been consistently good

We will frame it that way and so when they go to KD at the five I see the theory of it on both ends of the floor particularly offensively if KD is your five you have a whole bunch of space to operate with but but with Bill out in particular it just feels

Like it feels sacrilegious to say they’re easy to scheme for because that’s a lot of talent and like it’s not easy to deal with them but like conceptually cool KD has a post up Deon Booker’s one pass away we will double KD we will rotate to Deon Booker we will

Make sure that the last person in this chain when you swing the ball around is going to be the worst shooter on the floor and I feel like if you are able to do that enough in within a playoff setting especially with who they can end up facing in the first round in

Particular like I I would like to see them solve that portion of it and then defensively they just haven’t been able to hold water defensively with KD at the five and big number that popped for me like I have to matter of fact no it is updated got it after the Lakers game

Like with KD at the five filter don’t clean the glass to get all the centers off the floor an offensive rebound rate allowed of 39.7 opponent are rebounding 40% of their misses with Katie on the floor Without A Center on the floor if they can’t end possessions and they can’t

Generate great shots for the people that they want to have these great shots I do Wonder kind of what the ceiling is going to be with their small ball groups and just in general their small wall groups are small outside of ktie and so like those are that’s probably where I land

With concerns with Phoenix now offensively that last shooter in the chain problem gets easier for them to solve when they’re healthy because it can be you know the big three plus two of O’Neal Allen Gordon there’s enough shooting I just think those lineups are too small defensively like they’re going

To be Dynamite offensively but you the the rebounding number you just cited is like there’s a certain point where you are not playing sustainable basketball because of how many Second Chance teams are just playing volleyball against you that number is pass at that point like you just cannot win if you’re almost

Giving up 40% of your of the opponent’s misses back to them the other team with this profile I wanted you to hit on quickly very quietly the Clippers are three and four in their last seven games it hasn’t gotten a lot of attention because I think they established such a

High level of play when they went like 27 and five or whatever they did over such a long period of time after the initial stretch with Harden was so bad that I think they were everyone was like okay they that’s a proven thing probably internally they also hit the dog days

Before Allstar and had a couple of like Paul George missed the game kawhai missed the game Zoo missed a couple of games where they’re like we’ve proven it to ourselves we’re GNA just you know like it happens um they’re fourth overall in offense for the season tied

With Phoenix in defense so 13th 14th whatever it ends up being their defense has fallen apart in the last 10 games they’re averaging they’re allowing a points all out per possession that would be last for the season part of it is their rebounding has been bad and

They’re a small team I think I think if there’s something to pick at here they’re a bad defensive rebounding team they’re a little bit small but they have hit a gear defensively for prolonged periods of the season when they’re engaged that Phoenix cannot touch like the Clippers have done enough

Defensively when they really care where I’m like all right that’s a legit two-way team but you know you don’t want to fall too far out of the number one seed it’s getting less and less likely that they’re going to get all the way back up there they were there for a hot

Second um and you don’t want to lose too much touch with the habits that you built when you were becoming a dominant team what’s your concern level on the Clippers defense and what are you looking for um I think relatively low because of what you said like

When the when the slide happened I think is where I took a little bit of the concern glasses off and it’s like okay this is early February leading to the all-star break you have kawhai and Paul George both doing All-Star festivities insert James Harden joke here with an

All-Star break I think they’re going to be fine so I like I leave that portion alone I will say in terms of things that I’m monitoring one is going to be the transition defense uh since the beginning of February they’re 28th per clean the glass 28th in transition

Frequency allowed teams are running on them a lot and I think that’s 29th specifically off of misses and from there they are doing a very poor job like it’s reminiscent of the early Clippers stin with James hard they are doing a very poor job of matching up in

Transition it’s not even really a floor balance issue for me it is just closest guy to the ball is picking up someone else and then you got two guys sitting in the paint trying to figure out okay I’m going to get this guy I’m going to

Run over here next thing you know a wide from corner three has been giv up they have to clean that portion up and then one thing um another thing I’m going to continue to Monitor and it really popped in the most recent Kings game the switching in the half court does not

Feel good right now and like I wonder how much of that is just again getting back into the flow of things post Allstar break or just that early All-Star break stretch but it does feel like it’s a whole lot of standing and pointing you get that guy like James

Harden as much as I complimented him a little bit earli in the year about what his defensive effort has been like with the Clippers like a little bit of Ace there kawhai Leonard is communicating a lot and like generally that’s a positive but it feel like it’s weeding into the

Other side to hey kawai’s having to point out a whole lot of Direction defensively and with some of these vets he shouldn’t have to do as much as he does there off the ball in addition to who he’s having to guard and to your earlier Point overall with the

Rebounding this isn’t a big team so like you can’t even really afford to have gaps when you’re trying to switch because you’re already giving up mismatches because of the size if it’s size mismatch plus space because you’re not where you need to be you’re not connecting with people there are just

Driving gaps there are cutting gaps you set up space to set up pin ends on the weak side you’re all out of sorts and I think that’s probably the bigger thing I’m going to continue to track when they’re in the half court like what is the switching G to look like like there

Was a play go ahead no go go no I was GNA say quickly that there was a play around two minutes left in the second quarter of that Kings game uh late Daren Fox just walking the ball at the floor Mike Brown’s calling out something and

As dear and fox kind of drift to the right side of the floor Kawai just calls out a switch and everyone got confused from there like Terence man kind of looks like wait a minute well James Harden already has Kevin herder damont simonas is here but Z at the free throw

Line who am I guarding exactly Harrison Barnes goes from the right corner to the left corner James Harden is standing in one spot like nah you picked this guy up so while they’re all trying to sort out who they’re guarding then it’s just an easy pick and roll for dearon Fox and

Damont sabonis you get two on the ball sabonis gets a layup and it’s like I don’t love seeing these kind of breakdowns like why commun maybe they were just confused that Kawai was talking so much they’re like wait who said that who said that um look you mentioned switching which is

On point because when they’re engaged they don’t mess up switches they they are on they’re switch into into the bodies they they don’t oh gaps do not open and and to your earlier Point like Harden was doing his part defensively for most of that stretch playing some of

The best defense of his career which is low bar I realize but all they need him to do um so I’m I’m gonna give them a pass on that I will say you know they made a conscious decision at the trade deadline we’re not making a move we’re

Not going to put our first round pick and play because it’s the only one we have left our pick’s going to be frozen once we get over the second apron we got to keep it we’re not even going to compete for the Royce O’Neal price at three second round picks I don’t know

How hard they looked at that to be clear but they didn’t get him and Phoenix got him for what they got him for so that should tell you something we’re going to roll with what we got we know who their starters are their starters are excellent their first three Off the

Bench are Powell fantastic Russ has hit a little bit of a rough patch in the last two weeks where he’s starting to look like Lakers Russ and they need to get that back to where it was before and then the backup center thing I like the

Way they look with Ty more than plumbley only because Ty is a pseudo shooting five and like that gives Russ a little more space to wreak havoc in the paint plumbley is probably a better overall player than Ty I’m not sure he’s a better fit Amir coffee is Guy number

Nine and they’ve been getting to him more for various reasons so that’s something um just I’m just looking at it but um I I I would like them they have a couple of they have a Lakers game which is a big National TV game tomorrow uh Minnesota on Sunday then two games

Against Milwaukee within the next week and then Minnesota again I would like them in some of those games to like show up really and Minnesota had a landmark win against them earlier in a couple weeks ago um but I I’m not I’m not worried worried about this team I just

There’s been some slippage in meaningful ways yeah like probably too early to press the big red button but it’s much yeah it’s very much a with some of the Personnel limitations in particular the size limitations this is what it looks like if you aren’t keyed in like you’re

Not GNA be able to out Talent the West you may have more talent but these are really good teams well in matchups keep an eye on matchups Denver huge Minnesota huge you’re going to be at a size deficit against either of those teams if you get them in a playoff series and we

Talked about their Minnesota games coming up it’s just it’s an interesting test for them it’s not it looked like they were just going to cruise through the rest of the regular season maybe even get the one seed and like be the toast of the NBA and now they’ve hit a

Little bit of a rough stretch but I I just like they’re they’re still in my to be clear like I’m picking Denver to come out of the West I have from day one I probably would put Clippers number two and they’re still in my very very Inner Circle small Inner Circle of contenders

Okay nikai Duncan the dunker spot with Steve Jones Jr who’s also been kind enough to lend me some time old man in the three in the three things with JJ Reck um and just A+ NBA content as you can tell if you want to know what’s going on

In the games this is a guy to listen to We will do eight minutes on the Charlotte Hornets the next time you come on if they’re still playing well I will give you eight total minutes on the Charlotte Hornets thank you sir thank you for having Me