JJ McCarthy, Drake Maye & Jayden Daniels in depth | Hoge & Jahns

How should Bears fans feel about the OTHER QB options in this year’s draft OTHER THAN CALEB WILLIAMS? Let’s talk about the three next guys up, Michigan’s JJ McCarthy, UNC’s Drake Maye, and LSU Heisman winner Jayden Daniels, with the people from The Athletic who know them the best – Austin Meek, Brendan Marks and David Ubben.

#chicagobears #dabears #chicago

0:00 Intro
2:39 JJ McCarthy / Austin Meek
25:28 Drake Maye / Brendan Marks
45:11 Jayden Daniels / David Ubben

What’s up welcome in Hogan John’s just the John’s part of the show um Adam Hogue is just getting back from Cal California sorry Hawaii even better Adam hog is coming back from Hawaii we will be back together in Indianapolis where Kevin fishbane will join us as well but um this Hogan J’s

Episode I want to call a special one right it’s a a special edition college quarterback edition of Hogan Johns um I am your host Adam Johns um you can follow me on Twitter at Adam Johns you can read my stuff Kevin fishbane stuff on theathletic.com I believe the beat

Writer mock draft is up there where I played the role of Ryan poles and I drafted a quarterback and made a trade and picked a pass rusher and made another trade so be sure to check that out on theathletic.com you can read Adam H stuff on all chg.com

Uh you know where to find us on Twitter you know where to find Us online hit that subscribe button on YouTube if you can tell your friends um so this show is a special one we are going to go through the quarterbacks after Caleb Williams and we have three guests uh to interview

Basically so this is how it’s going to work this episode was recorded over three days so you’ll see me change outfits a bit you’ll see me deal with a cough that I’ve been dealing with all week um some nagging stuff before the combine but I think this is a fun

Episode we have three great guests who know Drake May who know JJ McCarthy and who know Jaden Daniels again one of my favorite stories of this draft going I want to put that on record um so I hope you enjoy this Insight um we’re g to go

In order of interview so we’re GNA go um JJ McCarthy Drake May and then Jaden Daniels some may tell you that’s kind of like the back to front view of the draft now with Caleb Williams still number one um depending on how you want to slot

Them I’m sure that will vary from Team to team but the Insight we have is amazing I want to thank all three of our guests but let’s begin with JJ McCarthy where we bring in the Athletics Michigan writer Austin Meek you can follow on him follow him on Twitter by Austin Meek that’s

Meek he’s covered a very interesting season for Michigan that ended with a national championship um he knows Jim Harbaugh well he knows JJ McCarthy well so let’s bring in Austin Austin the last time that we were together we were in Indianapolis sitting next to each other

In the Press Box first roll the Press Box of Lucas Oil Stadium JJ McCarthy helps lead Michigan to the Big 10 championship and then I remember talking to you about like well the next step he’s got the college football player playoff and then possibly the national championship what changed for you when

You’re looking at McCarthy like after that game that we saw against Iowa yeah well you definitely did not see JJ McCarthy at his best in that game uh if I recall or or Michigan’s offense as well uh but I think over the course of this season and really over the

Course of JJ McCarthy’s career at at Michigan we saw him really develop into a quarterback uh who I think is ready for this step uh a quarterback Who uh you know his role at Michigan was different than it would have been at a lot of programs and we can we can talk

About that uh but really he was he was exactly what this Michigan team needed and I think that that came out in the in the Rose Bowl and in the national championship game uh Michigan’s offense wasn’t necessarily built around him uh but he really you know he really had

Both the physic phical traits and I think the mindset uh to come in and and lead a team where the quarterback was not going to be the the focal point of the offense and he accepted that he he um orchestrated the offense uh he you know put Blake corm and and Donovan

Edwards in in position to succeed behind that offensive line at Michigan and and delivered a national championship and I think U even though some Michigan fans were hoping that he would back for his senior year I think as soon as Michigan won that National Championship it was it

Was pretty clear that his next step was to go on to the NFL so maybe take us through that role because I don’t know if the the draft experts on Twitter are starting to just watch more film on him because I think the NFL has always been

Pretty high on JJ McCarthy but you watched every snap of his the the past couple Seasons like what was his role um and him not being the focal point of that offense like how would you interpret that if you’re evaluating him for the next level well I think it’s a

Tricky evaluation because whatever team drafts him is is gonna ask him to do different things than he did at Michigan Michigan’s offense really was was built around the running game built around Blake corm uh built around that offensive line and and the quarterback uh was not asked to do everything that

Quarterbacks are asked to do at the next level so there there is a degree of projecting of how how is he going to do these things that he wasn’t asked to do at Michigan I mean that’s the case I think for every quarterback coming out but maybe particularly for JJ McCarthy

Just because of of the scheme that he played in and the offense that he played in so his his job really was take care of the ball um make good decisions when you need to throw it you know when you get in third down uh be

Able to make a play and I think that’s one of his real strengths is he was he was great on third down this year uh some of the Off Script plays he made when the pocket broke down some of the things that you you can’t really teach

Uh he he was excellent at that you know there’s some other things you know maybe some things that that other quarterbacks in this class are going to be more polished at that he’s going to have to learn on the job so I’m guessing that evaluators when they look at him are

Going to see kind of a mixed bag but I think what you see is certainly some glimpses of the ability to um when he’s asked to do more things than he was asked to do at Michigan um the ability to to learn to do those things and

Eventually do it at a really high level so so he only has like 7133 pass attempts that is that is low for a two-year starter it just is so like you said it takes some projection but like I’m glad you brought up those third down numbers because I have some of them here

And and they are they’re ridiculously good man and so they have him broken down this this page I’m looking at has him broken down by by distance so like third down with four to six to go he is 12 for 18 this year for 118 yards but it

Gets better the further the the Wolverines were back on Third and third down seven and nine they go he was 19 for 27 that’s 70% of his passes that’s for 266 yards two touchdowns um 15 first downs and this this is what blows my mind to third down 10 plus yards he was

17 for 22 that’s 77.3 completion percentage for 278 yards four touchdowns and 12 first downs so like those numbers like you saw it take us through like those weren’t were they easy throws was it all him I think you mentioned some some improvising he had to do like take us through those third

Down numbers if you can yeah I mean in a way he is at his best I think when when he’s improvising sometimes the you know the routine plays where the plays that we saw him struggle with and the plays where he’s he’s just freelancing uh and trying to convert a

Third down were were some of the best plays that he made and so probably the hope for whoever drafts him is going to be like hey we can we can teach him to get better at some of the routine things and the things he does that you can’t

Teach like he’s just got that innately so I you know I just he’s a playmaker that’s how I would I would describe him he’s not the most consistent quarterback in the in the class by any stretch uh but he can he can make the magic happen I mean there’s definitely a a playground

Sandlot Dimension to his game where you know we saw him just scramble around back there you know wave at his receivers to go deep and and find a guy downfield uh and there’s certainly a risk reward calculation with that um his decision- making I think has been

A been a work in progress throughout his his college career and will be at the NFL level as well but but he you know for a guy who certainly makes some um some risky throws I think for the most part he took care of the ball pretty

Well uh it’s just the the stress that he puts on a defense I think with his ability to make any throw with his Mobility his ability to get out of the pocket the Run threat and then I I think just the you know the courage um to take

The shot there’s there’s throws he made that a lot of quarterbacks wouldn’t even try to make uh but but he’ll he’ll make that throw and and a lot of times he’ll complete that throw and I think that upside is part of what’s going to be really uh really appealing for him at

The next level he’s got a couple like ridiculous throws on tape everybody remembers the Ohio State one like just speaking of pure armed Talent what do you make of it like what have you seen the past couple years yeah I think he can make every throw I I think

That’s one of the things that’s going to separate him is you know he can he can throw from one hasch mark across the field and and get it there in a hurry he can put it in a really tight window as he showed with that throw against Ohio

State I mean that was like a six inch window and he he squeezed that ball in there Roman Wilson so you see him make every throw I think that he’ll need to make at the next level you know his accuracy on the Deep ball I think um can

Get better and like I said sometimes it’s the routine throws that he’ll miss and you know he can make those throws and it’s a little bit um a little bit puzzling maybe why he’s not more more consistent with some of those throws but I think what people will see when they

When they watch his film is that um he he’s got an electric arm he he can he can make the throws it’s just a matter of maybe some things mechanically um to sort out footwork all of that stuff just to to be more consistent so when I was doing this this

Quarterback series he was like the third quarterback mentioned everyone’s that when I talk to Scouts around the league of course you have to go see Cale Williams you have to go see Drake May and then the third name I got was JJ McCarthy so like I guess the question I

Have for you is does how about this does Michigan do what it’s done the past couple years especially this year winning the national championship going undefeated without JJ McCarthy could they have done that with a different quarterback or was he just like the perfect person quarterback leader needed for

This team yeah I mean I would go back to when Michigan played Georgia in the in the Orange Bowl after the 2021 season that was JJ’s freshman season and Michigan starting quarterback was Kade mcnamer and there was a discussion That season when JJ was a freshman of do you

Do you stick with Cade mcnamer who’s an older quarterback and a little more polished or do you just throw the young guy out there and let him play and um ultimately That season JJ was was the backup he was a situational quarterback he came in as as a runner at times uh

But I think after that season Michigan looked at its team and said if we’re gonna win a National Championship we have to get more Dynamic at quarterback and we have that guy on our roster it’s it’s JJ McCarthy and so Kade mcnamer ended up transferring to to Iowa they

Had a quarterback competition going into that season that JJ McCarthy won and I do think that ultimately the reason Michigan was able to win that National Championship was because they had a playmaker quarterback even if they didn’t ask him to do that every single game you know they won that Penn State

Game running it 32 times in a row JJ McCarthy was was banged up in that game so he always hurt right like there was an he was yeah yeah what exactly the injury was we never quite found out but but what I heard is he was he was pretty

Significantly banged up at the end of the season and that did impact his his numbers at the end of the year year which weren’t as good as his numbers at the beginning um but what Michigan really needed I think to be able to to ultimately win the national championship

Was a quarterback who could make a play when they needed their quarterback to make a play and they didn’t need that every game they didn’t need that as much as some other teams maybe leaned on their quarterbacks to be Playmakers um but just having that guy and knowing

That he could do it I think was the difference for Michigan ultimately to get over the hump and and win the national championship you mentioned him being a young guy he was a young guy like throughout his success especially if you compare him to the other quarterbacks or some of the other

Quarterbacks in this draft class he was 20 20 years old and some of these other guys were 23 grown adults can can legally drink and whatnot like what do you make of that like for someone who covers college sports like what do you make of his success being you know under

The legal legal drinking age for for all of it yeah Ian I think his makeup and his uh mental maturity is probably higher than a lot of other quarterbacks at that age uh I think one thing that’s going to come out every team that talks to him everybody who gets a chance to

Sit down with him he is a really he’s a really mature mature guy and has a really I think mature perspective on on the game on his role you know hey there’s a lot of quarterbacks who I think would have would have you know felt like maybe they were being held

Back in Michigan’s offense and would have been like you know I can be I can be a 10 pick I got to go somewhere where I can show that off um but you never got that from from JJ McCarthy he he seemed to understand the big picture of what

Michigan was trying to do he seemed to understand his role he was in a really tough situation with a a competition with a veteran quarterback who you know frankly I don’t think you know felt real happy about the situation of this five-star freshman coming in trying to

Take the job uh the team really easily could have been divided by that and I think a different personality in in JJ McCarthy’s shoes might not have handled that as well as he did so I think the youth probably shows up in some of the decision making um just some

Of the ways you watch him and and you see that he’s still pretty raw as a player uh but I think in terms of his his personality and his ability to uh to lead a team even though he is really young I I think he’s gonna check that

Box for a lot of teams I think they’re gonna sit down with him and be like you know this guy has you know like between the ears he has he has the right stuff to be able to um to be a an NFL starter as he gets all of the other pieces in

Place so those intangibles that you hear about all the time like to you they’re they’re for real like this is this is part of his well his makeup his part of the NFL’s evaluation him like these intangibles will carry over they they are for real like everything Jim

Harbaugh is saying about him like buy into it because there’s some these are valid yeah yeah I think so I mean every every team is going to weigh that differently and how much value they place on that how much value do you place on the fact

That he was 27 and one as the starter you know that’s not just the quarterback stat right that’s that’s the whole team but I think you know there certainly is some validity to the fact that um the personality of the quarterback goes a long way in in being able to to win over

A team and lead a team and and I think JJ McCarthy has those qualities um you know I think he’s got a little bit of like the Tom Brady um mindset certainly not that you know not predicting that he’s going to be Tom Brady uh but I think he models himself

After Tom Brady in a way um you know he’s a he’s a kind of a deep thinker you know he he’s pretty insightful about um his own approach you know takes really um really meticulous care of his body and his mind um the kind of things that

Are going to going to potentially set up a quarterback to have a good career so uh I do think that he’s got a lot of those those qualities that when you when you put it together with the rest of the package the uh the arm talent and the

Athleticism I think that all of that points to a guy who has a has a really promising future but also has some things he’s he’s going to have to really work on I want to ask you about some of those things he has to work on um but

Like as an extension everything you just said everything that Jim Harbaugh said about him this like glowing praise from like the start to to the Finish did did you ever like roll your eyes at it or I know coaches talk up with their players but like how real was that it felt so

Heartfelt at times at least when I’m watching it there at Lucas o Oil Stadium like it felt real to me at least in that moment I I’ve read a bunch of it um there’s so much of it like what’s the best way to interpret Jim Harbaugh’s well glowing Praise of him throughout

The two years yeah I think you have to understand the relationship there with Jim Harbaugh and and JJ McCarthy the relationship between Jim Harbaugh and his his quarterback is always going to be a a unique relationship and I think particularly with those two guys it was a a unique relationship I think Jim

Harbaugh saw lot of himself in JJ McCarthy he uh he compared the two at times you know talked about how there were things that JJ did on the field that reminded Jim Harbaugh of himself as a player I think the competitive makeup of JJ McCarthy um really Jim Harbaugh

Really connected with that so yeah there were times that it it sometimes felt a little bit over the top um you know like when Jim Harbaugh is talking about JJ McCarthy as as the best college quarterback in Michigan history um you know maybe he was maybe he wasn’t um I

Think a lot of that was just Jim Harbaugh you pouring confidence into his quarterback and making sure that JJ McCarthy understood how much Michigan how much Jim Harbaugh valued the things that he does on the field so you know was was it real I I think that it was

Real in the sense that part of what um part of what made Jim Harbaugh and this Michigan team successful is just that level of belief that they all had in each other and maybe somebody looking at it from the outside you know it looks a little weird or you know maybe a little

Bit like embellished um but it’s it’s just kind of a matter of perspective I think and um certainly from the perspective of Jim Harbaugh if you asked him um he would he would probably take JJ McCarthy as his quarterback in a heartbeat he’s he’s got a quarterback in uh Los Angeles so he

He’s probably not in the market but if he was in the market I I think there would be a a pretty good chance that JJ McCarthy would be would be playing for Jim Harbaugh all right so let’s let’s go through these question marks like how would you list them how how would you

Rank them is it the decision- making is it the lack of pass attempts is it not being the focal point like if you had to give me your three most important concerns about him like or your three concerns about him like what what would they be

Yeah I think probably the ability to to process the game at at a really high level process it quickly um make all the reads you know I’m not a I’m not a scout so you know I I’m my perspective on this is maybe a little bit limited but I

Think that probably when he gets to the next level um he’s just going to have to uh it’s going to be a lot more complicated for him than it was at Michigan he’s going to have to be able to really read the field read the defense um not rely maybe on his

Athleticism or his his pure arm Talent as much as he did at Michigan uh you know there’s definitely some times that that he maybe would you know his first read isn’t open he bailes on the pocket and he’s such a good athlete at the college level that he could make a play

Um I don’t know that he’ll be able to do that as much in the NFL so he’s probably gonna have to you know he’s as every rookie quarterback has to do he’s gonna have have to um adapt to the speed of the game and and be able to read all of

The complicated stuff that that he’s seeing back there U so I think it’s that I think it’s it’s some mechanics and just making sure like he’s he’s always putting himself in position um you know his eyes his feet all of that lined up um you know and just like there’s

There’s a handful of throws I think that when people go back and look at his season there’s a handful of throws you’ll look at and you’re just kind of like what you know what was he what was he seeing on that throw you know what you see what he’s capable of and he

Plays at such a high level and then there just will be some plays where um you can tell that something went went haywire with the process and you’re not exactly sure what it was but I think his his coaches are going to figure that out

Um so all of it to me is is correctable but but it is something that’s probably going to take him some time would you be surprised if he’s a top 10 pick um maybe a little bit but not not super surprised I mean I I think you

Know first half of the first round would would not stun me um I mean look quarterbacks quarterbacks um are always going to go higher than than you know you you maybe think they should when you watch watch them as college players right like um and especially you know

When you watch a guy every single day every single game like uh you know I I’ve seen way more JJ McCarthy than any other college quarterback so I’ve seen the good I’ve seen the bad um I think you know I think there’s probably a lot

Of good that I saw from him that maybe people didn’t see if they just watched like the rosebowl or the Big 10 championship game um you know there’s also some um some stuff I saw that um you know probably is is something that’s a a red flag or at least a concern um

For for NFL people but you know I think the whole picture is a guy who um just has such a high ceiling and is so early in in the development curve compared to some other guys that I would not be surprised at all if there’s a team that’s like hey this guy’s already

Really good and he’s really young and and we think that he’s got even another level that he’s going to get to pretty quickly and if if that means he goes in the top half of the first round I I wouldn’t be shocked by that at all so at

The very least you see him as a Young quarterback probably the youngest he is the youngest of of at least the top five or six at the very least worth a first round pick at some point I think so if if a team needs a quarterback of the future and they’re

Willing to be patient with him I I think that that could be a really good situation for him like if you’re thinking he’s going to be your day one starter um you know that’s certainly a gamble I think there are other other quarterbacks in the class who would

Probably be safer pi to come in and and start right away uh but if you’re looking at him as a guy that you’re really drafting for the long term and you feel like you you’ve got a good team around him similar to the way Michigan put a really good team around him and

You’re willing to be patient and and develop him then I mean a quarterback of of the future like if you got a chance to draft that guy then you you draft him like you know first round wherever your pick is if you think he’s your quarterback in the future then you take

Him and and I won’t be be surprised if there’s a team that looks at JJ McCarthy and thinks that’s what he’s going to be Austin man thank you great stuff it’s good to see you again um they had to be an awesome run just just to cover and

Michigan kept you very very busy for a lot of reasons uh this year but uh uh thank you my friend um be sure to check out Austin’s work on the athletic uh you can follow him on X by Austin Meek that’s Meek uh thank you man we’ll see where JJ

Goes all right man thanks for having me on I appreciate it all right let’s keep this going our next guest is Brandon Mars he’s the Athletics North Carolina writer it’s more than basketball too he’s on Twitter Brenan R marks that’s R marks M A KS uh fantastic stuff on North Carolina’s basketball

Team but also had a fun quarterback to cover the past couple years in Drake May so let’s bring in Brandon marks from the athletic Brandon I I I have to begin with this because I feel like we just have to get just get it out of the way please tell everybody that’s listening

Or watching us on YouTube right now why Drake May is different than Mitchell trabis yeah I I hear this one a lot um especially from from fans of teams that might be drafting Drake and are very afraid of how Mitch trabis turned out I think the biggest thing you got to start

With his experience you know Drake Started almost twice as many games as Mitch did in college and you know really Mitch was a backup for two years behind marqueis Williams and and sort of Lost starting job the year before he did ultimately start for North Carolina versus Drake who came in was obviously

Seen as the successor to Sam H straight away uh and and had time to sit and learn understanding that he was going to be the likely starter going into the next season so the experience thing I think you can’t really understand and like the hype started last year even

Like like trabis was just like one year of hype like Drake May going into this last season was considered top five material maybe top overall pick material yeah he was honestly if you go back to high school I mean this is a guy who was originally committed to Alabama right

And so he had that pedigree even going back that far and you know I know we’ll talk more about Sam how in a bit but for UNCC fans Sam how was like as good as it gets at the quarterback position and then you have the idea that there’s this

Guy behind him who might be even better um so that hype with Drake I think he also had to handle it for for not just more than a year but a couple of years so okay so how is he different than Sam how at one point Sam how led the league

In passing yards last year well as an NFL quarterback for the Washington commanders and here’s Washington again potentially looking at Drake May at number two so how are they different yeah well you know obviously Drake uh stature wise is much bigger than Sam was much more of a prototypical

Passer um you know Sam was maybe generously listed at six foot uh six foot one I mean I remember talking to uh uncc’s old offensive coordinator Phil Longo in his office and you know he’s saying he hears all these Drew Brees comparisons Baker Mayfield comparisons

Cuz that’s the size Sam was um I I think the other thing with Sam was he came in and was coming into such a bad situation you know m brown had just been hired again the roster was basically completely void I mean the year before North Carolina was starting a guy Chaz

Satat who’s been playing linebacker in the NFL uh they were starting him at quarterback so Sam came into a completely empty cupboard and has to do a little bit more of everything Drake did at least have some infrastructure around him when he took over the starting spot um obviously had Josh JS

Who’s now doing killing it with the Indianapolis Colts so Drake I came think came into a better situation and was better poised to take advantage of it I know you haven’t seen like every game or every snap of Drake May there you have other things to cover in North Carolina

Including a a basketball team that seems to be good every single year but like how would you sum up the experience in terms of here’s this Prospect again committed to Alabama like were expect expectations met uh did did he fail in a certain capacity like

How would you sum it up for us yeah you know I I think probably unfairly to Drake his tenure in Chapel Hill is going to be considered as a bit of an under an underwhelming experience um essentially you’ve got a guy who could be the number

One pick in the draft and two years in a row when he was the starter the team fell apart down the stretch you know his first season as a starter UNC starts nine and one finishes 4-0 you know loses every game of consequence down the stretch last year start 6-0 finished two

And5 only beat one FBS team over the last month and a half of season and a lot of that is because he he had to be Superman I mean North Carolina’s defense has been one of the worst in the country the past couple of years running um

Running game Hit or Miss uh this year it was obviously much better with am Marian Hampton but he really had to kind of do everything for North Carolina to even have a chance in these games it’s how you see these stat lines where he’s got 40 50 passing attempts um but the fact

That North Carolina could not win more with a guy who was this good um I think you know probably unfairly it’s going to taint the way that people in Chapel Hill remember him it’s it’s kind of like a what if back toback with Sam how and Drake may you have two you know

Starting caliber NFL quarterbacks and you don’t really accomplish anything of note so it’s a it’s a tough balance for North Carolina because I think they realize how good Drake is but they’re not going to see the best of him in a UNC uniform I I got a what if for you

And I love that show I don’t know if you’re a fan of of Marvel but I like the show they have um so here’s a what if for for you what if Drake May stayed at Alabama like are we talking about him being qb1 over Caleb Williams

Maybe at this point I know it’s it’s a maybe a crazy hypothetical it is a wh if but just given where he is right now I mean what if he stayed at Alabama like what do you think we’d be talking about right now yeah well you know for

Starters I think you would have been talking about Alabama potentially last season having you know in 2022 maybe having back-to-back Heisman winners I mean I think that would have been a realistic expectation for Drake coming in having you know the skill talent that Alabama does especially having the

Offensive line that Drake does uh that Alabama does Drake is working behind an offensive line that you know no no disrespect to what they’re doing at UNCC but uh patchy or leaky might be a little bit of a generous interpretation and that’s not gonna that wouldn’t have been

The case at Alabama he wouldn’t have had to score 40 points a game to just keep his team in games like he had to do at North Carolina so I do think you’re probably talking about like I wonder if he I don’t know that he would have surpassed Caleb I think that certainly

It would be much more of a pick your poison kind of conversation versus now the national landscape it seems at least somewhat established with Caleb as the unquestionable number one guy I think that if you put a little more around Drake he would have had you know probably even better production than he

Already did he was a Heisman finalist in the first place so um it’s tough to say the other you know it could be the flip side of things too where if he’s asked to do less maybe he doesn’t have to do as much maybe he doesn’t have the Gotti

Stats yeah yeah I hear you um the last time like we talked a bunch about Drake may like I was going down to to Chapel Hill myself to go see him play Duke which had well at that time in the season one of the better defenses in the

League the Drake May hype was just starting to get to really get going I thought this year um and then I covered a game where it was it double overtime or triple overtime I forget d like but but it was an amazing game where he had

To kept coming back and coming back he had a scramble or was it a design run either way like he’s running the ball he’s getting tackled and he pitches it back to a guy for more yardage he keeps firing away down the field long completion after long completion like I

Was impressed leaving that game and talking to to people who worked for North col at the time like that Press Box was filled with more NFL Scouts and Executives at that point in the season like they never like they’ve never experienced anything like that so what strikes you about his onfield

Talent his potential yeah so I mean I think one of the things you’re hitting at there is like that that Never Say Die mentality North Carolina is a team that should not have been in half the games that it was in the last two seasons with Drake may as the starting quarterback

And strictly because of him it’s one of those things where you never believe you’re fully out of the game because he always seems to have some sort of hero play and you know to go back to the differences between him and Mitch Tris you know Drake is so much more of an

Athlete so much more of a weapon as a runner I mean North Carolina really utilized him in some RPO games they really utilized him like you’re talking about on on designed CU quarterback runs and then the scrambling ability like when you needed a play there was always

This sense that Drake May was going to get it no matter if you know kind of like Patrick Mahomes in the Super Bowl like didn’t matter if he just had to keep it himself he was willing to do that um in terms of like his passing Talent like his ability to see the

Entire field I think you know especially for for North Carolina fans who haven’t seen that kind of quarterback play was pretty exceptional um you know Sam how is a guy who really got a lot of credit for his deep balls and his touchdown there Drake’s ability to layer it at any

Level um really really special special talent I I was impressed by how he well he’s tall he’s lean but he’s faster than he than he looks and he he gains yardage faster than you think he is before you know it he has a first down I think it was D Brugler had the

Stat just in terms of like third and fourth down runs that of all the top quarterbacks like he leads them in that category just in terms of converting first down so like that stood out to me just in terms of like an athlete I think what you said is pretty notable because

Mitch when he got to the NFL like his legs were an assip but you’re seeing a lot more of that from May almost instantly you know as a college quarterback right and comparatively you know Sam you North Carolina used Sam how somewhat similarly his last season as a

Starter after Javonte Williams and some of those guys had gone off to the NFL um but with Drake the frame you’re so much less worried about the injury risk like for Sam being six foot it was kind of like oh boy like can he you know and Sam

How takes a lot of sack as is it was like can he continue to take those hits but Draco stick his nose in there and that like you said he is he is faster he’s bigger than you would think that he would be um you know I know we get a lot

Of Justin Herbert comparisons and we’ll get into that but he really is a sneaky sneaky good athlete not to rely on those buzzwords or whatever for someone who is entrenched in well in Chapel Hill there like can you detail like how his like his family ties his brother who was an

Important part of a very good basketball team there in North Car Carolina like I think this is a positive for a lot of NFL teams that he has this type of well athletic pedigree that is obviously generational but is grown up in an extremely competitive family yeah for

Sure so you know going back to his dad even you know Mark his dad played quarterback at North Carolina in the 80s um um you know that family Legacy that Mark started has paid dividends so you know you had Mark starting off the gun then Luke may as you mentioned came in

Played basketball at North Carolina was a preferred walk- on but ended up hitting one of the greatest shots in UNC basketball history in 2017 to beat Kentucky UNCC goes on to win the national title Luke becomes an All-America in the next couple of Seasons um their other brother Cole won

A baseball National Championship of Florida you know their other brother Bo played basketball for North Carolina last year so like the athletic Bloodlines Run Deep and you know that is ultimately the reason why he decided to pull back on the Alabama commitment it was because the family did have this

This sense of loyalty and the sense of Duty and they’re a great family I mean and spending time with Luke and spending time with Mark they are terrific people and I certainly think that’s a bonus if you’re scouting him to be the face of your franchise yeah this is where the

Intangibles come in right this is where you’re looking at leadership competitiveness hard work all those things that are examined thoroughly by NFL teams like I feel like you don’t hear a lot about like Drake May’s intangibles like especially compared to like JJ McCarthy where that’s like the

First thing Scouts will bring up what do you see in Drake May for someone who’s been around him more than some of us has talked to his teammates like what do you hear about Drake May what do you feel about Drake May yeah you know I I think

This is where his time under Sam H how really comes and and plays dividends so he has the family background where they understand competitiveness they the spotlight they understand how you have to behave when you are in those situations and then being behind Sam Hal who is definitely not a raah raah guy

Kind of just very workmanlike you never get too high you never get too low um you know I think a lot of that really stuck with Drake and you know even when Sam would come back in the summer after he had been drafted to the NFL like the

Work that those two are doing together it’s on making sure that okay even when things go wrong how are you going to handle all those situations so I think just like steadiness composure he’s not you know he’s a he’s a yes sir guy um you know very good country boy in that

Sense um but you don’t really hear a lot about any of this off the field stuff he’s had a longterm you know girlfriend like he’s just a very about football kind of guy um I mean it is like his passion you know like Sam how used to

Joke that his date on Valentine’s Day every year was Madden like you could say the same sort of thing about Drake like they just love football they’ve sort of been bred to play football um and obviously he he responded when he got his opportunities what are your concerns

Like like how would you just describe because again going back to this conversation I think there’s a lot of reasons why Caleb Williams is qb1 and I think some teams some pundants some analysts those who watch Drake May closely have some concerns like for someone who has watched him closely and

Covered some of his games like where would you rate your concerns with his potential for the NFL yeah I I think I go back to that Never Say Die mindset it’s a blessing and a curse um you know with Howell it was never say die so I’m

Going to hold on to the ball as long as possible ends up taking a lot of sacks Drake sometimes trusts himself too much to go and make some of those hero plays he’ll throw it into traffic he’ll throw it into a tough situation um he’ll do things off platform that you know maybe

You shouldn’t do um things that Caleb is probably a little bit better at so I think that’s a number one concern and then just continuing to be able to to read and Survey the whole field like you know you saw Drake’s game hit a different level this year when uh TZ

Walker who’s you know another top 100 draft prospect was able to come back and was finally eligible you’ll be interested to see like okay if he goes to a team that maybe doesn’t have the weapons how capable if he is is he of elevating them versus just taking

Advantage of the guys he had when he had Josh downs and he could just feed Josh Downs he knew he had an NFL guy um was a lot more seamless than as we saw this season sometimes you know you’re looking for your tight ends you’re trying to make things happen that’s when those

Mistakes would come so I would say those are they’re two of the bigger concerns but again like the guy started a lot of games and and you’ve you’ve got a pretty pretty good body of work on who he is already so after that Duke game which

Again which was a win for May in North Carolina I thought he was exceptional in it like M Brown gets up to that Podium that LEC turn and basically calls him the best quarterback in the country and I know I’m not gonna ask you to interpret that you know coaches do that

It’s not like Jim Harbaugh who I think has adopted JJ McCarthy by this point this point but like like Beyond ma Brown what type of did you get from the coaches because I’m curious about it just because there’s some NFL experience around well Drake May in Freddy kitchens

There’s cly Christensen who was Tom Brady’s QB coach like what type of influences do you think they’ve had on what type of player Drake may can be yeah again as somebody who wasn’t there even as somebody who wasn’t there in the building every single day you heard a

Lot about how Christensen helped Drake May and again continuing to talk about that approach the way to to handle things um especially as North Carolina season went on the defense slipped a lot it became more apparent like okay we’re going to need a little bit more of Superman Drake um his approach never

Really changed and I think a lot of the the credit the credit for his preparation goes to Christensen and the way they work together um but again like I was talking about like I think probably nationally he has only the buzz is still starting to pick up but like

Locally this is something where fans have been waiting for him for years like the AL you hear Alabama commit and you start to get excited but like you know even even talking to you know the offensive coordinator who recruited him at North Carolina Phil Longo like Longo

Had a guy in Sam how who he thought was an NFL quarterback and yet you’d walk out of every conversation with him in his office and he’s going but wait till the next one um so there was this always this sense that I’ll give you a great

Example there was talk when Drake May first got to college about how at Clemson Taj Boyd was sort of Sam how he was the guy who returned the program to National relevance but it was going to be the guy after him who actually took the program to the heights that it was

Capable of there was a similar sentiment in North Carolina that Sam how’s the guy who’s going to put North Carolina back on a level of respectability but Drake May is going to be able to elevate even beyond that um and again the winds didn’t follow you know how complete the

Team was around him I don’t know what you would say um but in terms of him elevating his play and single-handedly being able to win games like you’re talking about that Duke one he showed why he was able to do that all right last question danne Brugler has compared him

To Justin Herbert I feel like a lot of analysts have I’m sure some teams have to what do you make of it is is it just more than the body type I guess because you’re you’re talking about six foot five six foot6 guys who are tall lean they they

Look the the part just in terms of the the physical makeup what you want in terms of size and whatnot like what do you think of it what do you make of that comparison yeah I I think Drake is probably I would say a little more

Athletic I think that Drake can be more of a a weapon as a runner I mean obviously you don’t want to expose your franchise quarterback and and make him susceptible to injury but I do think in terms of especially some of that short yardage stuff like he can be really

Effective there um I don’t know that he has quite the arm strength that Justin Herbert does um you know Herbert can really yak that thing I don’t know that Drake is quite to that level um but certainly what you’re talking about in terms of the stature in terms of the processing ability

Um in terms of the ability to manipulate a game and again that sentiment that like as long as I’ve got this guy I have an opportunity to win you know like give this guy back the ball with two minutes and see what he can do I think they do

Share that that you know style of play so there are small differences that I would say between them but I understand why so many people are including Dane obviously are high on that comparison would you be shocked if he like at this point would you be

Shocked if he’s the first pick I would be surprised I wouldn’t be shocked um I I I will say this I think there’s still upside here like the guy has started two full seasons he started whatever 26 games or so but I do still think there’s more upside just because we haven’t

Really seen what he can do with NFL Talent around him like when he had one NFL guy in Josh DS he was spamming him Josh Downs put up career record numbers for UNCC receivers all time Drake looked like a Heisman finals that was with one

NFL guy I’m fascinated to see if you put him in a situation like in a Chicago or even in a Washington where you do have legitimate weapons like how good could this guy be um I think that there’s still an opportunity that he we haven’t seen the best from

Drake May um which is obviously what you want if you’re drafting a guy he’s still relatively young I wouldn’t be shocked I don’t think that he’s going to make as many wow plays as Caleb is um but if you’re looking for somebody who has the potential to be like a a real legitimate

Franchise quarterback and take advantage and and you’re going to be in every game I could see why that would be convincing as a number one pick brenon thank you so much awesome stuff good to see you good to hear from you again uh be sure to

Follow brandan at Brendan R marks M K he is our North Carolina writer for the athletic man thanks again yeah thanks for having me I appreciate you and last but not least we have David ubin A friend of the show he’s been on it a few

Times um he is a college writer for the athletic who let say he specializes in covering the SEC he knows that conference through and through um you can follow him on Twitter David ubin ubbe he’s been on here before you’ve heard his SEC Insight before um let’s

Bring David in David let’s start with this i’ love like the Jaden Daniel story I love when quarterbacks in particular kind of like emerge in their final Collegiate season and become like oh this guy’s damn good he he could be a top five pick like like what what a what

Have we missed the past few years uh what clicked for him this year um what do you make of his story at LSU you know his rise to Heisman Trophy winner and now he’s like in the conversation as maybe the second third overall pick in this draft Yeah I think for college football

Folks he didn’t necessarily come out of nowhere he he popped on when he was a freshman um at Arizona State huge playmaker playing for current ESPN analyst insta rule breaker Herm Edwards uh there’s a lot of in coach there former Jets coach in there there’s

A lot of in rules that are bad uh don’t bring players and their families on campus during a pandemic might be the only good inci rule but anyway um so that’s either here nor there he burst on the scene at Arizona State and he’s this huge playmaker he just never really got

Better and so people were kind of like what’s going on here uh his his uh his um targets got worse you know he had worse people around him but when he went in the transfer portal you know he was one of the best quarterbacks on the market because people still remembered

Oh this guy can really run remained to be seen exactly what he was as a passer but but certainly was a guy that was dangerous and could make some plays for you and so he goes to LSU starts working with with Joe Sloan and their offensive

Staff uh Mike Den Brock uh in there under under Brian Kelly and if you go back and watch the Florida State game his first game as LSU it was a disaster it was like one read and if he didn’t see it he was tucking and running the game was ugly it was

Terrible but over the course of that season you watched him grow up start to really grasp that offense get a lot more confidence in his receivers around him playing with Kon booty playing with mid Le neighbors Brian Thomas some really good players around him start to grasp

That offense gained some trust in his receivers by the end of the season he was a totally different player he probably grew up more from the start of the 23 season to the end of the 23 season as much as just about anybody in the country so he came into this year

And you know there’s all these High Hopes on him they get popped by Florida state in the rematch they lose a couple games early LSU had some national championship hype to start the season they go off the radar but he kepts putting up these keeps putting up these

Numbers and you saw him continue of that growth continue to get better develop as a passer he got a lot more accurate he understood when to use his legs and uh and and uh you know when to use them to extend plays versus making plays which I

Think a lot of guys in the college game don’t really grasp but the development that he made from the time he got to LSU to now the time that he’s left you know really made him into a a a viable NFL prospect and I

I think he’s a wild card in ter terms of the next next step I could see it going a number of ways you know was the was he the product of a really good offensive system and a lot of really good talent around him there’s certainly that certainly helps but his accuracy his

Decision making from that guy late in his career Arizona State and early in his career at LSU to the guy that we watched you know win the Heisman Trophy over the back half of the 2023 season not the same player so I’m really intrigued by him he’s probably the most

Interesting NFL prospect out of the quarterback group for me why is that like why would you I guess use that description like the most interesting especially when you compare him to let’s do it Cale Williams Drake May and JJ McCarthy who are also in discussion for

The top 10 in terms of draft picks I think because kind of kind of similar to Joe burrow in some ways like he has some bad tape out there you know I think you’d have to look early in LSU you’d have to look early in Arizona or you

Know at any point late in Arizona State tenure where it’s like this guy’s not an NFL player but then you look late in the season he’s dropping these balls in Crazy spots he’s out running everybody um you know if you use him in the right way I think for me what makes

Him interesting is a huge range of outcomes like if he walked in there and he’s you know one of the 10 best quarterbacks you know in the NFL next year I can’t say that it would like knock my socks off and if he came out

There and it looks like this you know he starts four games next year and this guy is not an NFL quarterback I can’t say that would shock me either I think he has by far the widest range of outcomes um for me from this group of NF of you

Know these top tier quarterbacks his top five quarterbacks he had more touchdown passes this year for LSU than he did over three seasons at Arizona State like I’m just curious like the these transfer porter porter porter porter porter rules is is like you know these quarterbacks go from Team to team and

They find success elsewhere because there’s other examples in this draft class of that too like yeah how is that viewed at the college level and then I don’t know like how should we view it at the the Collegiate level like like his story is different than JJ McCarthy’s

All three years at Michigan it’s different than Drake Mae just stayed at North Carolina like Caleb Williams there’s some similarity there but Caleb Williams left after one year at Oklahoma like how would you evaluate that like for someone who who followed SEC football so closely every player’s story and their reasons

For going in the portal and what they’re looking for is different right JJ McCarthy you know I think they they asked him to do a lot of the same things as and as Andrew Luck obviously not comparing the two but like he had a pretty straightforward college career

Caleb Liams is sort of interesting and that he left Oklahoma to go to the same thing that he was used to with Lincoln Riley at USC didn’t have to learn a new offense didn’t have to learn a new coaching staff just sort of like hey guys get on my back follow

Me the offenses that they were asking jayen Daniels to run at Arizona State which was kind of a mixture of much stuff some NFL Concepts in there some college Concepts it was a little messy to Mike Den Brock’s system you know at at you know that he had brought over

From Notre Dame I mean it was very very different as was the talent around him so you know you you knew that this guy had a lot of potential and I think that there was a lot of Hope for him when he left there was on a state of like that

Was kind of a messy staff you know they they were better than people thought it wasn’t the disaster immediately that a lot of people in college expected um you know I still go back to Herm Edwards you know debut press conference if you haven’t watched that video you should it’s very entertaining

But people were like this is going to be a nightmare it didn’t go as badly as people thought it ended about as badly as people thought but he went to a much better situation they win the SEC West he beats Bama that was one of the Breakthrough moments for

Him in year one was just making a ton of plays against a really good Alabama defense to win the SEC West um but I think as you’ve seen I think some of those some of the hits are are going viral among the draft Twitter folks but

The dude is a little reckless not with the ball but with his body and you know he got banged up a little bit he stayed healthier this year than he did uh you know in previous years but he’s not afraid to take a hit which I think can

Earn you some respect in your locker room but I think the coaches would rather have you get down I think you’ll have to probably learn that in the pros that hey you took a ton of huge hits in college and the guys only hit harder and

They’re bigger in the NFL so that’ll be there but you know the portal I think it’s it went from being a a small part of the game to an integral part of roster building that I don’t think players are looked at very differently for going in the port I

Think you just have to look at every guy’s situation where’ you come from why’d you go in there and what happened after and every you know it’s a bit like a snowflake right every every situation is unique I had a few of the things you

Just said there like in my notes like he over Alabama and beating Bryce young who was eventually the the first overall pick like what is that kind of is it someone who covers the FC like what does that like mean when another team beats Alabama or I know

Georgia is different too now but like like how much weight does that carry you think when teams see that when NFL teams start to look at that tape I think a decent amount I think it was more impressive to me Brian Kelly walks in there in year

One they lose an All-American at their offens at their defensive tackle position in Mason Smith like a quarter into the season you’re rebooting at LSU after sort of the the end of the Coach O era you go in there and you win the SEC West in year one it wasn’t so

Much just beating Alabama it’s beating Alabama with the SEC West on the line like win or take all basically that I think is what really means something that you can carry a team and I think he really did carry them to an SEC West Title in year one under a new coaching

Staff you go in there and LSU was a big wild card going to 2023 because they they had won you know six or seven games under coacho but people knew that team was more talented nobody’s really sure what to expect um so for them to come in

And win the West I think spoke to all the elements of the team and overcoming that loss of Mason Smith and on all of that so it meant something but I think in that particular instance it wasn’t just that they beat Bama it’s that Bama was playing for everything and LSU

Denied them that and that is um that is pretty impressive you don’t see that happen very often and then you mention like some of the hits that he’s taken like I’ve seen some of those they are it’s not great not good it’s not good

Like he gets hit it looks like I I felt hurt watching those to see him going around like that and uh like I I had this thought like if you’re concerned about like JJ McCarthy’s frame like size and frame like if you’re telling JJ McCarthy to go gain weight like if you

Look at jayen Daniels well you should eat some pasta and some steak more too like I I get that sense too like I don’t know like he’s so good as a runner How concerned are you about his frame when you see some of those hits

You know at the next level I know I’m ask asking you to kind of repeat a few things but just in contrast with McCarthy it seems like concern for rardy seems like it would be a concern for Jaden Daniels as well well I have to go look at the numbers sometimes the pads

Can deceive you but I feel pretty confident that he gained some weight from early in his career to Arizona State until now even um but some some of those runs that he had this year you know I think what I want to say against

Uh maybe it was Old Miss I forget who it was he had like a 77 yard run where he just like wasn’t touched uh maybe that was Bama this year I can’t recall but um that ability is pretty special a game-breaking runner ability and we saw

More of that I think this year um than even we did you know in his first year where he was maybe running it a little too much in situations he probably shouldn’t but as he grew as a passer and teams recognized oh like this is a problem um you know those those running

Lanes opened up a little bit for him but I think when you are have that ability to to to make those runs that that can break open a game I think once you get to the second level of the defense you’re always looking for that you’re

Not looking to move the chains I think you know you look at Pat Mahomes once he gets past the chains unless he sees wide open field like once he’s P the chains he’s getting down Daniels when he got past the chains he’s like how do I get to the end zone

Every single time and there’s a price that you pay with that I think he paid a lot of those last year and some guys learn that at the next level and some guys are RG3 and it just it happens and you know you you you um it takes a while

For some of these guys and and sometimes they get it sometimes they don’t I’m not sure I don’t think he has you know a bullheadedness to him that he’s just always going to take these hits when he doesn’t have the frame of a Josh Allen but you know we’ll see I think some

Times you say that and you know what you’re supposed to do but then the game goes and you’re live and you’re like no I’m taking this to the house and yeah and then they’re taking you to the sideline in the injury T so we’ll see

And his credit he got up he played yeah he he’s he looks tough he plays tough I mean yeah I don’t think anybody will ever question Jan Daniel’s toughness for sure standing in the pocket taking hits as well and delivering the ball yeah he did that a lot more this year than we

Had seen him at any point in his career especially for a guy that that we’ seen play a lot of football before this season yeah to me that’s a huge positive um another one like if I’m looking at his tape and going through certain numbers he was an awesome Elite deep

Ball passer in 2023 just explosive he’s got touch there um I’m sure some some critics will say he had some special weapons again he might have a teammate who’s drafted in the top six or seven picks you know with him but what do you make of that success like ability like

You said to stand in the pocket and deliver those deep balls with accuracy touch in stride and really take that LSU offense to another level like what do you make of all that success down the field I think it’s two things I think one it’s growing up and understanding a

Lot of the offense that he was in I think it’s just doing work getting better at his accuracy trusting those guys hey you know if he’s got a step he’s open and I’m going to put it in there and I think you didn’t see that a

Lot you didn’t see it a ton at Arizona State you didn’t see it a ton early on in year one at LSU the last year I mean he was a new player uh he I iess said I I think he just he progressed and improved probably more over the last two

Seasons especially considering how much he had played we don’t see a ton of that in college after a couple years you kind of are who you are some guys make a little bit of a leap but to to go into a different Stratosphere we don’t see that

Very often but we did from him and it really is crazy I I think for people you know if you go watch the film from him over the last six weeks of this year and you go back and watch that Florida State game to start 2023 I think people’s heads would

Explode it’s just not even the same guy what do you make of his decision not to to take part in the Senior Bowl because correct me if I’m wrong he was invited right I thought he was on one of the rosters and then you know by the end of

It he didn’t attend what do you make of all that well I think again it’s it’s sort of an individual decision some of these you know you never really know they they probably have their reasons and they’re rarely going to hear the real reasons you know maybe he was you know banged up

A little bit or didn’t feel comfortable or trying to heal from some of the hits that he took this year you know know he’s playing through a bunch of stuff and and they’re always really dodgy about that but you didn’t have to watch much else you to know like you know like

A lot of people he wasn’t fully healthy at the end of the year and you know there might have been an element of that I don’t really know I can’t I don’t have a ton of insight into that particular decision um but I think that stuff I I think especially for

Quarterbacks it’s a little overrated I think for lineman watching them in one-on-ones against other Elite guys can be really telling but the quarterbacks I mean listen your film is your film and I don’t know how much that’s going to change at the Senior Bowl maybe you

Learn a little bit about how much a guy can process or how much he can draw back or all these you know little things it’ll be different in the NFL versus college but you know I think for him you know he’s got so much film out there

That I don’t know how much the Senior Bowl may have mattered yeah good or bad and I’m guessing those interviews that you get down in Mobile I he’s gonna go through a bunch of them not only in the Anapolis the combine but there’s going to be all sorts of private workouts all

Sorts of dinners with coaching staffs and GMS out there you know this this draft process is uh can be extremely Lo elongated and like you said he’s got five years worth of film it’s a lot of tape to get through lots of tape so go

Ahead go ahead no I was gonna say yeah I think that he’s unique in that way and and I do think the one thing that really does work for him even though he’s had a very unique college career and has had a variety of outcomes I am a believer in that the

Biggest correlation in success from college NFL his career starts the dude has seen a lot of football he’s seen a lot of fronts he’s seen a lot of secondaries played in a lot of different system well say a lot of different system he’s played two systems but

You’ve seen a lot of defenses played in the Pack 12 played in the SEC you’re going to see a lot of different players a lot of different systems and I think playing that much football continuing to grow probably does um set a a a favorable trend line

For his future in the NFL would you be surprised if he’s the second overall pick yeah because I’m not sure he has the upside or the um like prototypical uh you know what you want of Caleb and Drake like I I’m not all in on either of

Those guys like oh these are guaranteed like franchise guys I think there’s only been a handful of those guys and I thought Bryce young was that guy last year we’ll see time will tell he did go to a terrible situation but we’ll see but ultimately if you’re gonna spend

A pick that high you’d want to go to be a prototype Drake and Caleb are those prototypes Jaden is not so you know he didn’t do he didn’t have the same type of tape that Bryce young had to make him the number one pick but we we’ll see I

Would be very very surprised last one for you if maybe I just have what Ryan poles has said in the past where he’s going to the combine to figure out the person I think that was well with the first pick obviously everyone’s looking at kale Williams he’s trying to figure out who

Kale Williams is like what do you know about jayen Daniels in terms of leadership in tangible presence his ability to not only take over an offense but take over a team I think I would say you don’t hear from everybody oh you know this guy is

Gonna walk in and command an NFL loer room but I didn’t hear any red flags um you know from the Arizona State side of things or the um you know the LSU side of things you know the video of um the uh the locker room after Arizona State

When he left that’s like the only real negative and and some of that’s probably sour grapes um I think seeing how things played out in the years after and knowing the situation that he left I don’t think you can really blame him necessarily but there’s always going to

Be H feelings when you have a starting quarterback leave that’s been the only thing that that I think might raise some eyebrows but I don’t think it’s necessarily a negative on him um but um I think you don’t hear a lot of red flags but you

Don’t hear like you know this guy is you know the quintessential Field General you know all the guys in line I think he he did what was asked of him um and and didn’t raise any concerns in terms of his leadership or intangibles and you

Didn’t hear a lot of like ah you know I don’t know about that guy which you do hear a lot you know you talk to people around college sports certainly you hear whispers about guys you didn’t hear any of that with Jaden yeah yeah so like there’s this like growing buzz like

He could be like I I I feel like his his draft stock has improved considerably since like the end of the season and the more the pundit or what have you you know dig into the film you know there’s more highlights showing up on Twitter and whatnot like are are you surprised by

That like like that he’s in conversation for the second pick is there a sense of surprised that he is going to be a top five pick by the end of the day no I mean production talks I I think he doesn’t have a lot of obvious negatives from the NFL perspective and

So when you have the kind of production that he did both as a passer and a runner you have the growth you win the Heisman you do everything that could be asked of you despite playing in a situation last year where the defense fell apart the defensive coordinat gets

Fired you didn’t see a lot of bad body language from him I can’t say I’m surprised I mean putting up those numbers in the SEC even though the sec’s identity has changed in some ways is always going to going to uh to to gain some attention so I can’t say I’m super

Surprised cool well David thanks as always we always love having you on the show I feel like this is like your third or fourth visit with us I think so that’s good yeah yeah we have to start sending you checks right Kent something like that but but thank you as always um

Read David stuff on the athletic follow him on X Twitter whatever you want to call it David ubin that’s ubbe thanks as always my friend thank you guys appreciate it all right that wraps up this episode it was a long one um if you watched on YouTube you saw my

My uniform change um it it’s just I want to give a special thanks to Austin brandan and David just thank you for your Insight I hope you enjoyed that episode it’s going to be interesting to see what the Bears do they have the first pick the ninth pick the Draft

Starts with them I’m sure we’ll have a lot more coverage you know we’ll have a lot more coverage the following weeks we’ll be down in Indianapolis but take this one with you um the Insight here I think will will be a little bit Evergreen it will go into the draft itself um again

Special thanks to Austin Brandon and David but that’ll do it for this episode um follow us on Twitter Adam Johns we have our Hogan Johns account at Hogan Johns um go to Hogan johns.com for our merchandise from obvious shirts hit that subscribe button YouTube you know the

Deal um go to C hog stuff and algo.com we got some fantastic stuff coming from Indianapolis next week on the athletic.com but that’s it thank you for always thank you as always for listening and we’ll be back next week see you