The VSGA Tournaments Department covers Free Relief & Penalty Relief Rules
All right good evening everyone uh my name is Kent hullar I’m a assistant director of championships and golf operations for the vsga um and uh assisting me is Tim Murphy he’s our manager of championships and golf operations uh we had a great uh webinar at noon today with some awesome
Questions um if you were tuned in last week um I will say that we’ve got maybe close to twice the number of slides and material to go over but it’s going to be uh pretty solid um with relief procedures uh penalty relief and uh hopefully some things that you all can
Definitely take out of this so if I move a little quickly uh don’t be discouraged answer or throw some questions out in the the Q&A section Tim’s going to monitor that for us we’re going to hit a number of question slides where we’ll review some things if you have something
To to ask we will also be uh hanging around for five or 10 minutes after the presentation to help answer any questions that we didn’t get to or we’ll we’ll shoot an email out to you uh tomorrow sometime so let’s go ahead and uh get started this is the uh the
Different topics that we’re going to talk about we’re going to start out with uh some free relief so quickly going down to the pictures kind of some real life scenarios here some areas that you will probably be encountering either already this season um or will eventually at at
Some point uh the picture on the left is a burrowing animal hole and uh this abnormal course condition actually also includes the track that the animal makes into the hole uh next picture is a Committee Member uh painting some ground owner repair with a white line you may
Or may not always see the white line it might just be a maybe a tire rut that’s there maybe it’s a a pile of leaves and sticks and brush that is piled for removal the superintendent uh plans to get out of there within the the next day or so immovable obstructions I think
We’ve all had our ball on a cart path or been standing on the path before this could also be a sprinkler head a sprinkler control box something like that uh then the picture all the way to the right some temporary water which you know over the past month I think it’s
Rained in Richmond at least uh at least one day each week so I’m sure there’s still some some temporary water someplace out there uh but when you’re going to take nearest point of complete relief uh there’s a procedure that you you should abide by and it’s not difficult um
You’re going to estimate the point where the ball would lie um nearest to the the ball’s original spot but not near the hole it’s in the required area of the golf course so if you’re in the general area like this person is you’re going to remain in that general area and where
There’s uh no interference from the condition um from which relief is being taken so what that really means is you know the middle picture here this person where his ball lies and he’s certainly entitled to play that if he wants to if he goes to the right his heels have to
Be completely off that car path and then if he goes to the left he needs to move further away from the car path so that his area of intended swing no longer has any interference by that as well but you can see this kind of an equidistant Arc
Here he’s not going in any near the hole no matter which side of the path that he’s on so when you’re estimating this uh you definitely need to identify the club that you’re going to use to most likely make this shot the stance that you’re
Going to take the swing and the line of play so I feel like the players certainly done this in each case here and uh if I were making the ruling here I I might say they the image on the right is where he’s probably going to take his
R now the nearest point of relief isn’t always the nicest point unfortunately so this player right here is taking correct relief his uh feet are completely off the car path but unfortunately with that being the nearest it’s not the nicest and he is going to have to drop it
Within this Mulch and Bush tree area whatever you want to call it and kind of take it from there so it’s not going to be the most ideal spot sometimes you’re going to get relief uh when your ball is on in or on an object and on down here in the lefthand corner
You see if this ball lies on the immovable obstruction this drain or it could be a sprinkler sometimes uh maybe you’ve got some physical interference with the the object and I I think if you were to pan down this picture the player’s ball or stance is on the cart
Path um or maybe in the the right hand picture here temporary water that’s on the putting grain May intervene on the line of play but this would only be for the putting green there’s a few exceptions where relief would not be allowed your ball is
In the penalty area you can see this on the top right hand picture that yellow line right there is identifying the yellow Penal area uh maybe there’s an abnormal course condition that it’s out of bounds or as the uh the bottom picture here it’s clearly unreasonable play the ball
Because something other than the abnormal course condition is around or because you’re choosing a club the type of stance swing or direction of play that’s just completely unreasonable and so you can see the player here has his ball underneath this this plant this bush and he’s really stretching out his
Right leg to try to get onto the car path to maybe prove to the guys in his group um or the the rules official stand nearby that he has interference and needs relief from that uh cart path but I think if uh timai were around he would not be getting that
REM now the thing I love about the book because I’m a visual learner are these pictures here that that come right out of the book um so here’s a kind of a step-by-step procedure for both a abnormal course condition you know that ground under repair that we might see or
That imal obstruction that cart pth that we’re encountering and how we should go about uh giving our self relief from that so uh top image the player needs to re determine the nearest point of relief and figure out what that reference point is uh in this case that black dot right
There you put a t down measure one Club length left or right it cannot be any nearer the hole and then you can go back one club and so it’s nice to have that half circle shape there it’s a very large area to drop in um but you might
Not always have that as you can see with the cart path relief down here the player uh is right-handed you kind of see that with his feet the direction of play and so this could be the nearest point of relief at P2 um and then drop it within that that pie-shaped
Um if that player was left-handed maybe he’s coming to the opposite side of the C path but not always but I think that’s a good visual on how you would take relief there any early questions about the New York’s point of relief no questions have come through yet okay
Cool let’s go on to a vetted ball and something that I I think R going encounter as we’ve had these you know sometimes softer conditions even though it’s getting cold at night um um I think there could be a misconception sometimes that your ball needs to break the soil
And it needs to uh be below that the ground and have dirt on the ball in order for it to be embedded but that’s not always the case and so you can see if a series of three pictures here the top two are below the surface of the
Ground and so a player would be entitled to relief from embedded Vol there but the bottom picture you would not and so you are certainly more than welcome to Mark the ball with a t to pick it up carefully and you know put your hand down in the grass there to
See if it actually is below the surface of the ground and if it is there is a uh relief procedure in a couple slides that we’ll be able to show you the ball must be embedded in the general area you’re not going to get that embedded ball um you know in the
Penalty area or in a bunker even though we call it you know a fried egg lie um but if the ball’s embedded on the putting green which I think we can probably see in the bottom picture definitely need to Mark the Spot lift it clean the ball repair the damage caused
By the ball’s impact and then replace the ball in its original spot but if the balls in the general area this is the relief procedure which is almost the same as what we just took with the ground under repair the reference point here is going to be
Right behind the ball put a t there you measure your one Club link which if we haven’t gone over in the in last week’s presentation or if you aren’t aware it is the longest Club in your bag it is most likely a driver but it’s definitely not going to be the
Long uh but you’re measuring left to right no near the hole coming on back uh creating as much as that half circle as you can and then uh it must drop in the relief area and your ball must come to rest there as well that was pretty quick for embedded
Ball but maybe that’s just a good refresher for people are there any questions no questions on embedded ball relief okay all right more free relief um now we’re going to be moving an interfering objects uh but really sometimes it’s nothing more than a loose imped and you
Might be wondering what is that it’s really almost anything that’s natural uh you know you think about your sticks the leaves that have blown from the trees sadly some dead animals are the waste uh or the clumps of compacted soil which does include the irration plug so as you
Know your clubs or the courses you’re going to play over the next two or three months start making their aerification schedule uh these are some things that you could encounter and I know you’re seeing the the uh Spider Web over there and believe it or not down here on the
Fourth B spider webs are loose impediments even though they’re attached to another object um you know various other things that maybe we’re encountering right now uh sand and loose soil are not loose impediments you might be thinking of the Rory maoy situation five or six or seven
Years ago whatever it was now where he had a little brain fart and he thought the sand and loose soil that he was wiping away was on the green which would have been cool but he was actually wiping it off from The Fringe and so he
Did get penalized for that uh due Frost and water also not loose impediments uh but in the event that maybe some areas of the state have encountered snow or n have natural ice out there um they could be either loose impediments or the player could treat them as temporary
Water uh but without penalty the player can definitely remove loose impediments anywhere on or off the course may do so in various ways you know I could get Tim to help me move it with his towel or his hat and we can sit there and pick them
Up like uh like this player is doing uh we could probably try to scoop them out of the way with our putter um but usually try to choose the quickest and most effective method um if a player’s removal loose impediment does cause the ball to move
Uh the ball must be replaced on its original spot and if you don’t know it you can estimate it um I would think that potentially you would know uh the spot but in the event that something happens maybe you can just estimate get it back there um if the move ball has
Been at rest anywhere except on the putting grain and in the te area but if you’re going to try to be careful like this guy here and you know move that rock or some of those uh pine needles or the pine cone uh if the ball does move
You are going to get penalized one stroke so I would say just be as careful as possible I remember in uh the US Junior um three or four years ago was referee in a match and a player in his caddy were right down looking at the ball probably as close or closer than
This player is and really nitpicking some of these uh pine needles out of there and his ball oscillated which it never changed position and he looked at me and I said he was fine and at that point I think he got a little nervous and just backed away from the ball and
Decided just to give it a good good whack because he had to hit it through a pine C any questions about any of that going back toed ball we had one come in um just related to the ability to clean a ball that’s been embedded uh
If you could maybe shed some light on when that would be allowed versus not yeah absolutely I I may not I may not go all the way back to the slide but yes you can certainly lift and clean the ball when you’re taking relief from eded
Ball time you know that I think a lot of people would come into a situation where they would not have to clean it is Tim if my ball interferes with yours and I just need to Market pick it up with two fingers allow you to play and then
Proceed to put my ball back great thanks Ken um another one that came through um if taking relief in the general area can that be from the rough to the Fairway yeah absolutely I think that’s a a good question uh the rules really don’t differentiate uh between rough and
Farway so all of that is uh general area the other areas just to quickly touch on them the teen area of the hole being played so we’re on hole number five that only that teen area is um a defined area bunkers penalty areas uh the putting
Green of the whole we plane so only number five we’ve got rules to cover pole number seven and eight and nine um and then the rest of it is general area all righty I think that’s all we have for questions on that section to some movable obstruction so
We just talked about some natural objects now we talk about uh more artificial objects and any of these can be moved with reasonable effort without damaging the obstruction or the course uh so quickly looking over here at this rake um you know as long as we can move
That I don’t know why wouldn’t I mean it looks like it’s on a little bit of a slope there and that ball might move but we’ll talk about in a little bit um integral part of the for so an integral object like uh this out of bound stake
Right here so this boundary object immovable obstructions like this cart path we did have a question in the last session about the status of these penalty area stakes and those are movable obstructions those do not have the same status as the out of- bound St Stakes which are fixed so uh you can
Move the penalty area Stakes this person at the top right here is moving that ball washer uh we can move the rake like we talked about before um it can really do so in in any way so if this guy needed a little bit of a hand to move that ball washer it
Wouldn’t be a problem we have another picture from the book it’s trying to uh indicate that player’s ball is up against this rake player moves the rake the ball moves down that slope what do we need to do well there’s not going to be any penalty
For that so you know this object you got to think it’s artificial is really not supposed to be there like the natural objects are so um we’re not going to give you any sort of penalty for that the ball must be replaced on its original spot and if you didn’t quite
Catch where it was uh touching the course when this rake was moved then you can just uh estimate as close as possible um now relief when the ball is in or on the movable obstruction anywhere on the course except on the putting green in this case this looks
Like it’s a towel another picture from the book as we saw back here that ball is touching the course it has a hoe the ball is not touching the course here so we need to give it that hood we need to keep the Integrity of dropping the ball
And the randomness of that drop so since this ball was not touching the course we are going to drop it in the general area we’re going to still proceed under our uh relief area here this reference point is made from estimating the spot from right under the
Ball and we are going to drop it within that one Club length area canot be any near the hole and it’s a pretty generous area for what this object is now the only time we’re going to take a similar situation and kind of get a better situation out of it is if we’re
On that specially prepared area like the putting green in this case this player is not going to drop the ball like the person did before in the general area uh since we’re on the putting green we’re going to treat it a little bit differently we’re going to estimate the
Spot underneath that towel and we’re going to go ahead and place the ball questions about movable obstructions no questions there okay to some penalty earrings all right so I won’t talk a lot about you know how rules used to be before 2019 uh but when talking about what a
Penalty area area is I think it’s pretty obvious what a majority of them are they are filled with water a lake a sea of Hond a surface drainage ditch but a committee like you can see up here in the top picture is uh determining that that wooded area or an area of high
Grass is just constantly getting balls into it so in order to speed up play and keep things moving they’re going to paint that as penalty here a lot of things in the penalty area virtually everything that you can do in the general area so there’s really no special
Rules limiting how a player may play in a pal areia you can already see that this person is picking up a Luci P it’s okay to move those loose impediments to take a practice swing like maybe this player did it’s okay to ground your club or even touch water if
Your ball is near that pawn all aware that we have two colors of penalty areas we have yellow we have red and if you play in a lot of bsga competitions I would say a majority of the penalty areas that we paint we try to be uh painting red to maybe give you
A few more options and so we’re going to talk about two options that are the same in yellow and in red and then we’re going to talk about a third option that only applies to Red so stroking distance for those that are a little confused of what that is it’s where you
Previously made a stroke so it could be from the Teen area here where you’re allowed to come anywhere in the defined teen area and you are able to Tee It uh maybe it was back in the Fairway or the bunker maybe you bladed a bunker shot
And need to come stru in distance in this case we’re dropping the ball and I think in a more rare situation where the previous stroke was made from the putting green you would place it but uh that ever happens definitely send us an email on that I think we would love to
Hear the story all right back on the laundry this is going to be a tad different than what a lot of us are used to really going to stress uh dropping it on the line so what it is is I’m going to pick my poison I’m going to pick my my bread
Butter shot like this guy here maybe it’s 120 yards from me I’m going to connect the dots from the point where the ball last cross the edge of the penalty area and I’m going to draw an imaginary line connect ing that to the flag stick and come back until either I
Find a flat area or I find that yardage that I’m good with whatever your decision is you have to make sure that you’re dropping that ball on the line not drop it off the line to the left to the right that’s not going to determine this reference point and then that’s not
Going to determine this relief area so really want to stress Stacks I don’t want to get y’all a two-stroke penalty for playing from a wrong place to jump the gun a little bit but just want to reiterate the spot on the line where the ball first touches the ground
Wind drop that creates the relief area and it’s one Club length from there and you can see we thought they there were being generous before with a half circle shape but they’re really being generous now and allowing that ball to even jump forward as long as it not exceeded that one
Cl all right so it just can’t be any nearer the hole than this spot where it last crossed the edge of the penalty area must be in the same area of the course uh so he’s got to remain in the general area he’s not going to draw a
Line back here and then drop it in a bunker that third option that’s only available under the red penalty area he’s going to estimate the spot where it last crossed the edge of the penalty area then he’s going to measure two club links he’s got his driver in his hand
He’s coming no near the hole might be a little difficult to determine since uh we don’t really know the direction of play and he’s going to drop it anywhere within this shaded area so he doesn’t necessarily have to come out to the the edge of the two club links maybe where
He’s standing it looks like a flatter area maybe it’s got some better grass so just you’re entitled to the entire area here you don’t necessarily have to maximize it all here’s a book from or sorry a picture from the book again kind of recapping our three options so she’s
Back here on the te she hits a little Wayward shot it crosses the penalty area at X here she can either come back to where she previously hit in the teen area she can find that point and come back in line with the flag as far as she
Wants to go again for whatever reason she wants to continue back back here off the screen or she should can go with the lateral uh penalty area relief and measure the two Clum Lings and you know in my opinion this might be the best option here because it looks like it’s
Getting around in the Fairway and it’s got a clean shot so when you’re taking those relief options just kind of think about what is the course giving you and what’s what’s going to be your best option to hit the a better shot next time any questions about penalty
Area we had a good one come through um when taking relief from a penalty area does the player’s stance have to be outside the penalty area um after taking that relief it’s a good question um actually The Stance does not it’s not the same as that um IM movable
Obstruction with the cart pad so it’s just a matter of where your ball lies as as long as your ball is outside the penalty area and still within that relief area you’re good to go um another one that we could speak to um just as as we Mark courses for events and
Championships throughout the summer um the reasons why a course might choose to Mark something yellow versus red that’s a pretty good question yeah I don’t know that we’ll go too deep into the weeds with that one but you know I think it was always thought that a red
Penalty area needed to kind of go parallel to you while you play the hole um and that’s not really the case I think we’re looking at a hole and if we can imagine a pond in front of a green and the green is slowed down I think the
Design of the whole and the architect wanted us to negotiate this penalty area so that screams yellow penalty to me we must successfully get over this pond in order to to play the ho and if we don’t maybe we have a drop zone to go to but
If that penalty are is maybe closer to the te and there’s a lot of open area a lot of Short Grass down near the green and it’s not that sloped I think we might paint it red I mean if a person trickles their ball off the te into that
Penalty area the likelihood that they ret is probably like 99% anyways I don’t know why you want to walk up to the edge of the penal are and take relief from there so hopefully that helps explaining had one more come in um which we covered in the uh in the earlier
Session as well if you’re not sure that your ball has entered the penalty area can you play a provisional ball that’s a good question let’s put that one on hold just for a little bit because I think the question might be answered towards the end of the presentation I don’t want
To jump the gun and maybe C some confusion so let’s see if the slides can help answer that I think we’re good to keep moving then okay let’s go to unplayable all right kind of an interesting thing here that the player is the only person who may decide to
Treat their balls on playable so your caddy can’t help you I mean they can but you’re ultimately are the decision maker here uh maybe it’s your fourball partner they might give some strong suggestions but it’s ultimately you uh you can determine your ball is unplayable uh anywhere on the course except a penalty
Area because we just had rules for that and there’s a there’s procedures for that so this is uh other places but we are going to have a lot of similar relief options with a few different like kind of tidbits here strok and distance I think that’s self-explanatory now that that’s just
Back to your previous shot so you can see she hit a errant shot here it’s in this group of trees or deep uh deep bushes I she wants to just just drop another one she’s like I’m just GNA hit stroke and distance um now these next two options
I’m going to say that you have to it is a must situation that you identify your golf ball because by option number one she’s just going back stroking distance but in order to determine these two Club lengths for option number three or back in line with the flag for option two we
Need to have a reference point and so we need to figure out where our golf ball is we need to use binoculars to see it in the tree or we need to you know kind of identify it within that bush all of these are under a one St
PTY all right we do have a fun maybe not so fun if you’re not playing well uh other option for a bunker so all of these options or option two and three you notice you have to stay within the bunker here option one obviously strok and distance that’s not necessarily in
The bunker option two back in mind with the flag must remain within the bunker for one stroke penalty option three two club links sadly you’re not getting that whole second Club link because of the lip of the bunker here but you get a majority of it still one stroke penalty and then for
This additional option you can come out of the bunker but this one’s going to cost you two strokes so just decide what you want to do based upon maybe you’re not a good bunker player that day or at all uh maybe you just think it’s an easier shot whatever it is you’re
Entitled to do this under unplayable ball it’s just going to cost you yet another stroke so two strokes to get it out questions there none on unplayable ball okay stroken distance relief ball lost or out of bounds provisional ball so we like it to uh the answer to that
Question all right when is a ball lost it’s not found within three minutes after the player or their caddies begin to search for it um it’s not necessarily like when timai you know a member of the committee official comes to search for it it’s when people are part of your
Side so you your caddy your partner partner’s caddy um when you all begin to look for the ball that’s when that clock’s going to start all right when there a ball out of bounds this is a good one uh picture straight from the book uh imagine that you know like there’s this this
Guillotine if you will if any part of the ball is touching the Cor it is still in bounds uh so some of these options that are in the gray area clearly out of bounds this one right here it’s kind of half in half out that’s going to be good to go uh this
One clearly inbounds and then over here on the right hand side clearly out and then you’ve got one that’s on the line so since it’s not hanging over onto the course at all it is still out of bounds but then these two are still in bounds hopefully that picture helps make a lot
Of sense that was always a a tough visual for me so if the ball is lost or out of bounds a player must and now you see it’s underlined there’s some other words in the rule book that are like should and those are more of a suggestion word
But a must is a a definite you have to do this so if your ball is lost or out of bounds the player must take stroke and distance relief which we just went over you know with penalty air area and unplayable so these options here should
Not be confusing to you it is still one stroke penalty you could be playing the original ball or another ball uh from wherever that previous stroke was made now this one right here this has to be adopted by your golf course uh the competition you’re playing in maybe it’s
Even like the group that you’re playing with that day it’s a model local rule um it’s going to provide a quicker option than maybe playing a a provisional so let’s try to break it down it is going to cost you two strokes uh imagine that
This hole right here has a lot of open area on either side of it maybe it’s other golf Poes but it’s not out of bounds so this player has hit an errand shot over here near the trees it’s uh she’s estimating where this spot is going to be she is going to
Measure her two Club lengths to the left here and that’s the furthest Edge from her relief area then she’s going to come out to the edge of the Fairway uh which is a fairway height um I think is how the model local rule reads and so that’s her other reference point and measure
Two club links and now she gets this entire shaded area however far back she wants to go to take believe instead of hitting that provisional ball now you can’t be bouncing back and forth and hitting provisional ball sometimes and this model local rule other times it needs to be something that you’re
Adopting for the entire competition um over here on this right hand picture uh the out of bounds is kind of dictating how far this player uh relief area can be over here uh but then finding the edge of the Fairway with the two club links and then measuring that so he
Clear clearly has a little bit of a smaller Pi shape um whereas she had kind of a larger one just based upon how the whole was designed questions about that no questions on that section okay our last section here is about provision so let’s see we can take our
Time and and answer these what is a provision it’s another ball play in case the ball just played by the player might be out of bounds or lost outside a penalty here so that’s kind of a key piece of information there that we’re going to dive into in just a second you
Can play a provisional ball in any of these situations when your original ball went towards an out of bounds or might be out of bounds so maybe maybe it got hung up someplace um when your original ball went somewhere on the course outside a penalty area where you don’t think you’ll find it
So you know there’s a pond over there you can see it but it’s surrounded by trees in High Grass that’s an awesome time to hit a provisional you don’t know if that ball is in the water you don’t know if it’s hung up in the High Grass
You don’t know if it hit a tree and bounce down or when your original ball might have come into a penalty area but it also might be somewhere that you can’t find it outside the penalty area I like the same thing that I I just suggested
Um so in my last example the time that you would not be able to hit a provisional ball is if you know there’s a pond over there but there’s nothing but short grass is Fairway height all the way down to the pond and your ball has a very likely opportunity to
Continue to roll and balance and enter that penalty area that’ be an instance where you’re not allowed to so announcing the play of a provisional you don’t necessarily have to say what this player is saying and and announce that I’m playing under rule 18.3 but you certainly can uh but you
Have to announce that you’re going to play a provisional in some obvious way and uh you know saying that you’re going to reload or you’re going to play another those are options that are probably not going to uh be okay under the rules um as you can see playing
Another ball playing again you need to try to use the word provisional or otherwise clearly indicate that this is what you’re doing that you’re just not you know proceeding under stroke in distance okay so you played the provisional you’re trying to figure out where the original is uh the player’s
Allowed to search for the allowed to play the provisional all the way up to where the estimated spot where the player’s original ball is likely to be so this player thinks he connected pretty good it’s out here like 250 yards but it’s in this group of trees or high
Grass and he’s like you know what I’m gonna play a provisional just in case and of course provisional goes off the te just like any other provisional would right down the middle of the Fairway but he doesn’t catch it as good and it’s about 200 yards so he could step up to
To point a here and try to rip a three-wood down here but maybe he tops it and it doesn’t quite get to this shaded area he’s still short of where the original original ball is estimated to be so he could that ball again and then make it onto the
Green but the minute he was at Point a and maybe advances the ball to point B he can no longer come up to point B and hit that ball and expect to come back and and find the original that’s not going to be cool by him playing from
Anywhere in this shaded area from a point that’s closer to the hole than where the original ball is likely to be he has made an action something has happened to cause that ball to now be lost and out of play it could have been the three minute search it could have
Been playing from closer to the hole um and those these are situations where the provision ball must be aband so if the player finds the original ball in the course within the 3 minute provisional ball has to be picked up player may play the original ball and proceed under the
Rules uh the rules being that maybe he found that and he wants to proceed under unplayable ball our option two here the player finds the ball in or on or it’s known or virtually certain that the ball is in a penalty area so in my example before where there’s a bunch of Short
Grass leading down a hill towards a a pond my ball has a great likelihood I am virtually certain that the ball’s in a penalty area we can no longer play the provisional we can’t even play one actually we have to proceed proceed under the penalty here hopefully that’s not too confusing
But hopefully I also answer that question previously questions about provisional ball um one just came through if you played a provisional but find your ball and it is unplayable how do you proceed okay so you found your ball and you want to proceed under option two or three the
Back on the line or uh the the lad so you found your original and you had just go from there that’s your reference point so the provisional uh doesn’t apply anym you have to pick that up but if you had hit that provisional and you did not find the original well now you
Can go and proceed with the provision because that’s what it’s there for to help speed up play and basically proceed it under stroke and distance Ken um one more for provisional ball related what if the player rushes ahead to play their provisional ball in order to make it the ball in play but
Someone finds the original ball after they hit that provisional okay so you know I gave this example last time and I’m not sure how many people remember the the day of Phil Mickelson and the guy that I’m not remembering hitting a ball into a ravine or both their balls
Into a Ravine and uh I think they each played provisional balls they really didn’t want the uh The Spectators or maybe it was volunteer try to find that ball so if they ran up there and played their provision or ball from a spot closer to the hole the than where the
Original was likely to be then that original would have been out of play so they certainly could have run up there as fast as they could uh but I believe in that example the volunteer found both those balls they had to identify them at that time and then proceed from
There else that we can answer I think that’s that covers that for provisionals okay well actually that was our our last section believe it or not we kind of Bree through there um give you a heads up on next week’s uh schedule finding and identifying a ball
Playing the course as you find it playing the ball as it lies ball in motion deflected so I think a lot of good premises there of what uh what the game of golf wants you to do what the rules do um take offl that’s awesome Tim and I
Were going to hang out answer a few more questions for the next 10 or 15 minutes I definitely appreciate you all uh being a part of this and this is one related to match versus stroke play and how any of these rules might differ um in those styles of play did you say
Tim yeah um just if there’s any variations for the rules we covered um in match play versus stroke play and how oh yeah um me just do a quick review no I don’t think that there is any variation from any of these I think it just really comes down to uh making sure
That your opponent is not breaching any of these rules uh and trying to take advantage of a situation but everything that we’ve covered here should apply um the only one that I can think of that would have any difference is someone just being able to recall a
Shot um another one related to the provisional section if you find your original ball and you have decide that is unplayable um do you go back and hit a ball with stroke and distance and not use that provisional ball that’s that’s correct yeah
Um if yeah well no no no I I think I’m misunderstanding the question so you you find your original ball uh but you decided that it’s unplayable do you go back and you a ball with stroke in distance and not use a ball um no no you can still use the
Provisional ball because anytime that you have the ball in your hand you would be able to substitute that ball anyways I think think um to proceed under option two or three you just have to have found that original you need that reference um and then staying on that
Same track of provisionals as well if somebody does find your ball within three minutes and you decide to ignore that information play your provisional ball anyway would that be considered a wrong ball penalty and what would be the result of that happening no I don’t think that’s going
To be a wrong ball I I mean you’ve but you’re still you’re underneath the unplayable so it’s still an option to play stroke and distance I think I think by the way to look at it like this is if your ball is found outside the three minutes you are
Forced to go stroken Distance by fting your ball under three minutes all three options on an unplayable are still alive rolling in now see if I can help yeah I’m just trying to sort through these questions worries see uh if your ball is on the cart path you must take bring relief
From the point that is closest to the original ball not closest to the cart path correct uh you know let me try to see if I can explain this your ball is on the cart path and it is more favoring the right edge of the path um maybe that’s
Your nearest point of relief and if you’re going to choose to take relief you need to take complete relief but it is not required uh it is free like you said but you can certainly still play uh the original ball sitting there so it is whatever your the nearest point of
Relief is from the original um on an out of on a ball that is determined to be out of bounds Mark the Spot and play from the from next where it lasts cross the OB line no that is incorrect that uh playing from where it last cross the edge of the penalty area
Only applies to penalty areas it does not apply to Out of Bounds um you’re going stroke in distance for out of bounds unless that model local rule is um is being adopted where in that case your your reference or I’m sorry your relief area is a pretty large shaded
Area you do get to come all the way out to the edge of the Fairway with that um but I’m not you’re not necessarily just going up to where it last cross the edge of the out of balance and dropping it from there not sure about a rules interpretation
You should play provisional and then decide Ed Under the rules and at CR would you play both balls and P out uh I think that’s kind of a mix of two things here um think you should always play provisional if you think your ball could
Be lost outside of a penalty area or out of bounds but if while playing a hole you think that you should be getting relief from a tire rut that is not marked then you would announce that to the people in your group uh also to the committee and
You would play out the hole with both balls you know announcing uh before you play which ball you want to count maybe you really think you should get Rel with volume two local yeah why don’t you sit there look at that ball it rolls into the rof can’t
Find it even though it should be right there always happens like that have to go back and get from the place of the previous shot with the stroke penalty you can’t just drop it near where you estimated have stroke that is correct the way that you
Kind of describe it but I think here on the screen could also help explain that because it doesn’t necessarily need to be from the T like in the left picture it could be out in the Fairway like the right picture where your ball should be right here but or right here but it’s
Not so you’re going to estimate where it is and hopefully you have both sides but maybe you don’t and find the edge of the Fairway and two club links and drop it anywhere within the Shaded area I think this one you might have already answered Kent but if someone
Else finds your ball within three minutes and you’ve already played your provisional ball can you choose which ball to play the ball’s already been found within 3 minutes and you have to abandon the position hopefully that helps answer this other question that if someone does find your original ball within those
Three minutes and it is playable but you decide to just keep playing the provisional is it a wrong ball penalty what would happen uh yeah I mean if someone finds your original ball you are required to go over there and identify um and if you decide to keep playing with your
Provisional you have now hit a wrong ball because that provisional is no longer in play Tim I think we’re g to wrap it up here um if there’s any other questions or people that are still on here and you’re you know just trying to figure out how
To phrase your question or maybe you’re still confused a little bit about something feel free to uh send us an email and we will do our best to get to that as soon as possible we probably try to send you uh some graphics if we need
To or a link to um the actual wording of the rule so hopefully uh we can help answer any questions that way but we definitely appreciate you all being a part of this and if next week is something that you’re interested in uh feel free to tune in we will also be
Doing two sessions then at 12 and at 6 thanks again really appreciate it thank you everybody
