Are the Rockets still not embracing Alperen Şengün? w/ Forrest Walker

Salman Ali (@SalmanAliNBA) and Forrest Walker (@DUNOTS) discuss:

-Rockets bench Alperen Şengün in crunch time
-Houston’s reluctance to embrace Sengun as the franchise player
-The continued pushback to this reality
-Why is Houston still feverishly pursuing centers at the deadline?
-What should they aim to achieve at the trade deadline?
-Who are some realistic targets?
-Should Houston trade Brooklyn’s 2024 1st rounder?

All that and more.

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What’s up guys L podcast my name is s man at somon NBA on Twitter here joined by Forest Walker do nots on Twitter how you doing man hey I’m glad to be back I love it here it’s fun here it is fun here real quick if you guys enjoy the

Content that we put out on this channel please go ahead and subscribe and hit that like button because it really does help the channel grow and encourages to put more content out for you guys uh hit the notification Bell to know when we drop new videos uh whether that’s a

Podcast or a clip from the show all the all that above helps back to the show so we are going to do more of a tread deadline preview again today but first I want to talk about uh some po polarizing tweets I sent out yesterday all right let’s yeah let’s do it okay

This is probably the most blowback uh I’ve had on a tweet in years uh I think since the last time I suggested uh the rockets need to trade Christian Wood uh and focus on making shenon their franchise player that got a lot of heat the time I suggested they should trade

The pick that ended up being Jabari Smith uh for Ben Simmons that guy a lot of heat that aged terribly by the way yeah you’re you’re you’re like one for one for two so far well I’ll land the plane here I also got a lot of heat I suggested that Jaylen green didn’t

Strike me as someone who would ever be good enough to be a lead ball H Handler so two for three well two for three right so I’m just probably I’m going to go ahead and read these tweets out so you guys know what I’m talking about because not everybody actually W you

Know crazy right like no not everybody has Twitter right not everybody has Twitter not everybody reads Twitter even if they have it okay so Rockets play last night and I uh and they’re down by like 28 they catch up they make a lead with this small lineup but it’s like the the five

Or six minute Mark and I’m like okay where’s Alper and Shango and he hasn’t come back yet right and then I tweet this there is no reason that both Jan Tate and Dylan Brook should be playing crunch time minutes over alpr and shenon completely inexcusable that’s tweet one

There’s there’s three tweets by the way okay tweet two is alperin shenon is the clear franchise guy in Houston but gets treated like a six- man sometimes it’s so bizarre if he was the third overall pick instead of 16th none of this would be happening he’s played well enough to

Get the benefit of the doubt on nights like this that’s tweet number two and then tweet number three is quoting tweet number two it’s saying I’m tempted to believe at Red 94’s theory on nights like this the organization keeps fighting the inevitability of shenon as their franchise guy it’s almost as if they’d

Rather crash and burn on what whatever their original vision of the team was instead of course correct so that got a lot of push back like let me see how many yeah like a lot I don’t a lot it’s it’s it’s it’s not just the quote tweets

It’s the comments it’s the it was a lot it was a lot um and it was fun I’m not going to lie it was it was fun to get people riled up like that like it’s been a minute it’s been a minute I’m I’m just going to explain my ration now for

Tweeting this for us you pop in whenever you want right whatever you want cut me off say whatever the hell you want I just want to explain my ration out here yeah let’s hear it first I want to point out I use the phrase tempted to believe deliberately because I don’t 100%

Believe that right like but I’m not going to lie there’s a part of me that always looks at the organization sideways with their usage of shenon like this is the same organization that had two bigs ahead of him in the starting lineup like two years ago

Like in Christian Wood and Daniel T this is the same organization that started Bruno Fernando over him to start last season this is the same organization that feverishly chased Brook Lopez to be their starting center this offseason this is the same organization that continuously goes away from shenon in

Key crunchtime possessions this is the same organization that’s already been tied with the following names of the trade deadline Clint capella Robert Williams Daniel Gafford two of those guys are starting center guys right like starting level guys right you’re telling me that I should feel secure in how they use Alper and

Shenon it took until his third season in the NBA that they were comfortable making him a starter and they weren’t really comfortable they had no other option right and let let me just address this like a couple of things that I saw last night first is a variation of the

Following oh he isn’t he isn’t above anybody on the team are you serious right now is Dylan Brooks the one with 1.8 million votes for the allstar game is Jan Tate the one that every NBA media member talks about weekly on their podcast like is is he the one that

Current and former players keep referring to as quote unquote special like get out of my face with that bull that he’s not above anybody on the team I don’t care if he had a first half from hell shenon has done more than enough to finally get the benefit of the doubt for

This organization and they’re not giving it to him this is not the same as benching as Oka benching Jaylen Green in fourth quarters Jaylen is still trying to prove to everyone that he’s a positive basketball player the organization does not have a history of undermining him this is not Jabari Smith

Jabari Smith was bordering on looking like a bus last year and he still remained a starter above tar een which he shouldn’t have arguably don’t give me this I’m well aware of quotee unquote riding the hot hand I know what that means I’m well aware I’ve been around the sport since I

Was two okay I I I promise I know what that means I have no problem with eay riding a lineup that works up until Midway through the fourth quarter because at the five or six minute Mark shenon should have been back in that game he should have been back in

That game don’t tell me you would have rather had Jan take take step back threes and crunch time possessions of a professional basketball game over Alper and shenon doing literally anything doing literally anything listen like shenon is the guy he’s the guy I know it’s painful for a lot of you guys to

Come around to this I don’t know why it is but it’s seemingly painful I still see it I don’t know why I still see it Bo who you like you don’t do that with your best player you let him figure it out because he gives you the best chance

Of winning basketball games and he’s going to have to learn how to win in those situations anyways like I don’t care if he was having a rough night he is still the most positive player on the team by a wide margin like e may would have never done that with Fred vanv if

He was having a bad game so don’t tell me that he doesn’t already give special treatment to certain guys on the team don’t give me that this guy does not get treated like a budding franchise player that he clearly is in my opinion sorry that’s all I had to say

All right so here’s here’s my response to this um it doesn’t really matter what the fans of the Rockets think about him and I understand it matters when they’re in your mentions I get it I get it I I’ve been yelled at fans before too for primarily Westbrook related takes but uh

So I understand that it can be very tempting to uh to to take seriously to or at least uh take personally those who are are complaining to you but ultimately they’re not the ones who make decisions about elpr shenu apart from I guess the fan voting for the allstar

Game in which they he got 1.8 million votes whatever that translates to in terms of actual number of people voting for All-Star game which I don’t know no one does but the people who do matter what they think about Ala and shingun is the Rockets organization and you’re worri about do people not

Understand he’s the franchise player do the Rockets does that organization do those does that coaching staff does that front office understand that he is a franchise player as you say he is the only player anybody talks about on the team he’s literally the only guy he’s talking about the only other player he

Talks about is Jaylen green because they’re worried that he sucks all right and we can get to jayen Green later but shingun is obviously the best player on a team at this time I can’t rule out that someone else might supersede him eventually because the world contains

Many things but right now he’s obviously the best player on team and that includes Fred venley and that includes Dylan Brooks and that definitely includes Jon Tate all of whom I I love like cousins however they’re not as good as aler and shingun and it is it is

Troubling my cousins can chew better than that by the way I just want to say like and they’re they would never take a step back three in a professional basketball game uh I think a lot of people’s cousin can shoot better than the 2024 Rockets okay but fair enough

But uh what I want to say is that there are disquieting signs that they still would really prefer not to rely on shenon that even even to this date that like they still have a tendency to sit him in big moments they don’t want to go

To him all the time and I don’t know what that’s about I mean is it just he’s like not a guy that they think is cool is it is it something that we don’t know about like behind the scenes when they’re in practice is like is there

Something at the coaching staff sees in shenon that they mistrust him about like I don’t know what’s going on like is is it his defense are they they think he’s never really going to be like an elite defender or something which probably not but but I don’t know what it is I don’t

Know what it is but they don’t they obviously do not trust him yet I mean and it might be as simple as the fact that coaches just don’t trust young players they just like and hopefully it’s just that right that’s it’s like OK is a coach he’s going to play his vets

Vets do in fact they do in fact have some some skills they know things that younger players don’t they’re cool Under Pressure I get it I get it so hopefully it’s just literally udoka being like I want my guys who’ve been in the league for 10 years you know I want these guys

Who’ve played hundreds of games to be out here because they’re not they’re going to be unflappable in a way that like a second or third year player isn’t if it’s just that that’s annoying but I’m not like worried about the team in the same way as if they’re just like I

Don’t know man I don’t think I don’t think Shen gun’s got it like that yeah I’m glad you said this cuz it’s not just this one game man it’s a collection of games right whether that’s him getting benched in the fourth or him just not getting the ball in the fourth

Right it’s there’s a lack of confidence that or like I don’t want to say lack he is leading the team in usage right the the the team does seem to like him a lot right you damn right he better be right you’re damn right uh but like the the

Team does seem to like him and embrace him right uh but there are moments where he gets slided in a way I’m like if this was like Luca donic would the team be treating him like this would the coach be treating him like this if this was

Joel embiid in his third season they did not get bench him like this like this is not something that happens I don’t care if it’s eay I don’t care like this is not normal like first of all like people bring up the Kevin mccale benching James

Harden sit situation to me like first of all can you guys like like least ask how I felt when that happened I did not like that I was not a fan of of Kevin mccale benching James Harden in the like in that that late game situation like it

May have worked but I’m I’m not a process over I’m like a process over results guy right like just because it worked doesn’t mean it was it was the move I would have done right I when when it’s your best player I think you keep him in the game I don’t care what’s

Working I think you always put him back in the game I think you always put him back in the game and like you let him figure it out and if you lose with him you lose with him that’s fine you sleep better you sleep better at night knowing

You did the better the right thing right I don’t care if you if you lose if you lose a game that way because these guys have to get reps in these situations man they’re going to make the playoffs they’re going to make the playing tournament whatever they have to learn

How to win they have to learn how to fight through adversity a bad game yeah which is something I was thinking about earlier to day uh and last night after that I don’t want to call it a fun game but it was a game it was fun it was a

Pretty fun game I’m not going to lie it’s cool to come back from a big deficit and in the end like what the Rockets do this what the Rockets year in terms of making the playoffs or not doesn’t really matter like like that’s all secondary like it’s good if they

Make the playing in the playoffs but what’s the point of that is that they want to get this experience and development for their players that’s the goal this season we’re not they’re not contenders yet and until such time as if ever they become contenders the goal is Improvement whether it’s Improvement of

Individual players Improvement of the team at large what have you they’re trying to get better right now and a big space they need to get better at is that their young players being young aren’t good in crunch time they’re not good in high pressure situations you can look at

The team stats and see this they have like a plus two point differential and their net rating is like plus oneish right like they’re they’re positive in their net rating and all in all those metric not a lot positive but a little positive they have the statistical uh makeup of a team that

Should be better than they are but they because they stay in games they don’t get blown out by in very many games and they stay in games even when they lose it’s usually like not that not that far behind they fight back in the games but they’re not good at winning these close

Games they’re not good at winning overtime and it’s not weird this is normal for young teams to be this way to have to learn but they have to learn this stuff they have to go through these nasty situations they have to they have to feel the pressure and honestly they

Have to lose in the pressure before they can learn how to win under pressure and it like I understand the coaches want to win all these High Press games great I don’t understand how the lineups is going to be your older guys who are not as good as your

Younger guys right and again I understand that coaches trust veterans but you need to get these young players reps in these situations you need to let them under go the trial by fire like yeah just any minute like I know that there’s plenty of debate to be had over

Whether just like any given NBA minutes are better for development than not right A lot of people like well it doesn’t matter how bad the guy is play him when he’s young keep playing him keep playing him even if you lose game after game that’s not always the case

But these guys have shown a lot of promise and you need to let them work through this stuff and figure out how to do this and I know they need to have like ven lead out there as an instructive and calming influence when they’re when they’re doing this they

Need the Vets to who also play but they also need to let their they in particular the guy who is most likely to be with the team long term and that’s the real thing is that shenon of all the guys on the team of everyone of every

Player on the Rockets right now shenon is clearly the most likely to be with the rockets in five years whether he’s their best player or not he’s currently their best player and therefore he’s the one that they’re overwhelmingly likely to keep around you have to prioritize his development over stuff like do I

Have a 5% do I think I have 5% better chance of beating the Nets on a Saturday night right like and this is this argument Cuts both ways like he is objectively the guy who is more likely to help you win the game the close game because this is not Jaylen green where

He’s probably objectively not going to help you in those close games right right like this guy will help you win the game right and you keep him in until he gets cold and guess what he’s going to miss two free throws of the the end

Of the game he hasn’t shot a shot in like 6 minutes right like like I I I I don’t get this H I don’t know like like I eay has done a very good job this year right I want to be fair to him right a very good yeah undeniably done a great

Job undeniably recognized shenon started feeding shenon started Shifting the offense more to him right and I give him credit for that because that last guy didn’t do that right so like he he gets that nod but like I’m sorry I’m going to I’m criticize him when I see something

Stupid and this is something stupid in my opinion yeah I mean even just on really like Fast arguments just showcase your guy some more he’s the closest guy you have to being like an All-Star level player currently right like you why don’t you just want him to get more points get him

More stats man the more stats you can get this guy the more people going to pay attention to your team which that’s cool too right like do you want I don’t know I it is weird it does seem like I don’t know if this is again I don’t know

If this is anybody like actively trying to be anti- shenon in an organizational sense or anything but I do also get the vibe sometimes that the Rockets org is like really this guy no like like how do you not right like how do you like they’re going after Clint capella why

Yeah you can’t yeah you can’t you you can’t you can’t what are you going to do with Clint you going to you going to bench shenon no you’re going to bench Bari no you’re going to bench definitely not right like Robert Williams like like these guys are good enough to justify

Like oh we can like Ben shenon for a fourth quarter like I feel like it’s going to happen more if you if you go get a guy like that right that’s my fear it is somehow a blessing in disguise that jock landale or as the the Beloved

Radio crew for the rocket say JC landal uh jacqu landal is he’s not good sorry I’m sorry jacqu but you’re we need to talk but uh it’s actually kind of good that he’s not reliable at all because then they have to actually play shenon and they can’t just rely on like

Guy who you know grabs a rebound and puts it back right and like um I guess I guess the way eeme gets around that is he play small right and it’s like like like no like no like first of all shenon is small right he can play he he can play

In the small units if you want to play small have shenon out there he’s 68 right I don’t I don’t know how nobody knows how tall he is really but like whatever no one knows how tall anyone is in the NBA they lie he he he’s not a

Seven-footer is what I’m saying right and so like you can go out there and play and he runs the fast break with you he helps you play the way you want to play he’s not he’s not worse of a floor spacer than Jan Tate don’t give me that

Like don’t give me like I I just uh I don’t know like okay like I I don’t want to overreact to that it’s just the re the the reaction that I got I felt like I was being gasin like you guys haven’t been seeing this organization operate uh

Specifically in regards to shenon like I have like have we not been seeing this for 3 years like is it wrong for me to be skeptical like I I I don’t know why people like like raot uh red94 at red 4 like he he he displays his seis he gets

Similar push back right and I look at that and I’m like like I I kind of understand where he’s coming from I’m not always on rahat’s side with this stuff but like like with this stuff I’m like yeah I mean I I kind of get why you would side eye the organization with

Their usage of this guy he’s not even like on the posters right like something as simple as that right like it’s still Jaylen green bobblehead night like why you want to see him Bobble the ball out of bounds like I don’t get it it really does it really does seem

Like jayen all right like alrin being clearly better than Jaylen is just it just is like Crossing wires in people’s heads it’s is not what anybody’s ready for and all the all the like the wonky type guys all like the ‘s and M of the world who like look at Stats and read

Blogs and record podcasts and stuff all of us we were all like the night the night the shingun was drafted I remember like us and our ilk being like all the advanced stats suggest he’s really good this guy’s a really good guy to watch out for and so like a certain kodra was

Like yeah we’ve been suspecting this the whole time and then everyone else is like but why would you this is crazy this doesn’t make any sense no you’re right but yeah here we are no yeah you’re right like I I guess that’s why we’re not opposed to it right we’re not

We’re not like we were kind kind of like seeing this coming right or not seeing this coming like we’re not as surprised by it but yeah at at the same time like we’re we’re also watching these games I’m assuming everybody else is watching these games right like now it’s an even

Playing field these aren’t like oh I have a unique Advantage CU I’m actually watching BSL games like no we’re all watching the Rockets together right like I feel like at a certain point we should be collecting the same data from watching the games right and the data is

Telling us that this guy is the best player they drafted in 2021 by a wide margin right and and probably any successive year no right yeah I know but like for the specific argument like like I it’s just H I don’t know like I I really do think it’s messing with their

Heads how good he is like it’s not not how good he is like how good he is in relation to to Jaylen right like I I think they a lot of them kind of expected this jayen breakout which I again thought that was Ill advised to expect right whatever the case they

Expected it it’s not happening and they’re like what what the [ __ ] man it’s like yeah I mean like he’s he’s 21 and he’s not been better to this point than shenon right like up until this season has not been better than him but let’s just for a second let’s talk about jayen

Green because he actually has been playing I play better I don’t I don’t want to yeah he P out of control recently the last couple Gam yeah right yeah that’s that’s really cool fantastic to see we here’s the thing here’s the thing for us I think people who who see

Us on Twitter or they they listen to bits of this podcast whenever this podcast gets clipped they’re going to see it and they’re going to they’re going to be like oh these guys just hate jayen it’s like no we don’t hate J we we want the we want this team to succeed

Yeah I want to put this out there right now the absolute best case scenario for the Rockets for Jaylen green for alred and shenon for you for me and every Rockets fan is that Jaylen green reaches Allstar Talent level that is absolutely the best case scenario can I top you the

A the best case scenario is he’s better than shenon because shenon is this good yes yeah if he manag to be better than this unbelievable they have like two incredible players I would love it cuz cuz that means they got like a Jordan right like right like like that that’s

That would that would be amazing like why would I not want that why would Forest not want that we’re fans of this team oh I’d love that jayen is really fun he’s a fun player he’s a fun guy it would make the Rockets an incredibly fun and really good team everything is

Perfect there yeah we’re not rooting against him I I would give so much for Jaylen to be better than shenon I I agree with you like I would it would be a huge victory for for literally everybody maybe less so shenon but in the end more so shenon because if they

Have two guys that caliber they have a really clear and realistic path to a championship cool I love that let’s do it Jaylen keep playing like this absolutely fantastic to see love to see him going out there and racking up like 30 40 points h ah what a if you can keep doing

This that’s incredible I I want that I want that so for everyone out there clipping things I want Jaylen green to keep having games like this I want him to keep looking like this I want his confidence to improve I want his skills to improve and I want him to put

Everyone who doubted him including me to shame yeah 100% like I I want to be wrong about this so badly I want to be wrong about this so badly I I again I I I’m not here rooting for my takes to be correct I’m rooting for this basketball

Team I want to see this team win a championship like like screw me like that’s all I want right like I it’s all I want I I I I don’t want this team to do anything else so why would I not want Jaylen green to be the best basketball player

He could possibly be and like he’s been playing really well he’s been hitting his shots we’ve been talking about forever how that’s really the the thing that’s really the thing with him yeah like he’s just not he the biggest reason he’s not been good is he’s not been

Hitting his shots now there are other things his handle is pretty weak right now right like I I I think it’s it’s going to take a lot of work uh I think the playmaking is still not where you need he’s still throwing the ball to Invisible players sometimes right like

That’s got to that’s got to stop right uh but here’s my thing with this right like even after this hot stretch my opinion about him being like the future shooting guard for this team I I I really have not wavered like I don’t think that’s happening right like I I

Just I think Whitmore is just that much better uh it seems it just seems as a prospect he just seems that much better right and physically developed uh than J than Jaylen and I think defensively will long-term be better right like that’s just my that’s my hunch watching cuz at

At 19 I remember Jaylen and this looks better right let me let me put two things out there one is that yeah defensively I don’t see it even like that’s it’s very clear that Whitmore is going to better defensively than Jaylen like which is not a knock on Jaylen

Green whatsoever like plenty of the the kind of players that he plays like are pretty much always not great defensively for a lot of reasons and that’s fine that’s just part of the deal he’s kind of short frame right yeah yeah yeah he’s like like yeah kind of a shorter slight

Like Score first player whatever it’s fine it’s fine that he’s not going to be like a defensive sty work because usually there’s a trade-off between these things however cam Whitmore and also shout outs to am man Thompson as well his co-rookie because I’m going this point in a second is that he’s a

Rookie all right and he’s looking like a positive player on the floor when he’s playing and as I’ve hammered many times before rookies are bad they’re just almost always bad like you almost universally even really good players in the rookie season are minus players so being even a slightly plus player in

Your first year looking as good as cam looks right now is a really good sign for his longterm development like it’s very enthusing that he looks like he understands and belongs in the NBA in his first year in the season I don’t want to be able to forget that rookies

Have a hard time and anyone who’s not having a hard time I mean part of it is perhaps he’s in a great situation but that’s only going to help him it’s very good that he and amen look this good this early but that is the honestly bolsters your point that yeah that’s

That’s worrying if you’re jayen green because cam looks like a guy that they’re probably going to want to be their starting two guard at some point in the near future no right like and that’s why I think really and I I said this last night too didn’t wasn’t as controversial

As the other tweets but still still got still got some buzz like I I think long term jaylen’s best Pathway to Dam specifically on this team but on other teams is at the point guard position right at that if he’s if he’s a point guard long term right first of all he’s

Very very very very far from that right like he’s very very very far from that it’s G it’s got we’re talking a long-term project like three or four years from now if there’s a chance of him being that type of impact player it’s at the point guard position because

He has a plus size at that position uh he he has a decent passing feel right and he’s he not as efficient scoring the basketball uh as Whitmore so I don’t think I just don’t think it’s going to happen there so like if it’s going to happen anywhere and and defensively by

The way he’s not going to have to defend the bigger Wings if he’s playing point guard right so like these are these are reasons why I kind of think that’s possible it’s like a it’s like a a 10% outcome right for him yeah I mean and he’d also better

Hope that Thompson doesn’t learn how to shoot mhm so I I mean I wonder like that’s his competition though right like his competition is a men and that’s going to be hard but the leg up that he has on a men is he can shoot yeah yeah

Exactly and I I kind of Wonder a little bit if he has become aware that his situation is increasingly precarious cuz it does seem like he’s going a little harder which he should be like I I I mean this is this is obviously just total speculation but

Like I wonder if his starting position has become in doubt in the with the Rockets organization I wonder if they’ve sat it down and talk to him about about it because yeah he needs to play like this he wants to keep starting if he wants to keep being on the posters for

The Houston Rockets this is he has to do this he doesn’t right yes if he wants to keep having bobblehead nights he’d better keep playing like which great if that’s if that’s what takes to motivate him awesome good do it you know be an incredible scorer uh keep the dogs at

His heels at Bay and you know keep the team scoring because boy they sure need some scoring on that team no they do they do and like Jaylen is like one of their best Pats to getting there but like the problem is it’s just not efficient scoring right like like more

Often than not it hasn’t been efficient scoring the last two games have been kind of different but this is the kind of been the pattern with jayen you’ll have stretches where he is efficient then you’ll have stretches where he’s not efficient and it’s like it feels like the stretches where he is efficient

Is seem to be enough for your organization to be like okay he can keep a starting spot right like it’s like it’s like enough fuel for them to like okay the flashes they they keep us they keep us here right and this we kind of transition from this to the trade

Deadline where are you on jayen at the deadline you think that’s even like a remote possibility no they’re not going to trade him why would they I mean look I’ve listened to I’ve listened to friends of the program talking about it you know and many people have talked about

This and I do agree that uh it’ll be interesting to see what they do at the trade deadline if they trade Jaylen green I would be phenomenally surprised they they really seem to want him to succeed which is good they should want him to succeed but yeah that that

Doesn’t sound at all like they’re going to trade him because the the offers that they would get for him would not be good enough mean they might trade him if they get like an incredible offer if they get absolutely blown away but that’s not going to happen that’s that that’s not

On the table if it is fine come get me come come let me hear about it I deserve it if they if the Rockets not trading jayen green for a star level player get my no problem you win but it’s not going to happen they’re not going to trade him for anything less

Than like an All-Star level player and they’re not going to get that offer so no he’s not getting traded this this in like 3 weeks or whatever I hope that reluctance to trade him is coming from a place of self-confidence and not self-preservation right like that that’s

My hope I don’t want them to make the wrong basketball decision for political reasons that’s my fear right like it’s oh cuz he was taking number two overall and I don’t want them to double down on this if he’s not a hit and you know it like trade him whenever you view his

Value to be the highest right like I think that’s that’s what I that’s what I would advise the organization to do but that said if there are people in the organization that still believe like hey I still think this guy will get to a place of being one of the best players

On a championship team okay then keep it going but but like right now it’s hard not to acknowledge it looks a little precarious right and so I would at least listen to offers at the deadline but I’m with you I would be floored if he gets

Moved yeah I I don’t think they’re GNA do it I mean I do think that I do think that uh longterm the most likely scenario is that he gets traded at some point in the next like few years and it’s but it’s you know that’s even if he

Like shapes up or whatever like even if Jaylen green looks pretty good good I I just it just seems like they’re going to they’re going to have to lose like two or three of these guys because that’s just how the salary cap works so I think most likely he’s going to be in

Two or three who are just like not really there it’s just bet they’ll get better return for trading him than they will get on court return for retaining him like if Cam ends up better than him which seems quite possible if not likely then yeah you know you you got to move

Some of them so you just got to figure out which ones you’re going to move really yeah cam sucks to here no I mean Cam’s just a better Prospect I mean like like I I don’t want to dance around this like that’s what I I just what I feel I

Feel like that’s what most people feel when they watch the Rockets right it’s not like it’s just so sometimes it you don’t have to like dance around this it’s just kind of obvious like we’re all watching the same games they’re playing in the same contextes right like it’s

Not like like this is not like college basketball where these guys are on different teams it’s like oh one guy has better floor space in one guy coaching right like it’s like like these guys are both playing in the same environment and so one guy is playing much much better

In that environment minute for minute right so I that’s I just tend to believe it’s a better Prospect so like we we’ll just see if he ever gets to a point where like um where where where if the organization ever gets to a point where they they feel like trading him within

The next 12 months I think actually the date I would keep an eye on is not this off Seas next February right cuz I don’t I don’t think he’s getting an extension this summer unless it’s like really Team friendly I don’t think he’s going to sign a Team friendly extension and I

Think next trade deadline the organization is going to be like hey we don’t want to play the rest fre agency game with this guy uh he’s played well enough by that point I think I think he’ll I think he’ll play better in year four uh I think he’ll play better at

Year at year excuse me in year four by February at that point to where you can trade them for a little bit more than what you can trade him for right now so if that was if that if I were a betting man that’s what I would bet on February

2025 but we’re in january/february of 2023 of 2024 let’s talk about what Houston’s objectives are if not trading jayen green like what’s a goal for this this organization Forest well they got to use that victoro contract that’s to me number one cuz if you don’t do anything with it it’s just

Going to f away and it’s not particularly useful for them for to do that as we’ve mentioned many times before they’re not trying to be an under the cap team they’re kind of pass that that’s that’s a rebuilding phase and they’re now in the tooling phase right

So they don’t want to be under the cap it doesn’t help them be under the cap so they’re going to want to use that contract because it’s an expiring which is not good for them but it is going to be good for someone else and if nothing else that’s filler that’s salary filler

They can use in a different trade so that they can have long longer term money so they can keep themselves operating nearby cap so they got to move him he’s probably going have to be package I mean this is this is what everyone says but it’s simply the truth

Like him plus let’s say jacqu landal and uh maybe jant Tate J shant Tate yeah J shant Tate is a real he’s a real Target for getting moved also because his he’s not on the same timeline as the other guys are uh he’s he’s good he’s good but

He’s not great right you know so he’s he’s actually useful for other teams and those minutes are minutes that could be used for all kinds of things right let’s be let’s be clear about the guy who actually get we’ll get this minute those minutes yeah so cool that’s great that’s

Like that’s pretty clear they have three guys who are big time the guys you don’t to trade they have some assets which look kind of nice the Nets picks are looking better and better by the day so that’s pretty cool uh they can can actually get someone back who could

Be useful the question is what does all right the two questions what does the team need and what does the team think they need okay so I I agree with you one of those goals is definitely trading Victor o Depo 100% the Rockets making a deal with the

Deadline’s probably off the table in Vegas because it’s so obvious that they’re going to make a deal with the deadline because of Victor odo’s contract it is a time right so they’re going to make some sort of move I think another goal is probably going to be getting a long-term salary that helps

You uh a long-term positive salary right so a good player basically like uh a good player that you can maybe move in the future if you need to move it in to aggregate salary as you said uh if a star player becomes available or just to

Have that contract right um I think I think that’s the goal uh I think exploring at the very minimum Jan Tate’s trade value right I think you want to see what you can get for him right if you can get two seconds and you can use

Those two seconds in a trade um where you move lelle and Olo together maybe that helps you get a starter level player you know um but to answer your two questions what I think they should go after is like I think they need shooting pretty badly I think they need

Kind of perimeter help ball handling help uh van V’s just doing too much he just doing too much like you need some help they need a real they need like a real backup point guard right like I like I like Aon holiday Aaron holiday is um a little frustrating at times as a

Decision maker right I think I I would like them to go after someone like Malcolm brogon like I I I’ve said this on last episode he is my favorite trade Target for the Rockets I wanted them to get him last summer but his contract fits uh he’s long-term salary he’s good

He can kind of start for you in a pinch so if you want to not too good yeah that’s true right like uh he can also like um if you want to do the whole bench Jaylen thing and you don’t want to do the sensible thing which is

Like start tar e or Cam Whitmore maybe you can just start Brogden right you can do it that way you can be you can sell it to him easier because it’s a vet right um so like like that that’s that’s a name I like I love

I like the idea of them going after like a wing is type guy right cuz you can get shooting and ball handling there too like Jeremy Grant I like um I actually do kind of like the idea of Harrison Barnes you know I’m sure how much I’d be

Willing to give and I’m not sure how that trade would would happen but I think that’s a decent Target like I think he helps you uh in the same areas and if you if you need to get a big which this this is where it to answer

Your second question I think they want a big I think these targets are the guys they’re actually looking at like Clint capella your Robert Williams your your Daniel gaffords if you need a big I think they should go back to the John Collins well right cuz that’s a flexible

Big that can play with shenon right he can provide floor spacing and he can be backup center right they need a they need a backup center they do not need a starting center but they do need a backup center yes yes and like my fear is that they’re going to go get a

Starting center at the deadline right like that’s my fear and not I’m not saying starting center as in like um like one of the best centers in the NBA but like I my fear is they’re going to go get a Clint capella type or Robert Williams type

Right and like those guys have justif justifiable cases in someone like eoka who’s defensively focused uh coach just to end games and I don’t want that to happen right I don’t want the I don’t want the organ I don’t want uh this coaching staff to have an excuse to

Bench shenon in fourth quarters because again we talked about why all the all the positive reasons why shenon should be playing in fourth quarters so that’s my fear or what what they’re what what I think they might be wanting at the trade deadline yeah if they were to acquire like a

Clint capella that’s that’s chaos man like that would be such a mess what H what happens then do they they can’t they you can’t bench shenon you can’t do that no and at the same time capella is really good right so like you’re you can’t bench him either right I mean but

What else can you do right and you can’t play them at the same time because they both can’t shoot right so it it doesn’t make any sense to me it feels like the people who are fervently like like really want this are the people who never believed in shenu

To be frank to be frank like when I read tweets about people wanting clink capelle I’m like oh this is a person this is someone who’s never been like a shenon guy right and they’re like reluctantly come around lately it’s like okay so now you now you want them to

Trade for a center how convenient right like like the guy you never believed in now you want them to go get someone that could perceivably play over him right yeah I I just want them not to have to run out Jeff Green or Jo landela Center

That’s all I want I just want the the the guy behind shenon to be a real Center and look Jeff nothing against Jeff Green but don’t mind it though like like I don’t know like maybe it’s just me I don’t mind Jeff Green being a backup center what is he on this team

When it’s fully healthy he’s just kind of the everything guy so I mean I I like him as like everything guy but I don’t want to see choc glandale again fair enough that’s only the thing like yeah like like J like Jeff Green can’t do that right he can play backup center

Sometimes but he’s can’t be him being your main backup center is like a weird misuse of Jeff Green to me like if that’s what he is so I don’t know how far Sports Science has has come in the past few years right I know the NBA’s

Gotten like a lot of like cool medical devices right like with sleeping sleep tracking and like you know how fast you’re you’re running and like like all these cool stuff that they have all these cool gadgets gizmos I wonder if you can get like jooc Lando like a shot

Coller so whenever he gets an offensive rebound he doesn’t put it back up right he KCK like like no pass it out yeah yes kick it out don’t put that up I don’t care if a point guard is guarding you I want you to kick that ball out like it

Is the most terrifying thing in in basketball to see Jo Lando get an offensive rebound I’m like no no don’t put it back up don’t double jump don’t double jump single jump right kick it out but yeah uh sorry I I I I I wonder

If you could if you could get eay a shot Coller for jock land like it’s just it’s just it’s just an idea the soft pitch the Rockets I think that might be against the Geneva Convention but it’s worth a worth a look it’s worth a look

Right I at the very least you have a coaches meeting right like at the very least you have a meeting about it but yeah I I’m I’m with you you can’t have lale playing backup center anymore um those are lost minutes I disagree with the Jeff green thing but

Okay whatever I mean maybe you can go get someone I just I again it better be of a certain caliber you better not go go too far with this right that’s the thing they need a guy who is like as good as they thought that landale was

Going to be basically a little better than that like you said Colin’s like a good a good uh a good match because he’s like fine they need a guy who’s fine they don’t need a guy who’s good that that’s the thing I mean every I’m sure

Every fan loves the idea of having like their 15 players be the 15 best players in the league or whatever but it’s not how that’s not how it works it’s not that doesn’t interface with the reality whatsoever so trying to think of what else at the

Trade deadline I mean their own pick is at not count because they can’t trade we can talk about this right like so like the Brooklyn pick is really what I’m what I’m I’m talking about like so would you trade that pick right cuz I think on last week’s episode I said I’d

Be open to it but now it just keeps getting better and better and Houston just looks worse and worse right they’re losing games and it’s like do I really want them to trade that Brooklyn pick for a win out player like it’s like maybe just draft it I don’t know like I

Like I I and I I recognize how crazy that sound this team is stock full of young young talent and I’m not sure if it can candle more but at the same time like I mean if you tell me you have a chance at the number one overall pick

Right cuz if if you’re if you’re seventh in Lottery odds you have a real chance the number one overall pick so it’s like do you want to trade that away is this Lottery really that bad right all right as as we get far in this podcast do you

Want me do you want me to lay out a crazy idea to you lay it on me all right the question is what is the Rockets chances of Landing a top four pick because if they keep if they keep playing like this oh right it’s protected top four yeah it’s top four

Protected right so here’s the thing about the league right now is that there’s a lot of teams who are like medium there’s a pile of medium teams there are so many 500ish teams currently and in the East they look a little worse because the top end of the East is

Actually stronger in the top end of the West we don’t have to get into that whatever but my my thinking is this like looking at the league recently I’ve been thinking there are like 20 teams who are pretty good and like 10 teams who are not pretty good which is unusual right

Most teams are like plus teams right now if the Rockets are like a slightly negative team they might be like a top eight like Lottery position pick they like the Rockets literally might be like 12 or 13th in the west this year even if they win like 38

Games they might have like the even if they win like 38 games they might have like the eighth best Lottery odds I think it might take being a 41 team to to get in the plan tournament I really I really think that’s what it’s going to

Take in the west um yeah I think it’s 40 it might even be closer to 44 depending on how things go what the or what the Warriors do primarily yeah what the Warriors do what the Lakers do what the Jazz do I mean the Jazz have been on

Fire too and you wonder what they’re going to do at the deadline I mean cuz they have some pieces that they could trade away but they’re trying to do that same balancing act that Houston’s doing but in a different way they have like more proven Commodities uh but still you

Know it is like going to be interesting to see what Danny a decides to do what he decides to extract in that respect like it’s going to be really tough as you said to make the play in tournament and so you have to weigh that with like

Trading for a win now piece right cuz it’s like do you want to do that like do you want to get like like like I wonder what the Rockets internally think of this draft because I know what externally what everybody’s saying about this draft but is it really that bad

Like do do the Rockets see see someone that’s like oh this guy could be a franchise level guy maybe we should just keep the pick I I’d be very curious to see what they to hear to know what they think I mean they have all right my proposition is

That what if they just don’t make any major win now moves you know what if you just see what you can get for you know your basically disposable assets you move your Victor Depot you do whatever you got to do there but don’t worry about win now what if you just keep

Rolling with these young guys and see what you have what if you don’t worry about winning what if you’re like fine we’re going to win like 35 games we’re going to win 35 games and then we’re going to have like two realistic shots at a top four draft

Pick yeah theoretically I mean you you got to wonder how ownership feels about that that’s that’s the problem right it’s like how patient is Tilman right like I’m with you I think you should VI that pick as a sun cost that Houston has going out I don’t know if the Rockets

Are are with you right I don’t know if if they feel that way right uh so I feel like there’s some pressure there to make the play in tournament I I don’t think it’s it might be play in tournament or bus right and I hope it’s not I hope

It’s not because I don’t want again we talked about this on last week’s show I don’t want heads to roll I I think they’ve done a good enough job for heads not to roll I think Rafel should get a mild contract extension this summer right I think he’s done enough for like

A like a you know modest extension right I I think nine out of 10 years this is a playin team like honestly probably no problem this is this is a bad year to be decent in it’s a great year to be excellent in like the top the top e of

The league are like not really as good as they have been for a while right now but the middle the middle of the league is really fat and so it’s like a bad it’s a really bad year to just be kind of good I don’t think they’re going to

Make the play in like I mean maybe if they get if everyone stays healthy from here on out if some of the other teams like regress a bit it can H it can happen but the current trajectory I think is them being like the 12th like

The 11th or 12th seed probably I’m not all the way there yet I I I I think they I think they have a coin toss chance of making the play in and I would lean a little bit to yes right I think I I think I really don’t like this Lakers

Team right now the the Lakers are going to make a move here pretty soon uh so we’ll see what they eventually round into right like I I don’t know if they’re going to trade for a dejonte Murray or Zack LaVine and that’s going to definitely impact some things but

Still I don’t like this team and I I kind of think there’s a real chance Houston becomes better than that thinker team I don’t know about this Jazz team right like we I I I I’m I’m reasonably confident that they can at least compete to the end till the end of the season

For this spot I don’t think it’s I don’t think anybody’s going to walk away with this is what I’m saying yeah I mean I think that the Lakers are probably the number one uh suspect for falling out because they’ve they’ve had to have they have so far had like the best injury

Luck they’ve ever had basically like LeBron and AD have been spotless this season Anthony Davis is having one of his best seasons ever and he’s barely been hurt at all which is great for him but it’s very unusual for him like this is a Lakers team that if they get normal

Injury luck they’re in huge trouble they’ve just been very very lucky so far which good for them you love to get lucky but yeah I think there’s a very old chance of like Anthony Davis goes down for a month and then suddenly they just like go into free fall or LeBron uh

Runs out of the spirit that keeps his ancient body moving or whatever is going on so yeah uh I’m worried at the L about the Warriors coming up from behind I think it’s possible Lakers fall from ahead I’m even a little bit worried about the Grizzlies honestly who just

Keep trudging along and are only a few game they’re like they’re three games behind the rockets and they have had an unbelievably nasty season I don’t know how I don’t understand they how they came back from being like 1 and8 to be now like 17 and 22 or whatever I get it

Like it looks precarious I’m I still think it’s a coin toss and I would still think that Houston has a real chance to the end of the season right like I I still think it’s not it’s not over but I think there I think there’s like a 10%

Chance they could win 40 games and be the 13th seed like I think that is like on the table which is crazy to think about okay so let’s see what what the statistical models say right now about their chances because I’m actually curious okay it depends on which model

You look at uh I’m gonna look at dunks and threes their playoff probabilities yeah great okay so three six nine so they have Houston at 39.9 wins 10th seed uh it barely edging out the Jazz at 39.6 and just under the Lakers at 40.7 so it looks like there’s there’s still

Some re reasonable confidence in those Rockets numbers right now that those numbers aren’t putting into account how bad they’ve been in in in crunch time right as we talked about earlier and they’re losing a ton of these games in crunch time it’s it’s hurting their odds

Actively and so we’ll see if they get some better crunch time uh performances but yeah it’s going to be tough like here if you’re asking me what I’d like them to do with the deadline I’d really like them to swing for a Brogden a Jeremy Grant a Collins right a fringe

Starter or a starter or like a Harrison Barnes type like I think someone who is going to help you soak up some minutes provide good shooting and be a good contract you can move in the future that’s what I would like them to do my fear is that they they trade for center

Now the deadline is fast approaching and rumors are still coming up that you know about you know these players are still like it seems like the Lakers can’t make up their mind on what they want to do with the deadline for example right like teams are still talking and it doesn’t

Seem like anything has really come to fruition other than the trades that we’ve already seen you know uh the trade for Pascal yakum the trade for um ogan and noi right like other than those trades it seems like things are very fluid and we’re going to get a very

Active trade deadline so I’m very curious to see what happens because it would not surprise me at all if Houston decides to swing even bigger than what we’re talking about yeah I mean me I think they would love to get an All-Star caliber player

Um it’s hard to do but I have to wonder what they’d be willing to give up for that I mean here’s the deal is that if there were to be such a player available which often times you don’t hear about it until it happens if there is such a

Player available like what would they be willing to give up like what is nailed down I kind of feel like it should be nothing honestly like depending on the player but the the hope is that like it would be great if there was like you know an all NBA first team level player

Who would be available and then they can give up kind of whatever you know grab grab that guy you know as get him on a contract and now suddenly things are different it’s not available though the worry is that there will be a guy who’s not that good like the biggest fear I

Think that every rocket Manan should have will be that Zack LaVine they do yeah yeah basically and if they sell high on alred and shenon that would be an absolute nightmare because you might think this is high but this is in my opinion low I’m not exaggerating Forest if they trade Alper

And shenon for Zack LaVine I will stop doing this podcast I will stop doing this podcast I will I’m not sure if I’ll roster to the Rockets game again like until until they fire Rafel like that would be right like that’s right possible move right that’s where I’d be

I mean that would be go to like Tillman’s house with a with signs and pitchforks or whatever I I I I’d be passing out signs I’d be passing out signs you and I could be there you can drive down from Austin help me out like

Like he I’ll bring the van yeah yeah Lo him up yeah I’ll I’ll bring I’ll bring tiki torches like I’ll go the full nine yards right like I’ll go the full nine yards to get this guy out of here right like to to to if they decide to trade shenon for

Someone like like that I would be very upset but yeah I mean what I do think we should keep all options on the table like Mel Bridges right like that could still happen and there’s a lot of incentive for both teams to deal with each other right so like like honestly

Sometimes you know aam’s razor with this stuff right like I it like it would not surprise me if they if they just make a deal it would not surprise me yeah well I hope they I I agree with you that I hope they make deals kind of around the

Margins I don’t think they should swing big unless something unreasonably big is out there which it’s just not so yeah I think they should make deals ROM marches I think they have a lot of good and interesting players they need to keep developing and it’s tempting it’s very

Tempting to try to win now because of how close they looked at this start of season and close they could potentially look later in the season but I think they they need to be patient that’s it yeah that’s in a in a word my stance of the trade deadline is please have

Patience yeah be reasonable yeah reasonable aggression right not ruthless aggression reasonable aggression right like let’s make that a goal for the Rockets I I think it’s fine if you want to make the play tournament let’s not let’s not get carried away right let’s not get carried away about it all right

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