Sammy Saves The Day ft. David Pagnotta

Ilya Samsonov started the month of January on waivers, and just 25 days later, he’s the talk of the town following a 32-save 1-0 shutout victory over the Winnipeg Jets. Join Nick Alberga & Jay Rosehill as they recap another rollercoaster night for the Maple Leafs. Also, NHL Insider David Pagnotta of The Fourth Period & SiriusXM NHL Network Radio drops by to touch on the very latest surrounding the squad.

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You’re watching Leaf’s morning take with host Nick aler and former NHL J Rose Hill the show starts now presented by Bano it’s time for the Thursday edition of leaf morning take and we’re we’re feeling quite jial on this Thursday because the maple Le beat the Winnipeg Jets a shut out Victory

We’re going to talk about that and much more coming up it’s Nick alberga and Jay Roso what’s going on Rosie not much same old just kind of re-evaluating that snooze Fest that happened yesterday I didn’t see that coming man I knew you know maybe the Winnipeg Jets would be putting on a bit

Of a defensive effort but uh odd one man z00 overtime not a ton of scoring chances kind of an ugly start and some couple weird things going on for the Leafs but uh a night for Sammy anyway that’s for sure you can’t quote me on this but I can’t recall the last one-

Nothing game this year at least specifically in the NHL and if you were to ask me to wage your money on the maple being involved in that game I would have called you crazy but uh nevertheless I mean that is one of the sell points of the game is a maple e

Under hit uh for the first time in ever it seems but very defensive minded game great gold tening so looking forward to getting to that uh Dave Pena the fourth period is going to drop by in about 25 minutes or so we’re gonna break down

This one he was at the game at scoa Bank Arena we’re going to talk about the trade market Ryan Reeves uh you know Sheldon keiths Le we’re going to cover everything with Dave Pinot but I want to start off Today’s Show by getting your thoughts on what transpired um in

Florida in Sunrise the Florida Panthers the Arizona Coyotes getting together the first time since uh January 2nd and uh the Nick cousins boarding on on Jason zuker and the return of stage fighting man we got two scraps in the first like two faceoffs of that game yeah that was wild you haven’t seen

That in uh in a little while but uh you know two teams that have uh a bit of uh a bit of grit to him for sure and uh you know some retribution was paid some guys weren’t happy some guys wanted to uh take care of business

And they did a couple of times they off the opening draw you don’t see that all the time but um kind of uh kind of like to see it still exist once in a while it doesn’t hurt my feelings at all well it’s funny like five years ago it’s like

The the the mo of the league was to get stage fighting out of the league but I I think it just adds like I mean we all knew what was happening Rosie like I watched the beginning of that game and I saw the fourth lines of both sides

Starting that like we knew it was happening I think both under both coaches understood the assignment to give him what transpired like two weeks ago no yes it’s uh I don’t know it’s I think the coaches go put guys out there but one guy just to kind of

Protect and oh I’m not going to leave my guys hanging so another guy and all of a sudden you got your you know your big fourth line out there and you know it the stage fighting need to leave around that you know 2008 9 10 11 12 era um even while I was

In the league doing that role I wasn’t a big fan of it I wanted it you know the best ones are organic and ones that come out of uh you know out of passion and out of intensity and the corners and and whatnot but I mean the stage fighting is

Gone it’s not a problem anymore so if something needs to be taken care of or addressed or a team feels the need to do something like that and that’s the way to go about it I have zero problems with it it’s not like this it’s not like the

Big Meathead 260 pound you know can hardly skate Scrappers coming back in any way shape or form to say good luck to the guy after you know before a square up so I’m fine with it uh a little bit of old school hockey never bothers me I know it doesn’t uh is there

A specific fight that comes up in your world I know you’ve had plenty of them where it’s like it was so stage it was silly but like you just loved it is there one that comes out to to full memory of you no well I don’t know I

Mean there’s this one um before Mike rup I had kind of lat Tang whacked me in the back of the legs was his back check and I turned around and kind of lifted my stick up between his legs one-handed and he fell like I shot him right just a

Complete rat so um the next uh face off Mike grup came out and he’s like did you you didn’t spear him did you Rosie and I was like no I did not he fell like a pile of bricks and he goes I know but we’re still gonna have to go I said

That’s fine it was a TV timeout so I’m kind of skating around waiting for that to end and then before I came back they had to go to another TV timeout because the The Ice was all buggered up and the liesman and I was like oh my God this is

Taking forever and you know just going through and you’ve already you know given the signal that we’re going here in a a matter of moments and then it’s got to drag on and wait and wait it’s it’s an ugly feeling you just want to uh

You just want to get going and and get it over with Vic I can hear you back there rumaging like you it’s nobody’s business holy moly building a brick house back there uh you know the listeners can’t hear that right it’s our producer in the background but nevertheless yeah I think

It’s uh it’s intriguing I think when you look at that from that perspective that you’re just waiting and waiting and waiting for the scrap to happen it just never goes down and then you’re like I don’t know it’s like it must be a crazy mentality when you know you’re about to

To scrap and it just you’re you’re waiting you know yeah it’s ugly feeling man I it’s bad enough when say there is some retribution game going on it’s very obvious like I remember getting called up up uh yeah I think I got called up one day when I was down because Carcillo was

Acting like a meathead and I got called up from a road trip we were down in Texas with the Marley’s had to get called up um so as soon as that phone call hits everyone’s texting you oh you and Carcillo and stuff I’m like I’m not sure Carcillo is gonna scrap me

Especially when it’s so built up and but that whole day and then that night and then you go to pregame skate and then after afterwards you go home you take your nap it’s on your mind you wake up your alarm goes off time to put your

Suit on you know it’s coming you know it’s coming everyone’s building it up your phone’s blowing up I’m gonna make sure I watch that game are you gonna fight so and so it’s like good Lord it takes forever I hated game day but uh

You know in that game you you get out it for some reason they put us out there second shift and we scored and it was a non-issue and that’s usually the case when it’s very very built up but you know waiting for those scraps is never ideal I just love playing hard getting

In the corners banging in crash and some guy doesn’t like it springload your and Away you go that’s the best way to do it and always has been well I’m sure your teammates loved it so it’s great to hear that and great to see that and having you as a teammate over the

Weekend and Jasper I can attest to that you you blew up some guy on Seattle the Seattle team that we played so uh you set a tone out there and I think that’s where the team went in a bit of a hot streak in Jasper that pawn hockey

Tournament so Dave penot is coming up in about 25 or 20 minutes or so at the leaf Nation 41 here on YouTube where you could subscribe if you’re watching right now hit that subscribe button hit that like button at the Leafs Nation 401 Leafs morning take wherever you find

Your podcast as well make sure to leave us a review with a festar rating that would be fantastic brought to you by door Dash it’s time for the appetizer for a limited time our listeners can get 25% off up to $10 in value and zero delivery fees in their first order of

$15 or more when you download the door Dash app enter code nation2 that’s code Nation 25 uppercase for 25% off your first order with door Dash offer valid in Canada sub the change terms apply and I thought you put it perfectly as we were texting after the game very unley

Victory that’s usually what happens to the least but they found a way didn’t they yeah they did find a way um it didn’t look like they wanted to you know the to come out that way and get those shots I mean we know it’s a defensively sound team over there with the Jets

Their the numbers on them having three and less goals scored on them for 30 I I get it um you’d think if if any team would be able to crack them it would be the Firepower of the Leafs they’re offensively minded they’re offensively gifted it’s it’s one of the things that

They do have um but they just couldn’t crack it and you know it wasn’t a lot of scoring chances either way it looked like both teams were tired that’s what I’m going to say it is the dog days of January here both teams looked tired nobody had the explosive you know

Ability to just come out and just overwhelm the team both teams were kind of stuck in the same gear um you know that two on0 we can talk about my Lord I’ve never quite seen anything like that but at the end of the day when the the

Chances came around Sammy was there to help out I really can’t even think of a good scoring chance that the Leafs had the entire the entire game like nothing major it’s not like they were getting goaled it’s not like they were getting chances like crazy and just couldn’t

Find the back of the net there was like nothing going on it was a very boring game I’m just going to say it um because both teams were kind of like I said stuck in the same gear that’s fair um there’s so many different Avenues we can

Go um maybe we go with the start first and foremost like um and maybe not because we’re playing the video of the save here so why don’t we break that down first the save and um we can intertwine that into a conversation about benching some of the big boys in

The second period like I think it’s hilarious that in his entire tenure as a head coach of this team like that that’s the moment ke’s like I’ve had enough it wasn’t a back check from Marner and Matthews on the power play that led to that two on0 and and and that’s the

Moment where Keith’s like you know what I’m gonna make a statement here I’m gonna bench these guys on the power play well something must have happened that shift to pull the certain crew off and because obviously nobody knew who was going on to to replace the defenseman so

That’s what happens when there’s normal expectations on who’s going out a coach will say you know back it off to to make the the regulars not go out there but the new guys aren’t really made aware that it’s them so I’ve played in like three leagues in 13 years of

Professional hockey I’ve never seen a two on0 breakdown like that I mean three things had to happen you had to switch up the line so that nobody knew who was going out then you had to realize that nobody was able to catch the changing defenseman no one was able to catch it

Quick enough for them to realize holy just someone jump over the boards no one even was paying attention to the fact that no one was replacing the line change and then once that was sorted out the guy didn’t bust his ass back into the defensive Zone like three major

Things had to happen for that breakdown to go and in the NHL of all leagues for a two on0 from the red line with that much time and space and nobody even chasing them down it’s not like couple guys squirted by on a bobbling puck there was nobody around that was

Beer league man I I was in shock at what was going on had to had to kind of rewind and figure out what the hell happened but it was an odd odd thing and Sammy came up absolutely huge they really botched that two on0 but uh lucky

To keep it z00 after that for sure that was it reminded me a lot of um remember that game a couple months back where neander collided with I think John Tavarez and nobody really came back and the opposition scored the the the winner in that game like it reminded me a lot

About that but watching the replay I don’t even know if Kei saw the two saves because he was laying into Matthews took a bad change and then like did like one of those half turns like there’s a two on0 Escape back like and I like that there was some semblance of

Accountability like he didn’t go as far as to bench these guys for a five on five shift I think he hit them more where it hurts and that’s on the power play like he kept this guy’s punting away power plays in a z00 hockey game

Not to say that p1’s been good at all the last eight games they one for 20 the least power play but I thought it was such an interesting time in the season in his tenure uh to pull that out it just means uh he’s a bit desperate he

Knows his job could be on the line and he’s had enough of this yeah you you’d think so man it’s just to me it seems scattery it just seems scattery you know and I wish we could watch practice because be nice to know what kind of practice he’s

Running um what the flow state of that is what the what the attitude is at practice but it’s just like you know with going in with expectation and feeling like you got your stuff together going into a game and then like you know 14 minutes left in the first period we

Got new lines and stuff it’s like good Lord it just seems like he’s kind of teetering on the edge and and not sure what to do it doesn’t seem like he’s confident in his decisions he changes them so quickly and then to have that happen in that game like you only got

Two games left in the next two weeks you got to be ready you got to have your energy levels High you got to be prepared and you got to empty the tank both of those games you’re playing one of the best teams in the National Hockey League a very well-rounded um club that

That complements each other and kind of has everything going for them especially defensively you think you would be going okay we get a break coming up here we’re professionals we get paid a lot of money we’re in this market we have not been doing great the last two weeks we got

Sammy back here trying to put some building blocks together and then you come out with a lazy ass dick around not back jacking looping and shooting who cares type of attitude I’d lose my goddamn marbles I would have lost my marbles on this group a long

Time ago and it’s that Primadonna like I don’t have to work hard you know I I can’t point my finger at Austin Matthews no ever with the goal Pace that he’s on but the other guys you sure can and I mean Austin yeah you can get 65 goals

This year but like you are the franchise tag on this team are you going to be the guy that doesn’t back check are you going to be the guys to play Lazy the last couple huge games before the playoff break you got to be the guy

Leading the charge you got to be the guy setting the tone you got to be the guys that guys look to and say I gotta be like him you know you know it brings me to yarma yoger I went to Philadelphia right after he left and like that guy

Was like 40 years old and you know there’s guys like Braden Shen out there who just you know yoger has the ice before practice on his own where he’s got his weight vest and weighted ankles on then he does practice then he stays out there for like 45 minutes after

Practice just working on and every one of those young guys could not get off the ice until he did how could you justify it right yeah Austin Matthews being the leader of this team and and that guy for the for years to come here

In a game like that how do you be lazy how do you justify being lazy don’t you hate getting picked apart by guys like us don’t you don’t you dislike being you know this the guy that says you’re not good enough and you’re onedimensional like why wouldn’t you just at least have

Your effort level there and Mitch Marner goes without saying so disappointing in that faction that during that game they did that but I want to reiterate they got the win they got the W it wasn’t pretty but they found a way to win against a very good team so I mean at

The end of the day you got to hang your hat on the two points yeah it’s incredible to me how much the narrative changes if they lose that game even in OT right like I I it just it’s inexplicable to me Rosie watching the first half of that

Hockey game and they’re going to use and maybe it’s not even them people are going to be like they the dreaded first game back from the four game Western Road Trip like dude Winnipeg was ready to play that hockey game like it was bur in the saddle let’s let’s play Winnipeg

Jets hockey and the Leafs are playing like it was a vacation in in Cancun man like I I was this close I was this close to calling the police department here in Toronto and and reporting a heist like Willie neander is playing like a $6 million player like

What has happened I know it’s a small sample size two weeks but this guy three weeks ago was controlling a hockey game he gets paid and all of a sudden he’s resorted back to the same that lease fans have gone crazy about in the past like he has glimpses where it’s

Like oh my goodness he also has had way more lapses in the last three weeks than he had the entirety of the uh the beginning 35 games of the season it’s scary to me man it is scary to me that you just committed that much money to this

Guy well I mean people people don’t like Leaf’s fans because they become negative nothing’s ever good enough they flip-flop one day we’re building statues the next day we want to tear it down to the studs I get that but I’m sorry that’s what this team gives

You that’s why it is like we have such highs where we look like if we play like that every night we can’t be beaten and then we have such lows where it’s like does anyone have pride who’s in control of this thing is there any accountability in there what’s the guys’

Commitment level to this team that was embarrassing and you look at William neander and the way he just took off this year was a stud a force to be reckoned with every single night his consistency was incredible gets paid and I’m sorry but are we not supposed to

Talk about that are we Noto is it just a coincidence that he just wh and how many games has it been since he signed there it’s been enough to make a comment about it he has gone Mia the second the pen touched paper and there’s a game last

Night where he could have taken control he could have been the force he could have been the leader he could have swung the momentum in there and got everyone behind him and rolling those lines properly he he hasn’t shown me even a flash of what he had the first 35 games

And it just so happens to fall on the day that he puts pen to paper the very next game he was a ghost and has been so since and we’re not supposed to talk about that because the one glaring thing about signing that contract which I think everyone agreed you have to sign

Him you can’t lose him he’s proven like what do you let the guy go that gives you that you can’t the only thing we were worried about was he’s got a bit of a habit of kind of you know getting a little lazy when he doesn’t need to be

And he can get a chip on his shoulder and have an Fu in his game and just light the tits off the league like he did but he’s also capable of being laxad daac out there and I’m sorry to say maybe it’s a huge coincidence but all we

Can do is talk about what’s happening and he’s been a ghost since he signed that contract which is just mind blowing yeah I love you because you’re real man it’s truth and I know jaavan in the chat right now is saying relax Nick but the the sample size is big enough where it’s

Like man like how do you go from that to this where you’re inconsistent you’re so bang on a game like that this is why we pay you 11 and a half sheets per season or we’re about to it’s because you’re a game breaker you you you take over

Hockey games like go watch Nathan McKinnon dude that guy’s on a different planet right now where every night it’s like three points Four Points four goals like and I understand Maybe it’s an anomaly of a season like he’s going to win his heart Trophy this season but

Still you you have to notice guys like that when you’re paying these guys that much money especially in specifically in games like that you have to notice them and I just haven’t really noticed neander much since he signed that extension maybe it’s a sheer coincidence obviously I will give him the benefit of

The doubt there’s a lot of pressure now to perform after signing said contract but I’m just calling it how it is and I I think it’s fair to say that Rosie I really do you know I’m trying to be my best I think we play both sides but it’s

Fair to call out right now yeah I’m not I’m not going back on the signing I think you got to do it it’s what needs to be done and you know he proved that he you know with his play that he commanded that and put them in a

Position where they had to pay him that’s fantastic but I we do a show on the Maple Leafs every single day are Are you seriously gonna say that we’re not we’re not going to touch that let’s just not touch that let’s not let’s not bring up the fact that immediately what is it

What has it been like seven games or six games or whatever since he signed that thing around that area not one time has he been a standout not one time has he been the dominant guy on the score sheet where almost every single game before

That he was are you telling me we can’t talk about that I’m sorry I’m not doing my job if I’m not saying how about this this is a this is kind of a little bit of a you know a a shot of exactly what we didn’t want to happen the one worry

We had not saying it’s come true but uh anytime now here anytime here Willie you want to do what you were doing before you signed that contract would be awesome but not happening right now so maybe that turns around but the one thing I will say is that was a game

Where you know oftentimes the Leafs would you know say out chance a guy or outshoot them a team and then just get into oh you do what a goal gets called back or something rather you can’t get the power plays that night and you go into

Overtime and you just lose it on kind of a weird one like just devastating they got the two points they found out the two points this was a team where we thought we were going to have to have our best we won without our best and

While it’s not the way you would draw it up it’s not what we think this team’s going to go forward with and have success with but they did not have their best and they got two points against a very good hockey team proven good hockey team so on the positive side of things

You can say that hey found a way to win it wasn’t a weird it wasn’t a game that you’d traditionally want to be in or or expect this team to be in but they got two points without their best I mean you can’t you can’t argue that fact either

And I think that’s why you know it’s nice to have a different look at uh at a show today because usually it’s the same old and that was just a an off the off the grid game which you know will take the two points no question

Let’s not bury the lead either uh the big story ilas samsonov uh it just it’s incredible to me again we’re talking about a guy on January 1 was put on waivers and he was pretty much out of sight out of mind and now like three weeks later whatever it is is he’s a

Talk of the Town they’re chanting his name it’s so Toronto but this guy deserves his flowers I love the post game last night it’s the ultimate story of perseverance the sample size now three uh starts since coming back 21 and0 1.31 944 one shut out but dude he was unbelievable in that game

Specifically in the first period where was a complete no-show from the home side he’s the only reason why they won that game last night yeah the score would have been different and they had Leafs had no offense no power play to speak of and holy smokes did they get

The chances right I mean yeah they’re getting all the calls and you’d think that uh you’d think that the Jets were going to get a a peeper there they were on they were due for one it was going to go the other way and they get another one the Leafs like could not

Capitalize on anything kind of you know a bit alarming when that’s supposed to be your bread and butter when you got 60 million bucks on the first unit power play you’d think that you’d be working it around having chances out your ass they had nothing going

And when you look at it close the effort level wasn’t there hence being benched on the power play these these Stars so that’s frustrating to see without question but Sammy absolutely bailed them out that’s the third start in a row that this guy has had a like a game that

You can rely on a game that makes you feel comfortable and safe and you know from where that guy was at the beginning of the season I don’t know what’s going on with this guy like he’s a first rounder poten out the ass couldn’t quite find it in Washington we signed him last

Year everyone’s thinking why are we taking other teams Reclamation projects He looks fantastic I mean him and him and Murray were switch hitting it last year like who do we play like then if one guy had a little bit of a hiup Time the other guy was out out his ass they

Switched hit fantastically he kind of comes in has a bit of a sophomore slump this season why did he start like that I don’t know his head wasn’t in his confidence was shattered um you give him some time off some extra work you know he says the right things goes out there

Again gets shelled like doesn’t have it to the point where you can’t put him in the crease put him down to the Marley’s where he doesn’t even play or practice really it was just like a I don’t know like a a mental Retreat a reset something of that nature and it

Works he comes back we put him in after finally the guy the third Stringer that we were lucky to have holds Us in games and gets us some points and keeps us in it starts to feel a little bit of the effects of of the Run and starts to you

Know maybe ease off a bit K we’re going to Sammy this is basically make or break Sammy if he has the same type of uh game that he’s had all year and he doesn’t have it and he’s got no confidence and you know he lets in some stinkers and he

He loses the game that’s it for that guy in the maple Le for uniform man I mean that’s it for him and holy he did the complete off he did exactly what you could have possibly hoped for he has stood on his head for three straight

Games most recently a shut out in a game where the guys in front of him aren’t doing screw all so fantastic to see him back I really like Sammy I think he can be a fantastic goenda itude I think he’s fantastic man I’m a big Sammy fan and to see him this

Resurgence I it’s it’s as good as you could possibly have asked for to me it’s good news all around from all perspectives uh number one the trade deadlines approaching on March 8th they’re going to have a uh conversation to be had they have three goalies and two roster positions unless you want to

Hold three goalies on a roster makes no sense in my world and number two they’re winning games with him right so I think it’s a win-win I mean I wouldn’t be shocked at all if I’d continue buttering up samsonov and hopefully he continues to play well and he’s a trade candidate

And you can free up some cap like we all know the conversations to be had if they do end up buying at the trade deadline 17 games before March 8th is like how do you create cap space well there’s an option right there it’s positive news like that’s all I can draw there’s

Nothing negative I can draw from this story and and his mental health is obviously a big story too it’s great to see him back in the right place he’s not flying around in there it just to me it makes no sense how three weeks ago this

Guy looked like a Timbit goalie now all of a sudden he can stop a puck again like it’s insane to me well it’s that position man it’s it’s so volatile and I mean I I’ve never played it before but you know there’s certain things out there that you can just lose like golf

Is one of them I mean the the the best golfer in the world can go out there and shoot shoot 64 one day and then can shoot 74 the next day like how does that happen it’s just the way it is like sometimes it’s just not there and you

Can’t force it things just aren’t working and I think I aen that a lot to the the goal tending position too sometimes just from what you can see and you know I’ve I’ve had aund goalies that have been on my team who I watch every single day and you know the spotlights

Always on them because they’re the only one in that position through games and there’s only one at each end in practices and you see him every single Le day and you know what they’re like and you can see their attitude and their confidence rise and fall and when that

When that leaves you man that is a difficult position I mean when nothing’s going right and you can’t find it you lose your confidence the pucks just fill the net and it gets worse and worse and it seems like the harder these guys try the worse it gets and then on

The other side of that coin sometimes when they are hot they are so hot like they’re always in position it’s effortless the Puck’s always hitting them they have this confidence where it’s just like how is how is the puck going to do anything but hit me I’m

Everywhere and they just shine so it’s an odd position man but you know it’s not it’s not unique to Samy these things happen and to go up and down like that certainly we we break it down and dissect it every day but it’s not new it

Is a big difference from his bad to his good but that is what happens out there and all you can do is hope that he’s found it this confidence is real and it’s going to keep going and he’s going to have a hiccup here if he continues to

Play where he doesn’t steal the game it’s not like this is Magic and it’s about not making a huge deal when that does happen keeping your confidence and realizing the position and and not being able to go back down that road again where he was and staying out of there so

That that’s the next test for Sammy is when things aren’t going perfectly which is going to happen sooner than later um how he responds to that anyway slice it uh very positive fantastic story that they got some saves from their their goal tender ilas samsonov Nick Robertson

I thought was great last night again Sheldon Keefe obviously loved him he logged a career high 1708 sets up the winner from Austin Matthews four shots on goal and we talked about this going into the game especially without Tyler bruzi not in the lineup those guys on

The left side like NIS and Company and Robertson specifically in Holberg too had to step up and I thought Robertson had a great game and and I commend Sheldon key for rewarding him right he played a lot in the third period and he got some shifts in OT and obviously

Leads to the winner here yeah for sure looked solid he was kind of everywhere I like his work ethic I mean a young guy that’s trying to prove himself and and trying to say no no remember that blue trip Prospect you always thought I was I am that guy um his opportunities maybe

If you talk to him he he’s probably gonna say he hasn’t got um the opportunities that he’s looking for up and down the miners playing not playing scratched a whole bunch who’s he playing with I’m sure he’d have something to say about that um but on a night where those

Big boys aren’t going like where’s Willie where’s ‘s Johnny I mean Austin stood out a little bit Marner no like you know a couple lazy shifts too enough to piss ke off real bad to make a statement and so there there you are with Nick Robertson here’s your minutes

Here’s your ice time here’s your opportunity and he worked his nuts off I I was I saw him all over the place and that that last shift in overtime I mean he’s right in the spot for Matthews to feed him he would have bang that home I think huge overtime winner huge night

For Nick Robertson catches the skate of a guy he stays on it gets it back to Matthews almost gets another chance and just I don’t know if he stiffened up his hands there just it was a little ahead of him I lost it but manages to get

The puck back then the Poise he had along the half wall to you know that’s that’s tough in in overtime those two two on o can happen any time and he Bounce It Off the boards gains possession gets it to the right guy gets the hell off makes a really smart

Professional play for a young player that was unselfish smart and uh you know well thought out and took a lot of skill and composure to do it and gets in on the winner man he stood out for sure and you know if this guy’s confidence starts getting high and he starts getting some

Trust to the coach this guy could make a difference on the lineup and he’s he’s showing that right now the pro Robertson crowd on social media had a full Ober erect last night like they were fired up it was boner alert on Twitter last night

For Robertson I get it man like if you can get production from that guy especially a salary cap team that’s a that’s a bonus isn’t it 100% that’s what you’re looking for you want to go deep in the in the playoffs man look at every team that wins the Stanley Cup they have

Guys on entry-level deals stand up big time they have depth guys that stand up big time and you are not gonna win a Stanley Cup with Mitch Marner and Austin Matthews being really fancy and really high octane offense that’s not GNA win you a Stanley Cup that could certainly

Help you win the game sevens and and get you on the board early and all those things but you got to have a deep roster with lots of guys doing lots of different things and a guy like Nick Robertson standing up and showing that he’s a stud on an entry-level deal is uh

Is a big thing that these guys need for sure meantime the following interview is brought to you by our friends over a Battlegrounds ax throwing unlock the ultimate birthday party team building event or have a great date night with her significant other to find a location and book an outing today go to

Battlegrounds.com that’s batlgrounds dcom as you bring in the one and only for the fourth period in SiriusXM NHL Network radio it’s NHL Insider David panota what’s going on Dave we do Dave so we’re going to try to connect one more time here with Dave and get his audio and sorts here but uh

Looking forward to discussing obviously Sheldon Keef and all that and his utilization his deployment of some of these players um on the roster but yeah Nick Robertson is a name that certainly came to the Forefront last night and you need those type of games right

Rosie yeah I mean it’s just just such an odd game I think I tweeted something like a very unley game or something like that but I mean it’s nice that we’re used to seeing this such I mean that the wins are the same the losses are the

Same it gets to be a bit of a marago round following this team and that that was a game that was straight out of uh straight out of outer space like I didn’t see that coming um was in shock the whole time the z z like and you look

At the amount of times that this team has scored goals I think it’s like 193 games with a goal where the next closest at Colorado is like SE 80 or something and then the next one’s like 30 in a row like this team is heads and shoulders above anyone

In the league I don’t know what the actual record is but uh they got to be closing up on it because they just never have a game like that where no one’s scored and I mean talk about a snoozefest from like the 2000s where it’s z00 overtime like come on someone

Scor a goddamn goal but you know again I gotta hang my hat on the fact that they didn’t have their best stuff and got two points against a huge team if you would have talked about that on Monday and and said what’s coming up down the barrel

Here on Wednesday big game I don’t I think you would have taken that it’s a z zero overtime win you think well Sammy must be playing good they must be playing good defense or whatever it is but they got the two points that’s what’s important it is and uh looking

Forward to what transpires of course on Saturday I think we’re good to go with today’s guest Dave Pena Dave can you hear us yep I got you sorry Boys Hey technology let’s go baby thank you so much for doing this uh how close is Sheldon Keefe to a nervous breakdown in your

Opinion in my opin opinion or your opinion your opinion might be a little different um nine for me buddy yeah uh look they they something I mean at some point eventually we’ll we’ll have to give it nice to get the win last night um and you know listening to you

Guys a little bit earlier with respect to skill versus the physicality tied to the game I mean there’s only so much you can do with the assets you’re provided I I think he’s you know a good coach um I just don’t think the the recipe that he’s working with the ingredients that

He’s working with um is going to look first of all can I you know raise some questions and some eyebrows um but I I just don’t think that the pieces that he’s been dealt and the cards that he’s been dealt if you put those all together um it makes for some questionable hockey

Every once in a while given given the status that that the team is at yeah what what do you think the answer is I mean we’re sitting here every day breaking it down obviously this is a a very heavy topend team with some defensive problems they’ve gone through their their goal tending

Problems is if it’s more of the same the rest of the year what do you call this team do what do you want them to do at the deadline can they get it done in the playoffs like what what is your thought process on where they’re at right now

And what are they going to do in the future they’re a nice team and that’s kind of how I would categorize them um look there there’s no denying the skill set that they’ve got um but it’s the other intangibles that have to come into play that we all know and you guys just

Talked about those are what win you championships so if if I mean it comes from up top frankly um and you know tree hasn’t had that much of a window since coming in there he’s not going to tear things down right out of the gate um he’s got to

Assess what he has and you know he’s been looking he’s been calling he’s been making um you know inquiries and seeing what’s out there both on the defensive side of things and also so in kind of the mid to bottom six um but you know speaking to people around the league it

Hasn’t sounded like the Leafs are overly eager to make a move right now um and and aren’t willing to give up the pieces necessary to to get you know Chris tanv for example um what that means to me is that he’s continuing and management is continuing to kind of sit back assess

What they’ve got and kind of figure out if if now is the time to go all in and whether it’s posturing and it’s a negotiation tactic by TR living and and the staff right now still a little bit early early to tell um but based on the conversations around the league I don’t

Get the sense that they feel at least up top that this is their year they’re not a player or two away from you know chasing a Stanley Cup legitimately there are a few other cosmetic changes that are going to need to happen um and it doesn’t sound like they’re there yet so

For me this is a nice team they’re a good regular season team um but you need those intangibles come playoff time that every team and every championship team over the last however um team number of years has had so I’m conflicted on this guys because I I think the easy rebuttal

Is like the Florida Panthers they were dog for 70 games last year all of a sudden they find their groove and they go all the way to the Stanley Cup Final like why can’t the Leafs do that and that’s why I’m conflicted why can’t a switch just flip with 15 games left and

Then go on a crazy run like why can’t they don’t have a Matthew kachuck a Sam Bennett Carter Veri um radus was part of that group so on and so on again the the and intangible pieces like those those balls to the wall I’m going to do whatever the

Hell it takes I’m going to run you over like a M Truck caliber player that fits your top six and that complement your top six they they don’t have that and that’s not the end all and Beall you have to have that blend they have some of those pieces they

Don’t have the other pieces not yet um and I think that the thought process was Tyler berui was going to be one of those pieces that Max doy was going to be one of those pieces um and and they’ve had good spurts throughout the season but I

Don’t think the physicality is there and to me honestly guys I wonder if that comes from the system the structure of the coaching staff maybe they don’t want that type of system in place I don’t I I don’t know I’m not I’m not specifically sure on that they have the some of the

Pieces to do it but I haven’t seen much in terms of what those intangible pieces that guys like berui and DOI bring um and you brought in Ryan Reeves for a reason they don’t want to play them well I was gonna say pick the words

Out of my mouth I was gonna say you know if you go back to the summertime we know we knew what the what the holes were and what we were trying to fill and and you go out there and I mean oh we got berzi

We get DOI and it’s like you know people that blame tree leaving right now it’s like he went and did what he was asked he he put names on paper that are quality names and then they come here and they do absolutely nothing so H like

He doesn’t have a crystal ball how do you predict that Tyler verzi is is gonna be a ghost he’s not he’s not talking he he doesn’t have any confidence he’s not chirping off he’s not a rat he’s not in the fight he’s just kind of there with a

Blank look on his face every single night I’m like where is the where is the flare in this guy I thought that he’s like one of these young guys that’s coming up and being this dominant style of play and it’s just been non-existent so how do you put that on tree living it

Go it’s in the law if you ask me yeah absolutely like these guys came in with you needed those types of players that have that fire under your ass kind of mentality from the drop of the puck till the final whistle and we haven’t you’re right we haven’t we haven’t seen that so

Far this season not consistently they been some spurts here and there but on a on a game- to game basis it it hasn’t been there and so for me yeah you you can’t predict that that’s not a tree issue that’s not Shanahan that’s not the rest of the Management Group um that

Comes down to in the room and and not exclusively to the guys on the ice I’ve got to think that again part of the coaching system uh that they have in place factors into how they’re performing um to me it’s not you don’t just lose that overnight you don’t just go okay

Well now I’m a part of the leaf so I guess I don’t have to play this way they signed you to bring that with you on a game to game basis and it hasn’t happened so yeah it’s in the room it’s it’s from the bench and it’s the same

Story over and over again that we’ve had the last een season several seasons now in consecutively for the Toronto Maple Leafs where’s that where’s that fire it it it always leads back to the same conversation about the same guys they want to continue to pay n laner got

His money and he like took a vacation now like we talked about this earlier a different player in the last two and a half weeks maybe just a sheer coincidence uh want to get your perspective on what happens next obviously not not to look too far ahead

John tarz is struggling right now but Mitch Marner is like the next big conversation we’re gonna have and that started percolating like a month and a half ago where do you think that direction goes they’ll start those I mean I’m sure they’ve had loose conversations to this point they’ll

Start to speed those up over the over the offseason whenever the season comes to an end he can’t just like tarz and anybody else with one more year left on their contract they can’t officially sign until July 1 an extension um but I think you learn from from what you saw

And what happened with with Willie um he he banked on himself he cashed in and I think he’s going to continue like he’s he hasn’t he hasn’t just given up um you know he’s out there he’s trying it’s maybe he’s a little snake bitten and maybe he has taken his foot a little

Bit off the gas um but I think they’ve they’ve recognized that going into next season without an extension in place for at least number 16 I I don’t think they can do that so I’m anticipating that those conversations to get heated once the summer rolls around um probably

Before July and and then see where it kind of goes from there but it’s going to be a big number um it’s going to be bigger than Willies and that’s just that’s just the nature of the Beast he’s on Pace for another 90 point season that would be either hitting 90 or being

On Pace for it because of the shorten season for six consecutive Seasons it’s hard to argue against the number especially with the cap going up um but again it’ll be it’ll be a big number he’s going to want more than neander and um the Leafs I think already understand

That do you think that this uh do you think that the Leafs and you could say dubis has put them in a position contract wise with you know the guys they draft who they bring in what they give them after their their entry-level contracts and you know it just seems

Like we’re pigeon hold right now to a whole bunch of high-end Talent that’s exactly the same and you know it’s not exactly the only thing you need to win a Stanley Cup yet you can’t really get rid of these guys you you even if you want

To the no move Clauses and stuff are going to put the ball in their Court like do you see this team being kind of you know handcuffed in a way when it comes to free agency and what and the changes that maybe need to be made in

Order to get to a Stanley Cup run look yes or no Rosie I think um look first of all they the Leafs are just kind of a little ahead of the trend where we’re going to see four or five guys on a team making eight figures um

That’s going to that’s going to continue that’s going to climb there are going to be more teams that are going to be in that boat um some teams are a little more fortunate because let’s say you know some clubs in the US have no state

Tax um so teams like Florida kind of you know Tampa they they they take advantage of it as they should it’s the loophole and good for you it is what it is um but from Toronto’s perspective look going into the summer they they’ve got a decent amount of cap space to kind of

Play with even with um you know nanders contract kicking in next season the cap is is going to go up 5% it’s anticipated and projected to go up another 5% the year after that so when you know guys like like you know Marner and tarz when

Their next deals kick in the cap will be should be is projected to be around 92 million so you’ve got you’re going to have some cap flexibility to to make additions and make moves including this off season um but you know the those guys that we’re talking about that bring

Like there’s no Matthew kachuck that’s going to be available in the summer you know not not not as an unrestricted free agent so to go after a top tier guy and have to give him you know 10 plus that that brings that physicality to it that

That you know is is that power forward with with offense off the top of my head I don’t think there are guys that are readily available as free agents going into the summer that that bring all of those elements so you have to look at at

The other pieces so to pay these four guys that much up front I still think there’s enough in the tank and in the bank um for them to to make the right pieces I don’t have the full free agent list in front of me right now but um you

Know there there are going to be some players that are available that you know bring that that that gritty element to it that can contribute as part of a top six um so I don’t think they’re fully handcuffed uh but I mean you know with with relatively limited cap space in

Terms of the overall Spectrum it does make you know some decisions a little more challenging than others because you’ve got to allocate that money to one or two guys versus let’s say four or five yeah spoiler alert there’s not much out there in terms of free agency but I

Just wanted to ask you like leading up to the deadline there’s still 17 games remaining for the the Leafs as you talked about earlier it makes the most sense to take a wait and see approach with this team but are there some players you’ve identified that could

Make a lot of sense I know tanv name’s been out there for a couple months is there anybody else who you think could make sense for this team I think there’s interest in Shawn Walker um in Philadelphia um lbushkin again out out in Anaheim Walker’s an interesting one I

Know they’ve had conversations um I I know they spoke about um both Walker and Nick seeler um I think there was an offer that was presented that was rejected um I think there was an offer on the table for for Chris sov and I don’t think and I I know Calgary

Rejected that one too so it’s not that like the Leafs have certainly identified pieces that they want to go after and they’re also looking up front they’re also as I mentioned earlier mid six um you know mid to bottom six is is another area that they want to improve upon uh

But you’ve got to be economically sound to do it they don’t have a ton of cap space they don’t have much cap space at all so anything impactful and significant is going to not only require most likely retention like in tan of situation that Calgary would effectively

Have to eat half that deal um but they’re also going to have to take back money or you get a third party involved and you got to pay extra and I don’t get the sense that the Leafs are in that position right now or have that type of appetite right now to give

Up too much they don’t have a second round pick um assets are are limited you know teams that like some of their young players like Minon for example they don’t want to part with um and you’re not giving that up for a rental either especially under the circumstances in which you’re

Playing right now so the leaps are looking um but I think this is a due diligence type of process collect all the info all right here’s a little offer let’s see if you’ll accept it I don’t think they’re serious yet it’s fair enough but I I still think it’s a

Definition of insanity like they had the perfect trade chip at the deadline his name was Willie neander and they’re just going about this the wrong way in my opinion you just continue to do the same year after year after year and that’s why you continue to fail but nevertheless we’ll continue this

Conversation next time we speak thanks so much for this Dave you got it thanks boys thanks Dave Dave Pena the fourth period in sirusxm NHL Network radio I it’s always fascinating to get outside perspective you and I Rosie do a show on a daily basis and I I just I can’t

Commit to like paying those guys like I and they’re going to do it but there’s so many on this roster it’s like why wouldn’t you want to allocate some of that money if it’s a JT if it’s a Marner now and it just doesn’t get the feel

They’re going to do that I feel like they’re gonna be like hey Mitch Marner you want 12 and a half here’s 12 and a half in an eight-year deal and we’re g to try to win with you like is it not Insanity to you too well I know

But put yourself in TR living’s position where he’s making phone calls getting a sense of what’s out there and if you don’t get like to put that together takes a it’s not like he has four different options on things to do with William neander he he might have like

One and a half sign him or maybe this team’s kicking the tires and could maybe take them off your hands but what is your return and what would be the response in Toronto to making this move and all of a sudden you’re known that is a label making move for for tree living

To say you got rid of William nander when he was hotter than a fraking pistol he had just hit his stride he showed you he said he wants to be here he put up X number of points and X number of games and you traded him for what you know

That’s that’s a very likely scenario because it’s not like you can just go out there and be like oh well there’s this uh Nathan McKinnon type player right here that A team’s willing to deal for William NE like no man it’s it yeah you’re only as you’re only able to do

What is on the table and I I just don’t think that he could you know work the phones enough to find a deal that makes sense where it’s like yes we used this blue CH Blue Chip player in William neander who’s playing well we moved him

Out to someone who gave us the world in return everything we needed everything we asked for and made our team well-rounded we had a a stud leader power forward and a real stud stay-at-home rugged defenseman for William NE like who’s gonna give you that it that’s what you would have made

A deal for and I would have been all for it but it it has to be on the table I just don’t think that stuff’s on the table these days and hence why you’re you only have one option to sign them and you know they’ve got themselves in

This position where you have you know these 10 plus million dollar guys who are all the same type of player who all can put up Wicked points but you keep running into the same problems of having a really lopsided team and you know and you can’t really fix your problems

Because you pay all those guys the same amount of money and when it’s a game where you know your big skill and flashy offense isn’t going to be there holy smokes do you look like garbage and people are you you lose ugly games and people are pissed off and guys like us

Are saying this is unacceptable and then you’re gonna have your games where all those guys are firing all cylinders and it’s a highlight show and it’s just it’s the it’s more of the same and because you’re painted yourself into that corner I don’t see an easy way out

Of it I would love Tove move Mitch Marner and his his prowess and his reputation and his ability to someone who really needs that but you know it would have to be one of these Blockbuster three team deals where some Picks and Prospects are moving around

And some retained salary cap and a type of deal where you look at and you go I can’t even keep track of how this all works but the big boy that went away you got everything you desperately needed in return and that’s the only way I see

This team getting out of you know this onedimensional funk that they have been in for years and years where it’s just not a team built for the playoffs and they consistently don’t get it done in the playoffs for that reason and people get mad at that but it’s a reality man

This team’s not a power not a a playoff Powerhouse they’re just not it’s like uh they’re chasing their tail and that’s why the frustration today I just watch games like the Winnipeg won I know they won I’m trying to stay positive I’m very positive at times but sometimes I watch

That and I’m like they’re nowhere close to to to the objective and that’s to win a Stanley Cup the batan wrap-up is presented by b.ca the game starts now 19 plus please play responsibly I like uh the Islanders to beat the Montreal Canadians tonight at the Bell Center uh

Patrick W now with the AL making another return there so I think they take care of business and I’ll throw this out there just for you I like the Johnny goodro shop prop Columbus visiting the Calgary Flames tonight he has two assists in three games so far against

Calgary I think he’s going to be horny to score score tonight yeah why not those uh those little story lines tend to pan out a lot you think he’d be buzzing I’m sure he will uh I’m sure he will very he he’ll be very well aware of the situation

He’ll want to stick it up the Flames ass as much as humanly possible so I’m sure he will putting the hammer down shooting all kinds of rubber at the net the shot prop I wonder if it’s Juiced or not but it’s a it’s a good idea to go to I like

It and Patty W coming back to the Bell Center you said oh baby that’ll be fun man lots lots of history in that City obviously we were in Jasper when that went down over the weekend I’m still stunned that Patty W is now the head coach of the New York Islanders but uh

You’re not going to be here tomorrow you’re not going to be here on Monday we get closer and closer to the allstar break and a lot of festivities for uh our family the nation Network family Leaf’s morning take as well and we’re going to do some stuff some live shows

As well so stay tuned for the latest on that but uh just what’s your breakdown what are you looking forward to over the weekend because next we speak will be on Tuesday so there’ll be another game and then they’ll be on their biwe Allstar break yeah interesting man I mean I want them

Right now to be analyzing last night and I mean if you can play like that and pull off the W I mean if you can get a a two game sweep against the Winnipeg Jets going into the All-Star break I mean what more could you ask for I hope

They’re in in major preparation mode for Saturday night um find a way to beat this team I don’t think it’s going to be easy I think they’re going to be you know going back to their Barn they’re going to be excited they’re going to be mad they didn’t win that game they

Probably thought they deserved it and they’re going to be a very hard test for the Maple Leafs and you know when you go into a big break it is such a different attitude to do it after a big win than it is to do it after a disappointing

Loss so that’s what I’m looking forward to this week get that W on Saturday and then you can kind of have a little reset focus on the All-Star Game have some fun some guys will take off to the Bahamas and be with their wives and children and

It’ll be a great little reset for everybody but it’s nice to do it going in with a W it’s uh very leafy like again you can’t lose say the fact that it was laurant basis who played for Winnipeg and almost shut them out and I wouldn’t be stunned at all if the Leafs

Come out against the vzna favorite right now and Conor huk on Saturday lay four five on this guy you just wouldn’t I mean that’s been the story with this team against the L tier goalies we’ll call them they’re not as good as when they are against the best goalies in the

Planet they they’ve they’ve lit up the good goalies I mean that’s not the issue with this team but uh nonetheless looking forward to we to to seeing uh what happens over the weekend in Winnipeg Rosie thanks to this we’ll talk on Tuesday buddy you bet good weekend Go

Leafs Go Big Win we are positive don’t worry about that everybody we’re happy with the w let’s get another one it’s okay we had uh we cover things from all avenues I should mention as well Matt Lin of daily face off will fill in as my co-host tomorrow so make sure you tune

Us at 11: a.m Eastern Time everybody in the chat you guys are fantastic given different perspectives I’ve been reading uh quite a bit on what you guys are saying and you hit the nail on the head for the most part at the leaf Nation 401 on YouTube where you can subscribe Leaf

Morning take wh you find your podcast as well thank you to producer Vic and thank you to Our Guest today and Dave Pena the fourth period in Series XM NHL Network radio that’s Jay Rosel I’m Nick alberga talk tomorrow take care make sure to check out more of our

Content right here on the Leafs Nation YouTube page we got long form interviews we got Clips you got epic rants by Jay Roso we simply have it all and don’t forget you can find out much more at the leafnation tocom thanks so much for watching